Mormon Prophets, Seers, and Revelators

[CatholicGuyNY]

I was reading a thread over at Mormon Apologetics and Discussion Board (found here), and thought that I’d ask a similar question on this forum.

Members of the LDS church sustain 15 men (3 in the First Presidency and 12 in the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles) as “Prophets, Seers, and Revelators”. What does it mean to be a prophet, seer, and revelator (especially the last two titles), and if these 15 men are sustained as such, how do they act as prophets, seers, and revelators (are there specific tasks or functions specific to each title that they do)?

Also, do Mormons make a distinction between “inspiration” and “revelation”?

 

[Barbkw]

Their use of the term 12 apostles. :dts:

There were 12 Apostles, and most of them were martyred. Out of respect for their relationship with Christ, the word Apostle came to be known as a title and is an honored position in the Communion of Saints.

All followers of the Apostles are called disciples.

 

[zerinus]

I was reading a thread over at Mormon Apologetics and Discussion Board (found here), and thought that I’d ask a similar question on this forum.

I wouldn’t take too much notice of him if I were you! There are many Mormons whose eyes are not yet opened that they do not see, and their ears are not opened that they do not hear. See Revelation 3:18–19; Mosiah 2:9–11.

Members of the LDS church sustain 15 men (3 in the First Presidency and 12 in the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles) as “Prophets, Seers, and Revelators”. What does it mean to be a prophet, seer, and revelator (especially the last two titles), . . .

A prophet is God’s agent, messenger, or representative on earth. He is someone who speaks or acts on God’s behalf. He speaks to the people the words that God wants them to hear.

A seer is a greater gift than that of a prophet. A seer is able to see things that others are not able to see. One may be a prophet without being a seer.

A revelator is the same as a prophet and a seer. Once you become a prophet and seer, you also become a revelator. He is someone through whom God reveals His will to man. One cannot be a prophet and seer without being a revelator at the same time.

. . . and if these 15 men are sustained as such, how do they act as prophets, seers, and revelators (are there specific tasks or functions specific to each title that they do)?

Yes. They exercise those spiritual gifts in the discharge of all their responsibilities in the Church, whether it is administrative, making important decisions about policy, about the direction the Church should take on any issue, as well as in the instructions they give to the church at General Conference for example, as well as in other similar occasions as they go about their daily duties.

Also, do Mormons make a distinction between “inspiration” and “revelation”?

In many ways they are similar. It is hard to draw a line as to where inspiration ends and revelation begins.

 

[TikiTokiguy]

It means if one of the prophets prays about women and ear rings, and the prophet says God told him women should only have one ear ring in each ear, then that’s to be followed from now on. Of course the prophets have no real evidence God talked to them.

 

[zaffiroborant]

Nice that the first response leads off with an attack on the poster who started the thread at MADB. Poisoning the well?

 

[LongJourney]

It is also interesting that the person who started that thread at MADB is respected by many critics as a leader of liberal Mormondom. :tsktsk:

 

[zerinus]

Nice that the first response leads off with an attack on the poster who started the thread at MADB. Poisoning the well?

Funny, how you always have to distort what someone says. No attack! Moses said something similar to the Israelites:

Deuteronomy 29:

4 Yet the Lord hath not given you an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, unto this day.
5 And I have led you forty years in the wilderness: your clothes are not waxen old upon you, and thy shoe is not waxen old upon thy foot.
6 Ye have not eaten bread, neither have ye drunk wine or strong drink: that ye might know that I am the Lord your God.

Likewise there are many Mormons too to whom “the Lord hath not given an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear”.

 

[ParkerD]

I was reading a thread over at Mormon Apologetics and Discussion Board (found here), and thought that I’d ask a similar question on this forum.

Members of the LDS church sustain 15 men (3 in the First Presidency and 12 in the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles) as “Prophets, Seers, and Revelators”. What does it mean to be a prophet, seer, and revelator (especially the last two titles), and if these 15 men are sustained as such, how do they act as prophets, seers, and revelators (are there specific tasks or functions specific to each title that they do)?

Also, do Mormons make a distinction between “inspiration” and “revelation”?

CatholicGuyNY,
I had read Zerinus’ response and had thought to myself that covered the subject well, but since this thread is picking up other responses that seem to want at least a “second witness”, I guess I’ll do that.

