Mormon/Polygamy question

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Why is your church not called the Church of Jesus Christ. Is it not his? If it is his why does it not bear his name?
Is that requirement in the New testament?
In the New Testament the Church is usually refered to as ‘the church’

except once as the churches of Christ
Romans 16:16
and nine times as the Church of God
1 Corinthians 1:2
1 Corinthians 10:32
1 Corinthians 15:9
2 Corinthians 1:1
Galatians 1:13
1 Thessalonians 2:14
1 Timothy 3:5
1 Timothy 3:15
2 Thessalonians 1:4
 
You are dancing around the issue’ as many do when they are confounded. Why is your church not called the Church of Jesus Christ. Is it not his? If it is his why does it not bear his name?
Ok, owing to your persistence, let’s try this one more time. The word “church” means either all of Christendom, i.e., the Body of Christ, or it means a specific Christian community, e.g. the Baptist Church, the Episcopal Church, the Lutheran Church, the Russian Orthodox Church, etc., etc., etc, The name of Jesus Christ is implicit in the word “church.” The Baptist Church means the Baptist community of Jesus Christ. To say the Jesus Christ community of Jesus Christ or the Christian community of Jesus Christ would be redundant. The Catholic Church means the universal community of Jesus Christ.

Got it now?
 
You are dancing around the issue’ as many do when they are confounded. Why is your church not called the Church of Jesus Christ. Is it not his? If it is his why does it not bear his name?
By the year 110 AD, the Church that Jesus established was already called the Catholic Church.
Ignatius of Antioch
“Let no one do anything of concern to the Church without the bishop. Let that be considered a valid Eucharist which is celebrated by the bishop or by one whom he ordains . Wherever the bishop appears, let the people be there; just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church” (Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 110]).
The Martyrdom of Polycarp
“And of the elect, he was one indeed, the wonderful martyr Polycarp, who in our days was an apostolic and prophetic teacher, bishop of the Catholic Church in Smyrna. For every word which came forth from his mouth was fulfilled and will be fulfilled” (Martyrdom of Polycarp 16:2 [A.D. 155]).
The Muratorian Canon
"Besides these [letters of Paul] there is one to Philemon, and one to Titus, and two to Timothy, in affection and love, but nevertheless regarded as holy in the Catholic Church, in the ordering of churchly discipline. There is also one [letter] to the Laodiceans and another to the Alexandrians, forged under the name of Paul, in regard to the heresy of Marcion, and there are several others which cannot be received by the Church, for it is not suitable that gall be mixed with honey. The epistle of Jude, indeed, and the two ascribed to John are received by the Catholic Church (Muratorian fragment [A.D. 177]).
Tertullian
“Where was [the heretic] Marcion, that shipmaster of Pontus, the zealous student of Stoicism? Where was Valentinus, the disciple of Platonism? For it is evident that those men lived not so long ago—in the reign of Antonius for the most part—and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, in the church of Rome under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherius, until on account of their ever restless curiosity, with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelled” (Demurrer Against the Heretics 30 [A.D. 200]).
Your argument is not with us, but with the early Church itself, which knew what it was called.
 
And when we say The Church, we mean Christ’s Church, as there is no other. What other Church would you imagine we mean?

Only someone who is not a part of Christ’s Church would be trying to claim by title what does not rightly belong to them.
 
only mormon scriptures require the name of the church to be “Christ’s church”. interestingly enough the LDS church has changed it’s name from the original. only mormon scriptures require prophets after jesus came to earth. (hebrews 1 covers this quite nicely) all of JS revelations conveniently require everyone to believe in JS or be destroyed. there is no external support for any of his works and his biography shows us all the signs of a con man. he and his successor BY are no different than david koresh.

why do mormon wannabe missionaries keep coming here to preach? stop with the “we are being misrepresented and just want to clarify…and answer any questions”. if that were true you’d be on CARM or some other evangelical board where that’s really happening. you come here to preach. we reject JS and all of his works. mormonism is incompatible with the true gospel of jesus christ. there is only one God anywhere ever. he does not require signs or tokens to enter into his presence and he was never a mortal man. we will not become gods ourselves ever. through faith in god, the sacraments entrusted to his church and our own best efforts to keep his commandments we can dwell with him in a manner that allows us to enjoy all that he has eternally.

repent and be baptized
 
This “allowing” is nothing but a red herring.

