More children would be dangerous after heart surgery

[huetamo1995]

Can I get a tubal ligation? I just had heart surgery Friday and another one tomorrow . I have 4 children and was infertile for years. God blessed me. I am in a situation where if I have more kids I could die and because of my meds my baby would be in danger and it would affect the baby . Doctors said no more.
In my situation what do I do. I don’t trust natural family planning because I am very irregular.
Please help

 

[1ke]

I am very sorry for your medical troubles. I am sure that is stressful.

Sterilization and contraception are intrinsically evil, that means they are never a moral option.

I encourage you to discuss your situation with your NFP instructor. If a you are not comfortable with periodic abstinence, then you may need an extended period of complete abstinence until your medical situation changes or you are more confident in your charting.

 

[Xantippe]

I am very sorry for your medical troubles. I am sure that is stressful.

Sterilization and contraception are intrinsically evil, that means they are never a moral option.

I encourage you to discuss your situation with your NFP instructor. If a you are not comfortable with periodic abstinence, then you may need an extended period of complete abstinence until your medical situation changes or you are more confident in your charting.

Yes.

And while you’re abstinent, a fertility monitor might be helpful as a sort of “cheat sheet” as to whether and when you’re ovulating. Once you know for sure what’s going on, it could give you a lot more confidence going forward.

If you’re older (mid/late 30ish and up) it’s a good idea to read up on perimenopausal NFP, which is tricky.

 

[mommy_k]

I would talk to a priest first and follow his advice.

 

[bitterhope]

Please talk to your priest about this. I’m praying for you. Three of my kids have heart problems. I know it can be scary

 

[SilverLight]

I am very sorry for your medical troubles. I am sure that is stressful.

Sterilization and contraception are intrinsically evil, that means they are never a moral option.

I encourage you to discuss your situation with your NFP instructor. If a you are not comfortable with periodic abstinence, then you may need an extended period of complete abstinence until your medical situation changes or you are more confident in your charting.

I do not view it as evil personally. If this is for medical reasons I can understand perfectly why someone would do it.

 

[SilverLight]

Can I get a tubal ligation? I just had heart surgery Friday and another one tomorrow . I have 4 children and was infertile for years. God blessed me. I am in a situation where if I have more kids I could die and because of my meds my baby would be in danger and it would affect the baby . Doctors said no more.
In my situation what do I do. I don’t trust natural family planning because I am very irregular.
Please help

Do what you feel will keep you healthy. I believe God would understand why you have done something. You are doing this to keep yourself healthy and a child would be in danger if you get pregnant. I believe the logical and safe thing to do is to get the surgery or find another alternative to it. I would do the same if I was in your situation.

 

[1ke]

I do not view it as evil personally.

The Church teaches that it is.

If this is for medical reasons I can understand perfectly why someone would do it.

No, it is not for “medical reasons”. Sterilization/ contraception in no way treats a heart condition.

A hysterectomy due to a damaged uterus is an example of a morally permissible treatment that results in sterility but isn’t INTENDED to sterilize. It is intended to deal with the diseased organ.

The sterilization procedure is to prevent conception-- which is always wrong.

 

[1ke]

Do what you feel will keep you healthy. I believe God would understand why you have done something. You are doing this to keep yourself healthy and a child would be in danger if you get pregnant. I believe the logical and safe thing to do is to get the surgery or find another alternative to it. I would do the same if I was in your situation.

This advice is in direct contradiction to Church teaching.

The solution is to avoid pregnancy by MORAL means. That is, to abstain. Either periodically or completely.

 

[gardenswithkids]

Can I get a tubal ligation? I just had heart surgery Friday and another one tomorrow .** I **have 4 children and **was infertile for years. God blessed me. **I am in a situation where if I have more kids I could die and because of my meds my baby would be in danger and it would affect the baby . Doctors said no more.
In my situation what do I do. I don’t trust natural family planning because I am very irregular.
Please help

Prayers for you and your doctors, especially during your heart surgery today.

