Mormons: Can I get a straight answer?

[ParkerD]

I don’t see much difference between the Mormon practice and the Catholic practice except that a Mormon might be excommunicated and need to be rebaptized to gain forgiveness of their serious sins. If a Mormon commits adultery for example there is a good possibility they will be excommunicated. After a time period of repentance they will be allowed back into the church if the church agrees. When they are rebaptized they are forgiven of all of their sins just as they were when they were originally baptized. A Mormon cannot be forgiven of their serious sins without first gaining pardon from the LDS Church. Then they can go ask God for forgiveness, but forgiveness from the Church comes first.

Bart,
The idea you have of “pardon from the LDS Church” is not correct. It is not a case where “forgiveness from the Church comes first.” Forgiveness comes from God, through the atonement of Christ, always. The church decides about membership and worthiness in matters of serious sins that preclude partaking of communion, but that is different than “forgiveness”.

A person could go off and join another church, repent of their sins, and certainly be forgiven for their sins through the atonement of Christ through their sincere and contrite individual, personal repentance. If they wanted membership back into the LDS church if they had been excommunicated, their worthiness is the subject for review by the apostles who hold the keys for discerning worthiness for membership–but if not, then they certainly will be forgiven if they have repented and changed their behavior in their life.

 

[ParkerD]

Mormons have to confess serious sins to their Bishop. They are essentially the kind of sins that Catholics would classify as mortal sins. Their Bishop cannot pronounce absolution, but will impose a penalty as he sees fit or convene a church court procedure if necessary. A Mormon can’t just pray to God and have their serious sins forgiven.

Bart,
By the way, I have not read about “mortal sins”. Are you saying that every time a Catholic goes to “confession”, that means they have committed as serious a sin as adultery? (I certainly have not gotten that impression by reading what Catholic church members have written in comments to me.)

 

[KathleenGee]

I finished reading the link by Rebecca and the Aaronic priesthood…

Only the Levites refused to worship the Golden Calf…and when Moses came down from Mt Sinai, he broke the tablets of the 10 commandments because by rejecting God for the Golden Calf, the Jews already broke the Law.

It was only in Christ that the priesthood was restored and expanded. There is a complete break with the Gospels, the Apostles, the Last Supper, Pentecost – the beginning of the Church and what happened in the Church through the priesthood.

What I do see in Mormonism is a tremendous support for the married couple and family, that the Mormon Church provides a lot of structure and teachings to affirm the marriage and support it.

A formal Mormon priest’s duties in some ways are akin to married deacons in the Catholic Church.

 

[BartBurk]

Bart,
By the way, I have not read about “mortal sins”. Are you saying that every time a Catholic goes to “confession”, that means they have committed as serious a sin as adultery? (I certainly have not gotten that impression by reading what Catholic church members have written in comments to me.)

No, but the only time we are required to go to confession is when a mortal sin is committed. We are also encouraged to confess venial sin, but forgiveness for venial sins does not require confession to a priest. We are required to go to confession at least once a year for any mortal sins.

 

[BartBurk]

Bart,
If by “penalty” you mean the person is advised not to partake of communion, or that their membership may be taken away if that becomes the decision of a church court and their decision is upheld by the apostles, then I suppose you could use that word, but it’s not a word I would use to describe the situation.

The bishop may ask for successive appointments to see how the person is progressing in not repeating a serious sin, but the confession was to God, through sincere prayer, and the help of Christ in overcoming the sin and not repeating it is to be asked by the person in their personal, heartfelt prayers without the bishop needing to “hear” those prayers–(and it would be more than a one time prayer).

When we go to confession we are confessing to God in the presence of a priest. The priest pronounces absolution of all sins as a representative with authority from God. I don’t see a great deal of practical difference in the way Catholics and Mormons view this even though Mormon Bishops don’t actually have any power to forgive sins – they just deal out judgement. And the type of judgement dealt out may vary widely from one Bishop to another.

 

[KathleenGee]

Ordinary venial sins are absolved at Mass at the Confiteor.

The sacrament of confession is required when a mortal sin is committed. One cannot be restored to the Eucharist until the mortal sin is confessed and absolved.

There is an anonymity to confession. It is not community knowledge.

Christ instituted the sacrament of confession after the bondage of sin was broken with Christ’s death and resurrection. On the evening of the Resurrection, He appeared to the Apostles and gave them His power to forgive sin.

 

[BartBurk]

Ordinary venial sins are absolved at Mass at the Confiteor.

The sacrament of confession is required when a mortal sin is committed. One cannot be restored to the Eucharist until the mortal sin is confessed and absolved.

There is an anonymity to confession. It is not community knowledge.

Christ instituted the sacrament of confession after the bondage of sin was broken with Christ’s death and resurrection. On the evening of the Resurrection, He appeared to the Apostles and gave them His power to forgive sin.

I think it is important to mention that we are encouraged to confess venial sins to a priest as a way of being strengthened in our quest for holiness even if such confession is not required. Just so Parker understands, he cannot assume that people in line at the confessional are preparing to confess serious sins.

 

[onenow1]

Rich,

I have not been “studying the Catholic church”–I have read comments by Catholics about their church, and have occasionally looked up articles in the Catholic encyclopedia to understand the beliefs or their basis better.

The quotes you have provided show again that confession places a “delegate” between the person and Christ, or has a symbolism of “medicine” or the symbolism of “good works” (penance) that show an origin in the Mosaic law. So we are indeed talking in circles, and I assure you that the kind of confession you are writing about is not the kind that was practiced in the church during the time of the apostles, since they understood and taught that Christ is the Intercessor and needs no priest to be a “delegate” for Him.

