Mormon - Beliefs - A civil Discussion Please

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Truth,

The people of faith who I have been around constantly tell me that I should not listen to the Holy Ghost for answers. That I should turn to the teachings of men.
I don’t believe that. They really say “MEgus, you should turn to the teachings of men!” Oh come on.
Every time I try to tell people to follow the scriptures where the Lord himself told us to seek the Holy Ghost to teach us the truth of all things, I am put down.
Why is that?
Will you please enlighten me?
Perhaps it is because Mormons confuse the Holy Ghost with their own feelings. If people are telling you not to trust your feelings as the arbiter of truth, then I agree with them.
 
I posted this earlier and am still waiting for an answer. Can any of our resident Mormons clear this up for me?
“The Restoration” mentions:
Adam, Noah, Abraham, and Moses.
Were there any others in OT times?
Any Others between Jesus and JS?

Also I would like to know about how long the “Valid Prieshood” lasted in each of these restorations.

Peace
James
No one has categorized that as far as I know, but a careful study of the Old Testament will show many times. Isaiah and Malachi are also some that come to mind.

One other note. The Priesthood existed outside of the Children of Israel as well. Mose’s Father in Law, while not a member of the House of Israel was a High Priest.

So, there are many things in play here. You can’t just look at it from one perspective.

MEgus
 
That teaching you find difficult to digest is probably because, one, it is a false teaching and two, your common sense tells you it’s not true. The bible makes it very clear that in heaven there is no marriage. You will know everyone and love everyone but there is no need for marriage. “When people rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given in marriage but live like angels in heaven” Matt 22:30. It says NEITHER marry nor are given in marriage. So the Mormons probably twist this verse to change its meaning. But ask yourself, can you imagine an angel with a wife/husband? That’s because like Jesus says, the angels have no need of marriage and of course are not married.
Rick, I guess if you mean twist as to understand what the Savior was saying and to whom he was saying it then I guess your right.

Again, I ask direction from the Holy Ghost for clarification on things like this and also consider it along with other scripture.

Remember, scripture does not stand alone. All scripture given by God has to agree with previous scripture given. If it does not, then either it is not scripture, or the previous scripture is misunderstood or the new scripture is misunderstood. For the most part, it’s misunderstood and needs the clarity that only comes from the Holy Ghost.

Now, with that being said, are you telling us that Abraham was a sinner and not following the Lord when he was practicing Polygamy? Or Issac? Or Jacob? or several other Prophets in the Old testament?

MEgus
 
I don’t believe that. They really say “MEgus, you should turn to the teachings of men!” Oh come on.

Perhaps it is because Mormons confuse the Holy Ghost with their own feelings. If people are telling you not to trust your feelings as the arbiter of truth, then I agree with them.
Or,in the case of the Catholic Church, he’s been taught that there is no guidance from God in His own Church, and believes what he has been taught.
 
I don’t believe that. They really say “MEgus, you should turn to the teachings of men!” Oh come on.
Paul, if someone tells you not to listen to your own understanding and turn to the Church as the ONLY source of knowledge what is that?
Perhaps it is because Mormons confuse the Holy Ghost with their own feelings. If people are telling you not to trust your feelings as the arbiter of truth, then I agree with them.
And will you teach all of us exactly how does the Holy Ghost communicate with us?

When I have had personal revelation from the Holy Ghost and you tell me it’s just personal feelings I almost want to scream!!!

You don’t know what I have received any more than I know what you have. Besides, our journey in this life towards the next is a personal matter. I can’t do it for my wife or kids or anyone else. I can only do it for myself. Same with you.

One of the teachings of our church is to let all men worship how, where, or what they may.

You may do so and that’s fine with us. Why can’t we get the same back?

MEgus
 
Rick, I guess if you mean twist as to understand what the Savior was saying and to whom he was saying it then I guess your right.

Again, I ask direction from the Holy Ghost for clarification on things like this and also consider it along with other scripture.

Remember, scripture does not stand alone. All scripture given by God has to agree with previous scripture given. If it does not, then either it is not scripture, or the previous scripture is misunderstood or the new scripture is misunderstood. For the most part, it’s misunderstood and needs the clarity that only comes from the Holy Ghost.

Now, with that being said, are you telling us that Abraham was a sinner and not following the Lord when he was practicing Polygamy? Or Issac? Or Jacob? or several other Prophets in the Old testament?

MEgus
I would love to see what the Catholic perspective is on MEgus questions regarding prophets of the old testament practicing polygamy. Why was it ever allowed?
 
When I have had personal revelation from the Holy Ghost and you tell me it’s just personal feelings I almost want to scream!!!
…and when I sought that personal revelation from the Holy Ghost for years and years and never received it and my fellow Mormons told me it was my fault (I was not listening, not worthy, not sincere, lacking in faith, not willing to live up to the church’s standards) I also almost wanted to scream. And actually did so many times, into a pillow, or internally with clenched fists, in private, of course, where no one could hear or see my suffering. There are many of us who squirm in agony during fast and testimony meeting, or during priesthood when the topic of personal revelation comes up.

There are two sides to Mormonism’s testimony-based approach to spirituality. I experienced the dark side and only found healing by following God’s prodding and entering the Catholic Church.
 
I would love to see what the Catholic perspective is on MEgus questions regarding prophets of the old testament practicing polygamy. Why was it ever allowed?
God gives us free will. God allows us to sin.

OT polygamy was never commanded, as LDS claim.
 