Those who practiced polygamy in the OT were never commanded by God. They chose the practice on their own. Mormons believe that because God blessed Abraham and other polygamist men that means God allowed their polygamy.

The reasoning is flawed. God blessed many people in the OT, and does us as well, in spite of our sins. Because He is merciful and forgiving.

Joseph Smith claimed that God commanded the practice of polygamy. He made promises of salvation to parents who would permit him to “marry” their young daughters. He told young girls that an angel with a firey sword commanded him to marry them and if they refused they were going against God’s will.

These marriage included women who were already married, which was never practiced in the OT.

The whole thing was a ruse for his adultery.
 
This “allowing” is nothing but a red herring.

Those who practiced polygamy in the OT were never commanded by God. They chose the practice on their own. Mormons believe that because God blessed Abraham and other polygamist men that means God allowed their polygamy.

The reasoning is flawed. God blessed many people in the OT, and does us as well, in spite of our sins. Because He is merciful and forgiving.

Joseph Smith claimed that God commanded the practice of polygamy. He made promises of salvation to parents who would permit him to “marry” their young daughters. He told young girls that an angel with a firey sword commanded him to marry them and if they refused they were going against God’s will.

These marriage included women who were already married, which was never practiced in the OT.

The whole thing was a ruse for his adultery.
i think the bible shows in those cases the horrible consequences of polygamy. look at abraham, what happened with is firstborn son? joseph? that was full of problems. david? disaster. solomon? even worse. i don’t think the bible ever shows us a “successful” polygamous marriage. nor does the BoM and neither shows us “eternal marriage” either. this was a later concept of JS to justify his womanizing. we see this behavior alot in these type of cults. yaweh ben yaweh, father divine, jim jones, david koresh, warren jeffs, etc. Jesus tells us very clearly that marriage is between one aman and one woman and he tells us it is only on earth, not in heaven.
 
Ok, owing to your persistence, let’s try this one more time. The word “church” means either all of Christendom, i.e., the Body of Christ, or it means a specific Christian community, e.g. the Baptist Church, the Episcopal Church, the Lutheran Church, the Russian Orthodox Church, etc., etc., etc, The name of Jesus Christ is implicit in the word “church.” The Baptist Church means the Baptist community of Jesus Christ. To say the Jesus Christ community of Jesus Christ or the Christian community of Jesus Christ would be redundant. The Catholic Church means the universal community of Jesus Christ.

Got it now?
Always have. 😉 If one insists that the church must be officially called “The Church of Christ”, then there are at least two other claimants to that; heck, there’s even a Filipino version. 😉
 
i think the bible shows in those cases the horrible consequences of polygamy. look at abraham, what happened with is firstborn son? joseph? that was full of problems. david? disaster. solomon? even worse. i don’t think the bible ever shows us a “successful” polygamous marriage. nor does the BoM and neither shows us “eternal marriage” either. this was a later concept of JS to justify his womanizing. we see this behavior alot in these type of cults. yaweh ben yaweh, father divine, jim jones, david koresh, warren jeffs, etc. Jesus tells us very clearly that marriage is between one aman and one woman and he tells us it is only on earth, not in heaven.
The insulting comparisons aside the comment made by Christ was regarding the fate of a women when she was resurrected. It was asked by those who did not even believe in a resurrection and it was already clear in the Law what was going to happen. Christ followed his own advice and did not cast a pearl before swine.
 
