Mormon Temple Ceremony and Magic

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zerinus said:
Keep changing the subject until you are dead!

zerinus
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OK I will
Sep. 2005. Mormon Church official admits the 12 million member claim includes many who do not consider themselves Mormon. The Mormon Church is losing members in the United States as fast as converts are joining. Mormon411

exmormon.org/
 
juno24 said:
I doubt Mormon’s believe their “sacred garments” have any magical powers.
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Hi Juno24,
I always enjoy your posts.
I am a former Mormon and have been through the temple many times . Here is the quote from the Initiatory Ordinances in the temple, where the temple garment is first presented to the person who is about to go through the endowment ceremony.
Brother _______, having authority, I place this Garment upon you, which you must wear throughout your life. It represents the Garment given to Adam when he was found naked in the Garden of Eden, and is called the Garment of the Holy Priesthood. Inasmuch as you do not defile it, but are true and faithful to your covenants, it will be a shield and a protection to you against the power of the destroyer until you have finished your work here on earth.
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I will leave it to you to discern whether or not there is any magical power associated with the garment.

God bless,
Paul
 
Ok,
Here are some facts.
The Temple Ceremony of the LDS was actually stolen by Joseph Smith from the Freemasons.
The Freemasons are the ones who killed him as revenge for stealing their rites.
Sounds farfetched but it is indeed so.
WP
 
PaulDupre said:
Hi Juno24,
I always enjoy your posts.
I am a former Mormon and have been through the temple many times . Here is the quote from the Initiatory Ordinances in the temple, where the temple garment is first presented to the person who is about to go through the endowment ceremony.

I will leave it to you to discern whether or not there is any magical power associated with the garment.

God bless,
Paul
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Hmmm. Then the sacrificial blood of the Israelites also had magic powers:

Exodus 12:

23 For the Lord will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the Lord will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you.

zerinus
 
dosdog said:
OK I will
Sep. 2005. Mormon Church official admits the 12 million member claim includes many who do not consider themselves Mormon. The Mormon Church is losing members in the United States as fast as converts are joining. Mormon411

exmormon.org/
Click to expand...
There are many on the roles of the LDS Church who never considered themselves Mormon.

If you discount the “hamburger baptisms” in Mexico, the Pacific Islands and Central and South America, the “basketball baptisms” in the Philippines, the “I want a sponsor so I can go to America” baptisms in Asia and the “young girl in love with an elder” baptisms all over the world, the number of real Mormons is probably closer to 5 million.

These “converts” go inactive almost immediately after their “elder” is transferred away, and would be very surprised that they are still on the roles of the LDS church.

As a Mormon missionary in Taiwan, my companions and I spent a good deal of our time tracking down inactive converts. Most were surprised and embarrased that we still considered them to be Mormons. Most did not even really know what a Mormon was or what the Mormons believe. But many of them (especially the ladies) still had a picture of “their elder” from many years before and asked if we knew him and had his current address.

The activity rate in most of Taiwan was about 5%.

Paul
 
PaulDupre said:
Hi Juno24,
I always enjoy your posts.
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Thanks, Paul. I always enjoy reading your posts, as well.
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PaulDupre:
I am a former Mormon and have been through the temple many times . Here is the quote from the Initiatory Ordinances in the temple, where the temple garment is first presented to the person who is about to go through the endowment ceremony.
Brother _______, having authority, I place this Garment upon you, which you must wear throughout your life. It represents the Garment given to Adam when he was found naked in the Garden of Eden, and is called the Garment of the Holy Priesthood. Inasmuch as you do not defile it, but are true and faithful to your covenants, it will be a shield and a protection to you against the power of the destroyer until you have finished your work here on earth.
Click to expand...
I will leave it to you to discern whether or not there is any magical power associated with the garment.

God bless,
Paul
Click to expand...
The way I see it, whether the Mormons are right or not about being the restored Truth (which, as a Catholic I do not believe they are), they seem to regard their sacred objects much as we Catholics regard our sacramentals.

I would imagine they regard their sacred garments much as we regard our scapulars-- that is, that there is some msytical protection offered, but not necessarily a magical physical “force field” that prevents or deflects assault of some sort. Of course, as I said, my knowledge of the Mormon religion is limited, so I may be wrong-- there certainly may be people who believe their garments offer such magical physical protection, although I have never heard a Mormon describe it that way.
 
zerinus said:
Hmmm. Then the sacrificial blood of the Israelites also had magic powers:

Exodus 12:

23 For the Lord will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the Lord will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you.zerinus
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I don’t understand why you are describing this as “magic”. God doesn’t do magic.
 
zerinus said:
Hmmm. Then the sacrificial blood of the Israelites also had magic powers:

Exodus 12:

23 For the Lord will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the Lord will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you.

zerinus
Click to expand...
The power of God, declared by God himself, has great power. Real power.

