Mormon Religion

[jake23]

Jake, a 'Christian proclaiming truths" would restrict himself to those words in red letters in the NT, and what HE firmly believes they mean. That is sufficient, y’know. If you are correct about what you believe, then don’t you trust the Holy Ghost enough to let your listener recognize that truth and come to it freely?

Well, actually, that’s a silly question because the answer is, of course…no. you don’t trust God enough. You take precious time away from truths to insult, disparage and mock other people…as if you have to tear down someone else’s faith before they deserve to hear Truth as you believe it to be.

The problem with that approach is that, well…it doesn’t work. Since when does God want converts who come to Him out of fear and loathing, rather than joy and peace? Discovering Truth is supposed to be a joyful thing…

there is this parable (yeah, it’s in red letters…) about a merchant who, when he saw a pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had and purchased it. Now think; do you think that the owner of the pearl had to disparage all that the merchant had in order to get him to sell his junk to buy the pearl?

Nope…the merchant saw the pearl, saw that it was worth more than anything he had, and willingly–joyfully–got rid of his old stuff in order to gain the new. Nobody had to tell him that his stuff was junk in comparison. He made his own comparison, and purchased the pearl.

Anti’s can’t seem to get it through their heads that their methods are the OPPOSITE of that parable. They hide what they believe to be the pearl of great price, and defend it against all comers by disparaging, attacking and abusing those who, if they only knew what you have hidden, would also go sell all that they have to purchase it.

Anti’s…no matter who they are attacking…do more to cement the opinions of those they hate than can possibly imagine, and I do believe that God will not be happy about their methods. Not one little bit.

LOL! someone is definetley out of touch with reality! I hope you open youre eys and ears one day, when you do Christ and the rest of us will be there to greet you happly!

 

[dianaiad]

Dear Heavens, has anyone even thought if we weren’t caught up in the debates of the differences, maybe we could work on the commonalities (i.e. abortions) and make a dent for Jesus in that or any other cause that is a commonality in HIS NAME???

good heavens.

You mean…inject a little common sense and get rid of the hatred?

Are you kidding?

 

[dianaiad]

LOL! someone is definetley out of touch with reality! I hope you open youre eys and ears one day, when you do Christ and the rest of us will be there to greet you happly!

(shaking head in absolute incredulity…)

 

[Answersplease]

Dear Heavens, has anyone even thought if we weren’t caught up in the debates of the differences, maybe we could work on the commonalities (i.e. abortions) and make a dent for Jesus in that or any other cause that is a commonality in HIS NAME???

(colors red and blue added to original text)

catholic.com/library/Mormon_Stumpers.asp

…the Mormon church accepts abortion for a number of reasons. The Church Handbook of Instructions, approved in September, 1998, states that abortion may be performed in the following circumstances: pregnancy resulting from rape or incest; a competent physician says the life or health of the mother is in serious jeopardy; or a competent physician says that the “fetus” has severe defects that will not allow the “baby” to survive beyond birth. In any case, the persons responsible must first consult with their church leader and receive God’s approval in prayer (156).
…

the Handbook says: “The church has not favored or opposed legislative proposals or public demonstrations concerning abortion (156).” While the Mormon prophet claims to speak the mind and will of God, he can neither figure out when the unborn child becomes human or if it is God’s desire that we protect the unborn unconditionally.

Moroni 10:5

And by the power of the Holy Ghost ye may know the truth of all things.

 

[ParkerD]

Zaffiroborant,
Since there are several conversations going on, and one is about “abortion statistics”, I offer my opinion on the subject, again, with a desire to have at least one or two people think about the “root” of the problem and realize that the “root” lies more with the men of society than with the women of society.

OK, game’s on:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ParkerD
I still think it (i.e. the problem of a higher overall abortion rate statistically among Catholic women) has to do with an impression that may be in society of a “double standard” and also the natural desire women have to have companionship, even at the cost of a risk of grievous sin. So if the men were taught and had conviction deep in their soul as youth that to be with a girl or woman in that way is to commit to being married (obviously before being with them but if not, then understanding that immediate repentance is absolutely obligated including immediate marriage) and supporting a family, and if that teaching were emphasized in the homes by the fathers to their sons in indelible ways that they could teach by having done so through their own example as well as by precept, then that particular statistic would have a dramatic drop in a few short years.