I’m moved by your post. I’m often moved by couples who experienced infertility. An infertile couple helped me to see fertility as a blessing when I struggled with accepting Church teachings and God’s plans for my family. A tubal ligations won’t solve your heart problems–it will just make you infertile (again.) You’ve been there already as you wrote you faced infertility in the past. Fertility is a blessing–you know that. Remember what you already know whenever you are tempted to undergo a tubal ligation.

You don’t have to trust natural family planning. Trust God. Trust His Church. The Church allows couples to use NFP when they have serious situations for avoiding pregnancy, but it does not require us to use NFP. In your situation, I’d suggest you and your husband consider total abstinence until you’ve gone through menopause.

Again, prayers for you.

 

[1ke]

I can also suggest reaching out through PM to Rayne89 or Crohnie4Life, both of whom have used NFP long term due (20+ years) to life threatening illnesses. In Rayne89’s case, it is a heart condition. She can relate.

 

[SilverLight]

This advice is in direct contradiction to Church teaching.

The solution is to avoid pregnancy by MORAL means. That is, to abstain. Either periodically or completely.

Well I am sorry I just wanted to try and help someone now I feel kind of bad you know for just trying to be helpful to another. I am allowed to have my own views and share them just as you are and I would not say you are wrong because for you what you believe is right is correct for you. In my defense I do not even know what the OP actually personally believes so I just went for it. What is moral to one person may not be to another. We all see things in a different light. I’m not trying to start anything by saying that either.

Personally my birth mother had a tubal ligation after I was born. Why I have no idea as I do not know her.

 

[SilverLight]

The Church teaches that it is.

No, it is not for “medical reasons”. Sterilization/ contraception in no way treats a heart condition.

A hysterectomy due to a damaged uterus is an example of a morally permissible treatment that results in sterility but isn’t INTENDED to sterilize. It is intended to deal with the diseased organ.

The sterilization procedure is to prevent conception-- which is always wrong.

I never said it treats a heart condition and if I did please tell me in what way and how. You do understand that if she gets pregnant both her and the child could be at risk.

Just to add my family never told me contraception was wrong. That was always left up to the individual in a respectful way. I also do not view people who use it as bad or wrong because that’s up to them not me.

 

[12345678]

Well I am sorry I just wanted to try and help someone now I feel kind of bad you know for just trying to be helpful to another. I am allowed to have my own views and share them just as you are and I would not say you are wrong because for you what you believe is right is correct for you. In my defense I do not even know what the OP actually personally believes so I just went for it. What is moral to one person may not be to another. We all see things in a different light. I’m not trying to start anything by saying that either.

Personally my birth mother had a tubal ligation after I was born. Why I have no idea as I do not know her.

Silverlight, I don’t doubt you are trying to help, but misguiding a person away from the teachings of the Church is not help. We are on a Catholic forum trying to help each other uphold the truths of our Faith, and the truth of our Faith is that purposefully sterilizing ourselves so we can have sex without having kids is wrong. Period. Intrinsically evil. Some things are black and white, this is one of them. The Church doesn’t teach that it can be moral if you believe it is… it teaches it is not moral, period. 1ke is right in what she is saying, not because she believes it, but because the Church clearly states it.

 

[1ke]

I never said it treats a heart condition and if I did please tell me in what way and how.

You stated the sterilization would be for a medical reason. No, it wouldn’t. It would be to prevent pregnancy.

You do understand that if she gets pregnant both her and the child could be at risk.

Yes. And that is why I recommended she work with her instructor and that an extended period of abstinence may be required if she is not confident in periodic abstinence. That is also why I suggested she reach out to Rayne89 who also have a heart condition that precludes pregnancy. Rayne89 has used NFP to avoid for over 20 years.

There are moral and immoral ways of avoiding pregnancy. I am encouraging the OP to use moral means.

Just to add my family never told me contraception was wrong.

I’m sorry that they didn’t, but that is common among Catholics and non-Catholics alike. But that is why you are here, to learn and grow. And now you know.

That was always left up to the individual in a respectful way. I also do not view people who use it as bad or wrong because that’s up to them not me.