You are very familiar with the idea of “keys to the kingdom”, of course. One of the major reasons that all of the apostles called to the Quorum of the Twelve receive keys that are “keys to the kingdom” and thus whatsoever they bind on earth is bound in heaven, is so that those keys indeed remain on the earth with a living person when the most senior apostle (i.e. the President of the LDS Church) dies. At that point, the next most senior apostle is automatically, by virtue of seniority, the one for whom the “keys to the kingdom” are at that point in time brought into full use and that man becomes sustained as the living prophet. For all the other apostles, the “keys to the kingdom” are not in full use even though they are ordained apostles and given those keys. Those particular keys are “held in abeyance” until such time (if ever) they would be the most senior apostle (and many don’t outlive the others such that they become the “living prophet”).

The reason I wrote about that situation, is that it has a bearing on the description of “prophets, seers, and revelators”. The person (the President of the LDS Church) who holds those keys in full use is described as the “living prophet” while the others are sustained as “prophets, seers, and revelators” but aren’t generally or usually talked about when they visit a place, as “a prophet is coming to town”. They are described as “an apostle is coming to town.” Yet they do exercise “prophetic” authority, and they do revelatory functions such as choose a new stake president or a new patriarch when that is needed, and do that choosing by revelation from the Holy Ghost. They may choose (by revelation) the specific location where a new temple is to be built–the “House of the Lord.”

They also travel by assignment to particular locations in the world where perhaps the specific location has not yet been dedicated for the preaching of the gospel in its fullness, and where they may meet with government officials asking for that permission and when it is granted, they later dedicate that spot on earth for the preaching of the gospel in its fullness. They have the keys to do that, and it is part of their stewardship as being a special witness of the living Christ in all the world and to all the world.

As a final point, as perhaps you saw on an earlier thread, when the Quorum of the Twelve and the First Presidency have unitedly voted on a written message to the members of the church or to the world (such as the Proclamation on the Family which you may be familiar with) then that is a point in time that their united voice becomes very key to the members paying particular attention–knowing here is something that needs to be studied and followed as a protection against the inroads of secularism or the inroads of relativism or the inroads of elitism or pessimism or the temptation (sometimes fostered by governments) to adopt the world’s way of looking at the moral standards and virtues firmly laid out in the Bible.

 

[zaffiroborant]

Funny, how you always have to distort what someone says. No attack! Moses said something similar to the Israelites:

Deuteronomy 29:

4 Yet the Lord hath not given you an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, unto this day.
5 And I have led you forty years in the wilderness: your clothes are not waxen old upon you, and thy shoe is not waxen old upon thy foot.
6 Ye have not eaten bread, neither have ye drunk wine or strong drink: that ye might know that I am the Lord your God.

Likewise there are many Mormons too to whom “the Lord hath not given an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear”.

Attacking, disparaging either way you are poisoning the well. As to the hearts of your fellow Mormons I remain unconvinced that you are qualified to judge them.

 

[LongJourney]

Any faithful Mormon who has the courage to criticize his faith/culture from within should be respected for that same courage. By judging them and pushing them out, you are guaranteeing that the LDS faith will not survive its current challenges.

 

[zerinus]

Attacking, disparaging either way you are poisoning the well. As to the hearts of your fellow Mormons I remain unconvinced that you are qualified to judge them.

Any faithful Mormon who has the courage to criticize his faith/culture from within should be respected for that same courage. By judging them and pushing them out, you are guaranteeing that the LDS faith will not survive its current challenges.

Mormonism is true. It has prophets that prophesy, seers that see, and revelators that reveal. That is the main thing. If there are some (a small minority) of Mormons who may not be fully converted to that idea, the LDS Church is big enough, and magnanimous enough, to accept and accommodate them, and give them the right entertain such opinions; which means that I also have the right to disagree with them.

 

[Holly3278]

Mormonism is true. It has prophets that prophesy, seers that see, and revelators that reveal. That is the main thing. If there are some (a small minority) of Mormons who may not be fully converted to that idea, the LDS Church is big enough, and magnanimous enough, to accept and accommodate them, and give them the right entertain such opinions; which means that I also have the right to disagree with them.

How do you know that these “prophets, seers, and revelators” aren’t getting their information from Satan?

 

[zerinus]

How do you know that these “prophets, seers, and revelators” aren’t getting their information from Satan?

There are several ways that you can tell; but I like the way it is taught in the Book of Mormon best:

Moroni 7:

14 Wherefore, take heed, my beloved brethren, that ye do not judge that which is evil to be of God, or that which is good and of God to be of the devil.
15 For behold, my brethren, it is given unto you to judge, that ye may know good from evil; and the way to judge is as plain, that ye may know with a perfect knowledge, as the daylight is from the dark night.
16 For behold, the Spirit of Christ is given to every man, that he may know good from evil; wherefore, I show unto you the way to judge; for every thing which inviteth to do good, and to persuade to believe in Christ, is sent forth by the power and gift of Christ; wherefore ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of God.
17 But whatsoever thing persuadeth men to do evil, and believe not in Christ, and deny him, and serve not God, then ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of the devil; for after this manner doth the devil work, for he persuadeth no man to do good, no, not one; neither do his angels; neither do they who subject themselves unto him.
18 And now, my brethren, seeing that ye know the light by which ye may judge, which light is the light of Christ, see that ye do not judge wrongfully; for with that same judgment which ye judge ye shall also be judged.
19 Wherefore, I beseech of you, brethren, that ye should search diligently in the light of Christ that ye may know good from evil; and if ye will lay hold upon every good thing, and condemn it not, ye certainly will be a child of Christ.