I would love to see what the Catholic perspective is on MEgus questions regarding prophets of the old testament practicing polygamy. Why was it ever allowed?
It was allowed to populate the earth.
 
Well, that strengthens the mormon position, because they also needed to populate the earth, right?
No. God ordained marriage as between one man and one woman, from the beginning. If ever there was a mandate from God to populate the earth, it was then. And there we have God’s revelation regarding marriage, before your very eyes. One man. One woman.
 
Well, that strengthens the mormon position, because they also needed to populate the earth, right?
OHHH I see… So no wonder they would want them to believe that this is thw way it still is! Good answer Web!
 
No. God ordained marriage as between one man and one woman, from the beginning. If ever there was a mandate from God to populate the earth, it was then. And there we have God’s revelation regarding marriage, before your very eyes. One man. One woman.
Your right Rebecca
 
Paul, if someone tells you not to listen to your own understanding and turn to the Church as the ONLY source of knowledge what is that?
Scripture.
Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
  • Proverbs 3:5
And will you teach all of us exactly how does the Holy Ghost communicate with us?
The Holy Spirit speaks to us through scripture and sacred tradition, increases our understanding and strength to obey God and yes, does give us good feelings, but those feelings can never direct us away from the established truths of the Lord. When Joseph Smith claimed personal revelation to coerce young girls into his bed and steal women away from their husbands, or to teach that there are multiple gods, that was not the Holy Spirit, but his own self-serving feelings.
When I have had personal revelation from the Holy Ghost and you tell me it’s just personal feelings I almost want to scream!!!
Sorry about that. 🙂
One of the teachings of our church is to let all men worship how, where, or what they may.
You may do so and that’s fine with us. Why can’t we get the same back?
Fine, you get your church to recall all those missionaries out there telling people that our beliefs are an abomination and we’ll never give you a second thought.

Fair enough?
 
Well, that strengthens the mormon position, because they also needed to populate the earth, right?
they are not allowed to command that! No matter how much JS thought he was God, or going to be a God. God is the only one who can command us to populate the earth! Why do you think women and men get jealous of other women or men looking at their spouse? It’s because it’s only human nature for us to have one other person for eachother. God gave us all of our sences, and I bet not one person could imagine sharing their husband with other women. The reason you can’t imaginine it is because it is not natural for us to do that. Do you think God would make you do things that would not sit comfortably with ? No, he would never do that! He doesn’t want your life to be sad and confusing, and anything that is done within his good graces will never make you sad and uncomfortable like polygamy would make you feel!
 
Polygamy
just because it was tolerated during the early period when the law was being revealed does not mean it was condoned and approved. God for reasons best known to Himself, and according to Jesus because of the hardness of heart of His people, revealed his law and will gradually over time and had to teach them the true nature of covenant, fidelity, unity etc. before they could accept the applications of these concepts in daily life.
Puzzleannie

God “tolerated” polygamy at the time. He did not “condone” it, and certainly did not approve of it.
Even the tolerance was only, as Puzzleannie puts it " during the early period when the law was being revealed". When I was a baby my mother put me in diapers because I had not yet learned bowel control. Once I was old enough to walk and talk, I was no longer put in diapers, and I was required to make appropriate use of a toilet.
So with God’s treatment of mankind: what was tolerated (never condoned) during the earliest stages is now forbidden, as it should be.
Reepicheep

God also permitted incest, does that mean we should allow it today?
 
…and when I sought that personal revelation from the Holy Ghost for years and years and never received it and my fellow Mormons told me it was my fault (I was not listening, not worthy, not sincere, lacking in faith, not willing to live up to the church’s standards) I also almost wanted to scream. And actually did so many times, into a pillow, or internally with clenched fists, in private, of course, where no one could hear or see my suffering. There are many of us who squirm in agony during fast and testimony meeting, or during priesthood when the topic of personal revelation comes up.

There are two sides to Mormonism’s testimony-based approach to spirituality. I experienced the dark side and only found healing by following God’s prodding and entering the Catholic Church.
This is fascinating to me. You claim you never heard God’s voice, but yet you were prodded by God to join the Catolic church. So then you have experienced revelation, right?
 
Polygamy
just because it was tolerated during the early period when the law was being revealed does not mean it was condoned and approved. God for reasons best known to Himself, and according to Jesus because of the hardness of heart of His people, revealed his law and will gradually over time and had to teach them the true nature of covenant, fidelity, unity etc. before they could accept the applications of these concepts in daily life.
Puzzleannie

God “tolerated” polygamy at the time. He did not “condone” it, and certainly did not approve of it.
Even the tolerance was only, as Puzzleannie puts it " during the early period when the law was being revealed". When I was a baby my mother put me in diapers because I had not yet learned bowel control. Once I was old enough to walk and talk, I was no longer put in diapers, and I was required to make appropriate use of a toilet.
So with God’s treatment of mankind: what was tolerated (never condoned) during the earliest stages is now forbidden, as it should be.
Reepicheep

God also permitted incest, does that mean we should allow it today?
Didn’t He command Abraham to take another wife?
 
Well I think we have covered things like that. When Jesus came he gave them new commandments over the OT such as divorce not being allowed anymore. As He said, these things were allowed because of their hardness of heart. He also said it was never meant to be.

P.S. Please give the scripture in which God commanded this please.
 
Polygamy
just because it was tolerated during the early period when the law was being revealed does not mean it was condoned and approved.
30And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
31Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.
  • Acts 17:30-31
Paul
 
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