It’s not up to them, though. God’s laws are for everyone. They are objective. They are not changeable or subject to circumstances. They are absolute. Presumably the OP has come here to learn what the Church has to say on the matter.

And, what the Church says is that there are moral means to prevent pregnancy and immoral means.

When we are ignorant of it, our culpability is lessened or even removed.

 

[SilverLight]

You stated the sterilization would be for a medical reason. No, it wouldn’t. It would be to prevent pregnancy.

Yes. And that is why I recommended she work with her instructor and that an extended period of abstinence may be required if she is not confident in periodic abstinence. That is also why I suggested she reach out to Rayne89 who also have a heart condition that precludes pregnancy. Rayne89 has used NFP to avoid for over 20 years.

There are moral and immoral ways of avoiding pregnancy. I am encouraging the OP to use moral means.

I’m sorry that they didn’t, but that is common among Catholics and non-Catholics alike. But that is why you are here, to learn and grow. And now you know.

It’s not up to them, though. God’s laws are for everyone. They are objective. They are not changeable or subject to circumstances. They are absolute. Presumably the OP has come here to learn what the Church has to say on the matter.

And, what the Church says is that there are moral means to prevent pregnancy and immoral means.

When we are ignorant of it, our culpability is lessened or even removed.

Actually they did tell me what the church said about contraception they just never tried to make me feel bad if I decided to use it. They did not want to shame me into doing something I suppose but I do not have a reason for why my parents did that. I would in turn never go up to someone who does use contraception and tell them they are wrong and bad for doing so.

Its ok if you, the church and the site view it as immoral to use contraception but I just want to make sure that others know some people do not.

Now I am done with this thread because I feel bad for believing what I have a right to.

Have a good day

 

[1ke]

Actually they did tell me what the church said about contraception they just never tried to make me feel bad if I decided to use it.

that’s unfortunate. We should feel bad when we violate God’s commandments. Feelings, however, aren’t always a reliable guide because we often do things that transgress God’s law and don’t “feel” bad about it. But, we can still be contrite for offending God when we go to reconciliation if we know we’ve done wrong.

They did not want to shame me into doing something I suppose but I do not have a reason for why my parents did that. I would in turn never go up to someone who does use contraception and tell them they are wrong and bad for doing so.

But we are not talking about randomly going up to someone who contracepts and telling them they are wrong. We are talking about giving accurate information to someone who ASKED.

Now I am done with this thread because I feel bad for believing what I have a right to.

we have no such right.

 

[SilverLight]

that’s unfortunate. We should feel bad when we violate God’s commandments. Feelings, however, aren’t always a reliable guide because we often do things that transgress God’s law and don’t “feel” bad about it. But, we can still be contrite for offending God when we go to reconciliation if we know we’ve done wrong.

But we are not talking about randomly going up to someone who contracepts and telling them they are wrong. We are talking about giving accurate information to someone who ASKED.

we have no such right.

Alright fine I was wrong according to some rules. I am sorry for being so and seeing that it bothers people I will stop. Just saying though I know some other religious people who would also disagree with you but hey that’s fine we are all entitled to what we believe.

 

[agapewolf]

Alright fine I was wrong according to some rules. I am sorry for being so and seeing that it bothers people I will stop. Just saying though I know some other religious people who would also disagree with you but hey that’s fine we are all entitled to what we believe.

If someone were about to drink a liquid with poison in it…do you not have a “right” to go tell them to stop, it has poison and can hurt you?

In fact, you have a moral obligation TO do such a thing.

Sins aren’t arbitrary. They are sins because they are harmful to us. Telling someone they are harming themselves is an act of mercy.

 

[Corki]

Alright fine I was wrong according to some rules. I am sorry for being so and seeing that it bothers people I will stop. Just saying though I know some other religious people who would also disagree with you but hey that’s fine we are all entitled to what we believe.

It’s not a matter of “bothering.” I think some people are just worried that you might be misleading the OP. If you are going to post something in the Catholic Living forum and what you post is distinctly NOT Catholic, it would probably be prudent to offer that disclaimer.

We **are **entitled to what we believe but we aren’t entitled to misrepresent what Catholics believe.