The insulting comparisons aside the comment made by Christ was regarding the fate of a women when she was resurrected. It was asked by those who did not even believe in a resurrection and it was already clear in the Law what was going to happen. Christ followed his own advice and did not cast a pearl before swine.
that isn’t christs only words on marriage. and christ took time to answer them. are you implying that he lied? if you believe this so strongly then why do you choose to come to this “pen” bag of “pearls” in hand casting away? there is no scriptural basis for eternal marriage outside of the mormon claim from D&C 132 which was primarily used to justify polygyny. not just any polygyny either but a version that ignored previous scriptural prohibitions regaarding unlawful marriages and in practice even contradicted this section as the taking to wife of already married women would appear to contradict the requirement that they had vowed to no other man (which was circumvented by the section claiming that any vows without the “sealing” authority have no value) of course even “sealed” women were sometimes “reassigned” as BY taught higher priesthood leaders could always take the women from the lower ones. i simply see no way that this current DOCTRINE of the LDs church (even it isn’t currently practiced) can be justified.
 
that isn’t christs only words on marriage. and christ took time to answer them. are you implying that he lied? if you believe this so strongly then why do you choose to come to this “pen” bag of “pearls” in hand casting away? there is no scriptural basis for eternal marriage outside of the mormon claim from D&C 132 which was primarily used to justify polygyny. not just any polygyny either but a version that ignored previous scriptural prohibitions regaarding unlawful marriages and in practice even contradicted this section as the taking to wife of already married women would appear to contradict the requirement that they had vowed to no other man (which was circumvented by the section claiming that any vows without the “sealing” authority have no value) of course even “sealed” women were sometimes “reassigned” as BY taught higher priesthood leaders could always take the women from the lower ones. i simply see no way that this current DOCTRINE of the LDs church (even it isn’t currently practiced) can be justified.
Well if you want to call your self a pig thats your issue.

the point I was making is that Christ’s response was just that a response. He rarely got into deep or complex ideas when asked stupid questions unless he masked them in a story. you other accusations would best be served on another thread (perhaps wonderland) 😃
 
Well if you want to call your self a pig thats your issue.

the point I was making is that Christ’s response was just that a response. He rarely got into deep or complex ideas when asked stupid questions unless he masked them in a story. you other accusations would best be served on another thread (perhaps wonderland) 😃
your analogy…

i didn’t think you would answer as there really is none. jesus never “responded”. he always taught. sometimes the deep meanings required study and sometimes there multiple levels of teaching within the same lesson. none of jesus words were flippant. this was not a stupid question. why do you think it was preserved in scripture? his response here is DOCTRINE!

my other words were not mere “accusations” but documented, verifiable facts. todd compton anyone? (and that’s just a summary)
 
your analogy…

i didn’t think you would answer as there really is none. jesus never “responded”. he always taught. sometimes the deep meanings required study and sometimes there multiple levels of teaching within the same lesson. none of jesus words were flippant. this was not a stupid question. why do you think it was preserved in scripture? his response here is DOCTRINE!

my other words were not mere “accusations” but documented, verifiable facts. todd compton anyone? (and that’s just a summary)
facts are interesting things. Ideas become facts when people like them.

I agree that Christ was teaching, but why would he go into a higher doctrine when the people asking him could not even accept a simple and clear one?
 
facts are interesting things. Ideas become facts when people like them.

I agree that Christ was teaching, but why would he go into a higher doctrine when the people asking him could not even accept a simple and clear one?
no facts are facts because they are objective and can be verified. fire is hot. columbus sailed from spain to the Caribbean. joseph smith founded the LDS church. those are facts. so are the ones i mentioned. christ wasn’t just teaching the people asking the questions. he was teaching all who were following him listening and all of us who learn from the reading his words. “higher” doctrine isn’t secret or contradictory. it’s not scientology. christ gave us eternal truths. we can trust every one of his words as gospel. literally.
 
Its not too hard.

I find it very interesting that many people here see only those versions of history that promote the CC and oppose the LDS as objective and valid.

Even to the point of making one facts and the other fiction.
 
Its not too hard.

I find it very interesting that many people here see only those versions of history that promote the CC and oppose the LDS as objective and valid.

Even to the point of making one facts and the other fiction.
It’s not just the people here. History - real, objective history; the kind taught in secular universities - supports the history that “promotes” the Catholic Church. This is one of the reasons I finally wound up becoming Catholic.

Outside of the LDS church and its offshoots, the history of the world according to Mormons is not taken seriously by anyone. That is because there is simply nothing in the way of evidence to support any of it.

It’s just the fact of the matter. 🤷
 
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