This comment is about going to the root of the problem, not “hacking at the branches”. (Thoreau)

 

[PaulDupre]

Consider that in Mormon communities in Utah, LDS abortions are routinely reported as “miscarriages”. This info is from my LDS sister who is a labor and delivery nurse at a hospital in Salt Lake City.

Paul (a former Mormon, now happily Catholic)

 

[scottj]

good heavens.

You mean…inject a little common sense and get rid of the hatred?

Are you kidding?

Exactly
I thought we were commanded to love ( Peter 4:8 (New International Version)
8 Above all, love each other deeply, because love covers over a multitude of sins.)

And to not pass judgement (Luke 6:37 (New International Version)

Judging Others
37"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.)…

I guess the priests and nun’s taught me wrong… must be Jesus too, when he taught us "forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us.
From Martin Luther’s Small Catechism

“And forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those that trespass against us.”

What does this mean?

“We pray in this petition that our Father in heaven would not look at our sins, or deny our prayer because of them. We are neither worthy of the things for which we pray, nor have we deserved them, but we ask that He would give them all to us by grace, for we daily sin much and surely deserve nothing but punishment. So we too will sincerely forgive and gladly do good to those who sin against us.”

Guess I will just continue to be like a dumb little child …
Oh yeah
Matthew 18:3 (New International Version)
3And he said: "I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

Peace to ALL my brothers and sisters.

 

[choctaw]

Question…In reading the Book Of Mormon an angel of the Lord is speaking saying Behold, Saith the Lamb of God ……1 Nephi 26 seems to be on the attack toward a certain church “thou seest the foundation of a great and abominable church, which is most abominable above all other churches. For behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the Lamb parts which are plain and most precious”….1 Nephi 27 this they have done that they might pervert the right ways of the Lord, that they might blind the eyes and harden the hearts of the children of men”.

The BOM says much the same about this abominable church in 1 Nephi 34. I am asking simply what church are these statements in reference to? Could it be the Catholic Church?

 

[SteveVH]

Question…In reading the Book Of Mormon an angel of the Lord is speaking saying Behold, Saith the Lamb of God ……1 Nephi 26 seems to be on the attack toward a certain church “thou seest the foundation of a great and abominable church, which is most abominable above all other churches. For behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the Lamb parts which are plain and most precious”….1 Nephi 27 this they have done that they might pervert the right ways of the Lord, that they might blind the eyes and harden the hearts of the children of men”.

The BOM says much the same about this abominable church in 1 Nephi 34. I am asking simply what church are these statements in reference to? Could it be the Catholic Church?

Of course it is. The JW’s say the same thing. Both religions had their origin in the Adventist movement and have taken similar beliefs, such as denial of the Trintiy and fighting against the “whore of Babylon”. JW’s are a little more outspoken on just who they mean by this.

 

[why_me]

Dear Heavens, has anyone even thought if we weren’t caught up in the debates of the differences, maybe we could work on the commonalities (i.e. abortions) and make a dent for Jesus in that or any other cause that is a commonality in HIS NAME???

You are absolutely right. It is sad that catholics are engaged in critiquing the lds church. We should be working together to make the world a better place.

 

[dianaiad]

Consider that in Mormon communities in Utah, LDS abortions are routinely reported as “miscarriages”. This info is from my LDS sister who is a labor and delivery nurse at a hospital in Salt Lake City.

Paul (a former Mormon, now happily Catholic)

That is more than a little illegal, Paul, considering that abortion (yes, even in Utah) is a legal procedure which MUST be reported as such, your sister and the other care providers there are really putting their careers and freedom at risk for doing this. Are you sure you understood her correctly?

 

[why_me]

Exactly
I thought we were commanded to love ( Peter 4:8 (New International Version)
8 Above all, love each other deeply, because love covers over a multitude of sins.)

And to not pass judgement (Luke 6:37 (New International Version)

Judging Others
37"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.)…

I guess the priests and nun’s taught me wrong… must be Jesus too, when he taught us "forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us.
From Martin Luther’s Small Catechism

Peace to ALL my brothers and sisters.

You are right again. Good to have a good catholic on this section of the forum.