 

[mfbukowski]

CatholicGuyNY,
I had read Zerinus’ response and had thought to myself that covered the subject well, but since this thread is picking up other responses that seem to want at least a “second witness”, I guess I’ll do that.

Zerinus is doing an excellent job and he certainly doesn’t need my help- or probably want it

But I will “third” that proposition!

Good job Mr. Z!

 

[Javl]

Mormonism is true. It has prophets that prophesy, seers that see, and revelators that reveal. That is the main thing. If there are some (a small minority) of Mormons who may not be fully converted to that idea, the LDS Church is big enough, and magnanimous enough, to accept and accommodate them, and give them the right entertain such opinions; which means that I also have the right to disagree with them.

How can Mormonism be true if it is built by man upon the premise of a false “prophet”?

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[ParkerD]

How can Mormonism be true if it is built by man upon the premise of a false “prophet”?

JAVL,
I suppose the Lord forgot to tell you that just as the Savior said “a prophet is without honor in his own country” and just as He was accused of things that made Him seem “human”, a true prophet will obviously be rejected by the vast majority of the people (as always in the Biblical past) who will point fingers of scorn at him and join with the crowds in rejecting whatever he has to say, even if when they were to actually listen to the message it would ring true to their hearts. (They don’t listen with their hearts engaged, because of the attitude of scorn.)

Have a peaceful Sunday.

 

[Holly3278]

There are several ways that you can tell; but I like the way it is taught in the Book of Mormon best:
Moroni 7:

14 Wherefore, take heed, my beloved brethren, that ye do not judge that which is evil to be of God, or that which is good and of God to be of the devil.
15 For behold, my brethren, it is given unto you to judge, that ye may know good from evil; and the way to judge is as plain, that ye may know with a perfect knowledge, as the daylight is from the dark night.
16 For behold, the Spirit of Christ is given to every man, that he may know good from evil; wherefore, I show unto you the way to judge; for every thing which inviteth to do good, and to persuade to believe in Christ, is sent forth by the power and gift of Christ; wherefore ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of God.
17 But whatsoever thing persuadeth men to do evil, and believe not in Christ, and deny him, and serve not God, then ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of the devil; for after this manner doth the devil work, for he persuadeth no man to do good, no, not one; neither do his angels; neither do they who subject themselves unto him.
18 And now, my brethren, seeing that ye know the light by which ye may judge, which light is the light of Christ, see that ye do not judge wrongfully; for with that same judgment which ye judge ye shall also be judged.
19 Wherefore, I beseech of you, brethren, that ye should search diligently in the light of Christ that ye may know good from evil; and if ye will lay hold upon every good thing, and condemn it not, ye certainly will be a child of Christ.

So you judge whether or not a religion is true based upon that religion’s own scriptures? I’m sorry but that really does not sound like a very sound way to do so.

 

[zerinus]

How can Mormonism be true if it is built by man upon the premise of a false “prophet”?

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

Mormonism is built by God on the premise of a true prophet.

 

[zerinus]

So you judge whether or not a religion is true based upon that religion’s own scriptures? I’m sorry but that really does not sound like a very sound way to do so.

So you reject a teaching just because of where it comes from, to the complete disregard of what is actually being taught? Can you find fault with the actual teaching on the basis of logic, wisdom, or in comparison with what is taught in the Bible? Does truth become false depending on where it comes from? I believe in accepting truth wherever it comes from, Mormonism, Catholicism, Protestantism, or anywhere else. Jesus said, “Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment”? (John 7:24.) What if the Bible teaches the same thing as the Book of Mormon, but in different words:

John 1:

4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
9 That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

John 8:

12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

John 16:

13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

There is no contradiction between these and what is taught in the Book of Mormon. They are teaching the same things, but in different words. So truth becomes false just because it is taught in the Book of Mormon? Don’t you think that is a rather foolish attitude to take?

 

[RebeccaJ]

Truth becomes false when it is made into a half truth, and called truth. That is what Mormonism does to truth, on the whole. The BoM is but a tool for this purpose.