Moral Question

[bigbear62040]

I am a 4th degree Knight and know that Catholics are to have nothing to do with the Freemasons. I found out that our council is supporting a golf tournament being put on by the Shriners. I told our Faithful Navigator that I thought that this was wrong. I told him that the Shriners are Freemasons. He seemed unaware of this fact. He said that we (the council) have been supporting this golf tournament every year. Was I wrong in bringing up with him? I know the Shriners do good work, I used to be one. In fact if it weren’t for the Shriners , my niece would be in a wheelchair by now. Good works aside, the Shriners are Freemasons. There’s a saying: Not all Masons are Shriners, but all Shriners are Masons. Any opinions and/or advice is greatly appreciated. I know there thousands of threads dealing with the Masons, but I couldn’t find one to cover this.

 

[tee_eff_em]

I am a 4th degree Knight and know that Catholics are to have nothing to do with the Freemasons.

:twocents: This seems a little extreme to me.

Catholics are not to seek, accept, nor maintain *membership *in the Masons (nor other organizations at odds with Church teaching), but I know of no Catholic teaching or direction that Catholics should have nothing to do with the Freemasons.

I found out that our council is supporting a golf tournament being put on by the Shriners. I told our Faithful Navigator that I thought that this was wrong. I told him that the Shriners are Freemasons. He seemed unaware of this fact. He said that we (the council) have been supporting this golf tournament every year. Was I wrong in bringing up with him? I know the Shriners do good work, I used to be one. In fact if it weren’t for the Shriners , my niece would be in a wheelchair by now. Good works aside, the Shriners are Freemasons. There’s a saying: Not all Masons are Shriners, but all Shriners are Masons. Any opinions and/or advice is greatly appreciated. I know there thousands of threads dealing with the Masons, but I couldn’t find one to cover this.

SK tee
PGK, DD

 

[Sister_G]

May God bless you! You did do the right thing in saying something to your brother Knight! The K of C should have NOTHING to do with the Shriners! It is like voting for Obama if you are Catholic, the two don’t mix!

 

[tee_eff_em]

The K of C should have NOTHING to do with the Shriners!

Care to justify that assertion?

tee

 

[apromisemade]

Frankly I think it’s not a big deal. It’s not like you’re funding them holding a public seminar to express their beliefs in. It’s a golf tournament for heavens sake.

Last I checked that’s something a lot of different people with a lot of different beliefs participate in. I’m a member of a advocacy/activism group and one of my friends on it with me is a strong conservative and I am a liberal, another girl on it is an atheist and I, obviously, am a christian. But our joint membership of a group that advocates for the release of child soldiers in Africa has nothing to do with any of that. I’m not about to abandon fighting for a cause just because the person sitting next to me, who believes in the same cause, doesn’t believe in a certain welfare program.

And this all seems like an extreme example compared to what you’re talking about. Like I said, it’s not like you all are even promoting an idea or pursuing a cause (unless it’s a fundraiser or something), you’re putting on a golf tournament!

Two people don’t have to see eye to eye to enjoy a day at the golf course together.

 

[judechild]

I disagree with Sister G, and think that tee eff em has a better thought-out view. We, as Catholics certainly should not accept membership in the Masons (at least at this time), but there’s no reason why we can’t work with each other for the common good. If I was starving in the desert and a mason came along and offered me food (and hopefully a lift) I wouldn’t turn it down because he was a mason. Catholics and Masons can and should be working together in the area of humanitarianism; Masons **do **do a lot of good.

 

[Riseof_Rome]

:twocents: This seems a little extreme to me.

Catholics are not to seek, accept, nor maintain *membership *in the Masons (nor other organizations at odds with Church teaching), but I know of no Catholic teaching or direction that Catholics should have nothing to do with the Freemasons.

SK tee
PGK, DD

I am sorry my friend, but this is false. JP 2 re-affirmed Pope Clement XIII’s declaration that Catholics are to have NOTHING to do with freemasonry. Under threat of excommunication. Poster, you did the correct thing in bringing this to the light, it is a tough decision whether to go against your superiors and tradition or not, but in this case I would advise to sit this one out.

Further reading:
thebulletin.us/articles/2009/05/13/news/nation/doc4a0ab09762381954958350.txt

 

[Riseof_Rome]

If I was starving in the desert and a mason came along and offered me food (and hopefully a lift) I wouldn’t turn it down because he was a mason.