Superstition hijacked from the freemasons and foisted on the gullible by womanizing con-man Joe Smith is just false majik. The most Satanic occultism is that which mimics true Godly power.

Paul
 
PaulDupre said:
There are many on the roles of the LDS Church who never considered themselves Mormon.

If you discount the “hamburger baptisms” in Mexico, the Pacific Islands and Central and South America, the “basketball baptisms” in the Philippines, the “I want a sponsor so I can go to America” baptisms in Asia and the “young girl in love with an elder” baptisms all over the world, the number of real Mormons is probably closer to 5 million.

These “converts” go inactive almost immediately after their “elder” is transferred away, and would be very surprised that they are still on the roles of the LDS church.

As a Mormon missionary in Taiwan, my companions and I spent a good deal of our time tracking down inactive converts. Most were surprised and embarrased that we still considered them to be Mormons. Most did not even really know what a Mormons was or what the Mormons believe. But many of them (especially the ladies) still had a picture of “their elder” from many years before and asked if we knew them and had their current address.

The activity rate in most of Taiwan was about 5%.

Paul
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So you are telling me that there are no “inactive Catholics” around? I would hazard a guess that there are far more of them (percentage wise) in the Catholic Church than there are in the LDS Church. Should “inactive Catholics” not be counted Catholics at all?

zerinus
 
juno24 said:
Thanks, Paul. I always enjoy reading your posts, as well.

The way I see it, whether the Mormons are right or not about being the restored Truth (which, as a Catholic I do not believe they are), they seem to regard their sacred objects much as we Catholics regard our sacramentals.

I would imagine they regard their sacred garments much as we regard our scapulars-- that is, that there is some msytical protection offered, but not necessarily a magical physical “force field” that prevents or deflects assault of some sort. Of course, as I said, my knowledge of the Mormon religion is limited, so I may be wrong-- there certainly may be people who believe their garments offer such magical physical protection, although I have never heard a Mormon describe it that way.
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As I don’t wear a scapular, I wouldn’t know, but I appreciate your insight.
God love you,
Paul
 
PaulDupre said:
The power of God, declared by God himself, has great power. Real power.

Superstition hijacked from the freemasons and foisted on the gullible by womanizing con-man Joe Smith is just false majik. The most Satanic occultism is that which mimics true Godly power.
Paul
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That is called twisting and distorting the truth.

zerinus
 
Karin said:
Z…he must of learned from the best subject changer…YOU:p
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Wow! And when you start joining in the debate, that means it is about time I went to bed! Have a nice day everyong.

zerinus
 
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zerinus:
Sorry Eden, LDS are advised not to discuss temple ordinances with non-LDS, or outside the Temple; so I doubt if you will receive much response form LDS to this thread.*

it would seem Z that you can talk about your special underwear 😛

While something that is secret is hidden from the world, something that is sacred means that is special or has some religious signifcance. Mormon garments (underwear) isn’t secret. You can ask any missionary or member of the LDS church about them.
mormon-underwear.com/underwear_faq.html#secret
 
zerinus said:
So you are telling me that there are no “inactive Catholics” around? I would hazard a guess that there are far more of them (percentage wise) in the Catholic Church than there are in the LDS Church. Should “inactive Catholics” not be counted Catholics at all?

zerinus
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First of all, the Catholic Church doesn’t publish conversion rates as evidence of the truthfulness of our religion like the JWs, Mormons, SDAs and the like do.

And yes, of course there are inactive Catholics. But we don’t trick people into getting baptised, nor do we publish wildly inflated missionary statistics. In fact, it takes at least a year of deep discernment, catechesis classes, and weekly mass attendance before a candidate will be accepted for baptism in the Catholic Church. That is why our “convert retention rate”, as you would call it, is very high.

Mormon “conversions” generally are highly emotional affairs lasting only a few weeks from initial contact to baptism. These “converts” know little if anything about what your church teaches or the demands that will be placed on them. They are plants with no roots, so they die as fast as they sprouted. Once the emotion has died down, which it always does, the person generally falls away quickly.

Zerinus, did you ever serve a mission? If so, where?

Paul
 
zerinus said:
I didn’t describe it as magic; you did.

zerinus
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you really are confused Z…YOU described it as MAGIC in your OWN post;)
let me refresh your memory…
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zerinus:
Hmmm. Then the sacrificial blood of the Israelites also had magic powers:
Exodus 12:

23 For the Lord will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the Lord will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you.zerinus
Click to expand...
 
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