 

[dianaiad]

Question…In reading the Book Of Mormon an angel of the Lord is speaking saying Behold, Saith the Lamb of God ……1 Nephi 26 seems to be on the attack toward a certain church “thou seest the foundation of a great and abominable church, which is most abominable above all other churches. For behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the Lamb parts which are plain and most precious”….1 Nephi 27 this they have done that they might pervert the right ways of the Lord, that they might blind the eyes and harden the hearts of the children of men”.

The BOM says much the same about this abominable church in 1 Nephi 34. I am asking simply what church are these statements in reference to? Could it be the Catholic Church?

No, actually, it couldn’t. It refers to the ‘church’ of those who choose evil deliberately; who use their professed belief systems as props either to their wealth development or their pride or…

Yes, there are Catholics who belong to it. There are also Mormons who do.

 

[why_me]

That is more than a little illegal, Paul, considering that abortion (yes, even in Utah) is a legal procedure which MUST be reported as such, your sister and the other care providers there are really putting their careers and freedom at risk for doing this. Are you sure you understood her correctly?

I think that Paul may not be telling the whole facts here. If this were true, and it was exposed, people would be heading to jail. Salt Lake is not that crowded with mormons. To have nonmormons have abortions and carry it as a miscarriage seems a little impossible.

 

[zaffiroborant]

You are absolutely right. It is sad that catholics are engaged in critiquing the lds church. We should be working together to make the world a better place.

I don’t see you mourning over the LDS here to critique the Catholic Church.

 

[scottj]

I don’t see you mourning over the LDS here to critique the Catholic Church.

If you dig deep enough, there have been things that the Catholic church can be critiqued for (after all, there is two thousand years worth of things to look over).

So, again- one can decide to engage in conversation to learn about anothers religion; Respectfully state what is disagreed upon and move forward to embrace and *work together *on the common agreements - OR - we can point out who’s right, who’s wrong, who’s going to burn in hell till the cows come home. (Now think about it, when speaking to a non-catholic, some of what we believe in may sound just as crazy to them/against the Bible- Lord knows I have been damned to hell by my fair share of protestants even when showing them scripture to back up things)

Yes, I am Catholic, and will probably be skewered by my fellow Catholics for this- but … man is fallable… only God is infallable. Although I hold those in decision making positions in the Church with respect, one never truly knows a persons heart except for God. There is corruption every where, in every single institution- The Catholic Church, the Mormon Church, the Baptists Church, Muslims, Jews (boy doesn’t Jesus talk about the corruption that was going on in HIS church all those days ago…) and if you really want to skewer a church, how about the Scientologists…

I still say, listen - have respect when speaking - put love in your heart - and go with God.

 

[Answersplease]

Exactly
I thought we were commanded to love ( Peter 4:8 (New International Version)
8 Above all, love each other deeply, because love covers over a multitude of sins.)

And to not pass judgement (Luke 6:37 (New International Version)

Judging Others
37"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.)…

I guess the priests and nun’s taught me wrong… must be Jesus too, when he taught us "forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us.
From Martin Luther’s Small Catechism

“And forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those that trespass against us.”

What does this mean?

“We pray in this petition that our Father in heaven would not look at our sins, or deny our prayer because of them. We are neither worthy of the things for which we pray, nor have we deserved them, but we ask that He would give them all to us by grace, for we daily sin much and surely deserve nothing but punishment. So we too will sincerely forgive and gladly do good to those who sin against us.”

Guess I will just continue to be like a dumb little child …
Oh yeah
Matthew 18:3 (New International Version)
3And he said: "I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

Peace to ALL my brothers and sisters.

Your Catholic leadership has spoken out STRONGLY AGAINST the Freemasons.

Maybe you can give them the message that they should be more UNDERSTANDING and more COOPERATIVE.

Luke 12:51

Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division.

 

[scottj]

Answersplease:
Per Wiki-
Freemasonry explicitly and openly states that it is neither a religion nor a substitute for one. “There is no separate Masonic God”, nor a separate proper name for a deity in any branch of Freemasonry.[28][58]

 

[Answersplease]

Whatever…

There are Freemason materials that say otherwise, but I don’t really care.

You go ahead and work with whoever you want.

 

[scottj]

I will not work with those who partake in worshiping Satan. I will however pray for them that they come to know Jesus Christ as their Lord and Saviour.
And if they come to Jesus as a Mormon, better than remaining a devil worshiper- although of course my own personal preference is that they would become a Catholic.

Do Momons worship the Devil?