I can assure you this has never happened, so your example does not hold. This is not a life and death situation, he has the opportunity to not participate. Catholics are to have nothing to do with freemasonry. I am sorely disappointed to see how misinformed my fellow Catholics are on this topic. Freemasonry was initially developed to rid the world of any set religion, it supports religious pacifism. This organization was developed in direct opposition to Catholicism, and is know to be, in some orders, Satanic.

Why should we show any cooperation with this type of organization? I advise to stay away from this at all costs.

 

[Sister_G]

Care to justify that assertion?

tee

The two ideologies are diametrically opposed. If you knew more about the Masons this would not be a question. I am sorry to seem short, but I have other responsibilities and I don’t have time for the whole explanation. I know all about the front of “good works,” but even the devil will allow some good if he knows that he will take more souls away from God through deception! This may seem strong but when you play with evil it is very dangerous!

People are welcome to disagree with me. But we will see in the end…

 

[tee_eff_em]

I am sorry my friend, but this is false. JP 2 re-affirmed Pope Clement XIII’s declaration that Catholics are to have NOTHING to do with freemasonry. Under threat of excommunication. Poster, you did the correct thing in bringing this to the light, it is a tough decision whether to go against your superiors and tradition or not, but in this case I would advise to sit this one out.

Further reading:
thebulletin.us/articles/2009/05/13/news/nation/doc4a0ab09762381954958350.txt

Obviously, I am ignorant. Can you please point me to where the Servant of God, John Paul II, directed that *Catholics are to have NOTHING to do with freemasonry *(I did not find any such statement at the link you suggest)? Thank you.

tee

 

[musicality]

Its absolutely ridiculous to assert that Catholics should not associate with Freemasons.
If we apply the concept behind this assertion, that one should not associate with those who have beliefs which contradict Catholic teaching, we not associate with anyone outside the Church! Clearly, it is absolutely ridiculous to suggest that we should not associate with those who have different beliefs…

 

[bigbear62040]

It’s not like you’re funding them holding a public seminar to express their beliefs in.

That’s the problem. I was taught that we as Catholics aren’t supposed to fund or sponsor the Masons in any way. We are sponsoring an “enemy” (that may be too strong a term but it’s all I could think of) in one of their functions. I admit that I’ve only been a Catholic for 3 years and I am still learning. But this is a topic that was drilled into me when I first started. I don’t want to get anybody mad at me on here. As I said before, I was a Mason and Shriner. I didn’t advance very far in either. In the Masons, I was only 3rd degree for 4 years and I was only a Shriner for two years. Now that I’ve left them, I really don’t miss them. What’s really weird is that after I left them, I learned some disturbing things about them and I begin to think that the only reason I stayed with them is because of my friends I had there.

 

[KyivAndrew]

Boy aren’t you all lucky. Here is a thread specifically on the question of Freemasonry and its incompatibility with Catholicism. It all started off when a Catholic former Freemason steeped in Masonic ritual left when he finally understood what the higher degree Scottish Rite included in its ritual. The various Popes’ Condemnations are all there. It just seems every time the thread is put to sleep and what is wrong with the ritual in Freemasonry is concluded, a new “brother” chimes in. You might have to read the thread from the beginning because I and other posters make references throughout the thread that seemed to have gotten lost in the end so it probably makes no sense starting off from the end.

So at the risk of repeating myself or someone else…Here is the thread…Good Luck…God Bless…Put it this way…It was and is a nerve racking thread and some of the posters actually bowed out from fear (of Masonry), which should not be happening on a Catholic Forum. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=330972

 

[Sister_G]

Boy aren’t you all lucky. Here is a thread specifically on the question of Freemasonry and its incompatibility with Catholicism. It all started off when a Catholic former Freemason steeped in Masonic ritual left when he finally understood what the higher degree Scottish Rite included in its ritual. The various Popes’ Condemnations are all there. It just seems every time the thread is put to sleep and what is wrong with the ritual in Freemasonry is concluded, a new “brother” chimes in. You might have to read the thread from the beginning because I and other posters make references throughout the thread that seemed to have gotten lost in the end so it probably makes no sense starting off from the end.

So at the risk of repeating myself or someone else…Here is the thread…Good Luck…God Bless…Put it this way…It was and is a nerve racking thread and some of the posters actually bowed out from fear (of Masonry), which should not be happening on a Catholic Forum. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=330972

Thank you!

 

[KyivAndrew]

Thank you!

No probs…it’s a long thread though but as I said, throughout it new info. is offered. I just find it astonishing that this subject could cause so much strain, and probably with good reason.

May God Bless.

 

[Sister_G]

No probs…it’s a long thread though but as I said, throughout it new info. is offered. I just find it astonishing that this subject could cause so much strain, and probably with good reason.

May God Bless.

God bless YOU! Yes, there is good reason!

 

[tee_eff_em]

KyivAndrew;5226928:

Boy aren’t you all lucky. Here is a thread specifically on the question of Freemasonry and its incompatibility with Catholicism. It all started off when a Catholic former Freemason steeped in Masonic ritual left when he finally understood what the higher degree Scottish Rite included in its ritual. The various Popes’ Condemnations are all there. It just seems every time the thread is put to sleep and what is wrong with the ritual in Freemasonry is concluded, a new “brother” chimes in. You might have to read the thread from the beginning because I and other posters make references throughout the thread that seemed to have gotten lost in the end so it probably makes no sense starting off from the end.

So at the risk of repeating myself or someone else…Here is the thread…Good Luck…God Bless…Put it this way…It was and is a nerve racking thread and some of the posters actually bowed out from fear (of Masonry), which should not be happening on a Catholic Forum. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=330972

Thank you!

Invoking the “[post=5226572]I don’t have the time[/post] to read that whole thread” rule, perhaps one of you could point me to the specific bit or bits where Church teaching that Catholics are to have NOTHING to do with freemasonry is revealed?

Thanks.

tee

 

[bigbear62040]

Boy aren’t you all lucky. Here is a thread specifically on the question of Freemasonry and its incompatibility with Catholicism. It all started off when a Catholic former Freemason steeped in Masonic ritual left when he finally understood what the higher degree Scottish Rite included in its ritual. The various Popes’ Condemnations are all there. It just seems every time the thread is put to sleep and what is wrong with the ritual in Freemasonry is concluded, a new “brother” chimes in. You might have to read the thread from the beginning because I and other posters make references throughout the thread that seemed to have gotten lost in the end so it probably makes no sense starting off from the end.

So at the risk of repeating myself or someone else…Here is the thread…Good Luck…God Bless…Put it this way…It was and is a nerve racking thread and some of the posters actually bowed out from fear (of Masonry), which should not be happening on a Catholic Forum. forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=330972

I didn’t mean to tick anybody off, I was just concerned about us supporting the Shriners. I am still new at this and I was just looking for advice and/or opinions, not to start a word war.

 

[Sister_G]

No worries. We are all adults here. We need to have challenge to grow and be able to defend our beliefs. I too hope that I have not offended anyone, but I have to have faith in the thought that one does not want “easy answers” to tough questions.

 

[Sister_G]

Taken from post #25 from the previously mentioned thread:

Read the words of the Popes since the beginning of masonry. They have consistently denounced masonry as being incompatible with the Catholic faith. It was Pope Pius IX who name masonry the “synagogue of Satan” in his encyclical Esti Multa.

Pope Leo XIII, who may be the Pontiff who suffered from freemasonry the most, being that he reigned during the height of Italian masonic anti-clericalism, was not shy with calling masonry what it truly is:

The satanic intent of the persecutors has been to substitute naturalism for Christianity, the worship of reason for the worship of faith, so-called independent morality for Catholic morality, and material progress for spiritual progress. (Custodi Di Quella Fede)

It is needless now to put the Masonic sects upon their trial. They are already judged; their ends, their means, their doctrines, and their action, are all known with indisputable certainty. Possessed by the spirit of Satan, whose instrument they are, they burn like him with a deadly and implacable hatred of Jesus Christ and of His work; and they endeavor by every means to overthrow and fetter it. (Dall’Alto Dell’Apostolico Seggio)

In this insane and wicked endeavor we may almost see the implacable hatred and spirit of revenge with which Satan himself is inflamed against Jesus Christ. – So also the studious endeavor of the Freemasons to destroy the chief foundations of justice and honesty, and to co-operate with those who would wish, as if they were mere animals, to do what they please, tends only to the ignominious and disgraceful ruin of the human race. (Humanum Genus)

These are not the only Papal encyclicals that speak against freemasonry. You will not find any - not one - that speaks favorably or even neutrally about this evil sect. They spread lies and half-truths and a hate for the Catholic faith and the Kingdom of God.

Catholics are still forbidden from being associated with the masons. To join or be a member of the masons would be to enter into grave sin!