God Himself placed a deligate between humanity and divinity her name is Mary !

God Bless
npatrol:

 

[catholic-rcia]

Rich,

I have not been “studying the Catholic church”–I have read comments by Catholics about their church, and have occasionally looked up articles in the Catholic encyclopedia to understand the beliefs or their basis better.

The quotes you have provided show again that confession places a “delegate” between the person and Christ, or has a symbolism of “medicine” or the symbolism of “good works” (penance) that show an origin in the Mosaic law. So we are indeed talking in circles, and I assure you that the kind of confession you are writing about is not the kind that was practiced in the church during the time of the apostles, since they understood and taught that Christ is the Intercessor and needs no priest to be a “delegate” for Him.

I know that the LDS are asked to confess serious sin to the LDS Bishop as Zerinus pointed out previously. This has been my own experience as well. I am pretty sure you would agree Parker.

I believe the LDS Bishop would give his (name removed by moderator)ut as to guidance. I believe he would suggest where this one needs to make the changes in ones life.

It seems that what you do not like about the Catholic Sacrament of Confession is actually what your church does.

You must be saying that yes we are supposed to confess serious sins to our LDS Bishop but not to God because the Bishop can not stand in for God. So you do not go to God when you confess serious sin, rather unlike the Catholics you go to a man. Am I on the right tract here?

As a Catholic I could not imagine confessing my sins to another man. Actually that would make me feel sick inside. That would be impossible for me to walk into that. I can see all kinds of problems that could arise here.

The Holy Spirit keeps reminding me that when I go to Confession I am going to God. He also lets me know that the Priest, who is in the persona of Christ at that time also goes to confession just like the rest of us.

Getting over vanity is good when it is getting over it for the love of God. Think about that. Think about the beauty in that, just how big it is. The confessional in that sense is like a room with the light of God descending upon you then shooting up towards the heavens.

The LDS confess their sins to a man, then get a mans advice Since the LDS Bishop does not hold the priesthood to forgive sins in the name of Jesus Christ as you yourself have pointed out here?

In my short Catholic life I have to say I would never confess my sins to a mere man unless I had the faith that he was truly a man of God, a Priest. I do

Parker it is the Wisdom of the Church that we get to here the words “Your sins have been absolved, go in the peace of Christ. Yes I ask God to forgive my sins of the day when I go to bed at night and I pledge to try and do better. And I ask for His strength to be able to do this. I start fresh each morning asking God to keep me in tune to others, not to allow me to get to caught up in the daily grind as not to be aware of others and their needs.

At each mass I pray to God to have mercy on me, to help me over come my sins in the week ahead. But sometimes I need to go the extra mile, I do have this need. So I choose to hear the words face to face together with the Priest along with the Whole Church. “Your sins have been absolved, go in the peace of Christ” Because when you walk out its real and it works. You know when you tell your next white lie!

That’s how you know what you have discovered is truly from God. This coming from one who used to mock this truth with disdain…knowing nothing about what I was doing accept breathing the ideas that some one breathe on me. In that I hear

Father forgive them for they know not what they do”

It’s when you discover what is true and still don’t follow it, well that can be a problem.

Rich
www.utahmission.com

 

[catholic-rcia]

I know that the LDS are asked to confess serious sin to the LDS Bishop as Zerinus pointed out previously. This has been my own experience as well. I am pretty sure you would agree Parker.

I believe the LDS Bishop would give his (name removed by moderator)ut as to guidance. I believe he would suggest where this one needs to make the changes in ones life.

It seems that what you do not like about the Catholic Sacrament of Confession is actually what your church does.

You must be saying that yes we are supposed to confess serious sins to our LDS Bishop but not to God because the Bishop can not stand in for God. So you do not go to God when you confess serious sin, rather unlike the Catholics you go to a man. Am I on the right tract here?

As a Catholic I could not imagine confessing my sins to another man. Actually that would make me feel sick inside. That would be impossible for me to walk into that. I can see all kinds of problems that could arise here.

The Holy Spirit keeps reminding me that when I go to Confession I am going to God. He also lets me know that the Priest, who is in the persona of Christ at that time also goes to confession just like the rest of us.

Getting over vanity is good when it is getting over it for the love of God. Think about that. Think about the beauty in that, just how big it is. The confessional in that sense is like a room with the light of God descending upon you then shooting up towards the heavens.

The LDS confess their sins to a man, then get a mans advice Since the LDS Bishop does not hold the priesthood to forgive sins in the name of Jesus Christ as you yourself have pointed out here?

In my short Catholic life I have to say I would never confess my sins to a mere man unless I had the faith that he was truly a man of God, a Priest. I do

Parker it is the Wisdom of the Church that we get to here the words “Your sins have been absolved, go in the peace of Christ. Yes I ask God to forgive my sins of the day when I go to bed at night and I pledge to try and do better. And I ask for His strength to be able to do this. I start fresh each morning asking God to keep me in tune to others, not to allow me to get to caught up in the daily grind as not to be aware of others and their needs.

At each mass I pray to God to have mercy on me, to help me over come my sins in the week ahead. But sometimes I need to go the extra mile, I do have this need. So I choose to hear the words face to face together with the Priest along with the Whole Church. “Your sins have been absolved, go in the peace of Christ” Because when you walk out its real and it works. You know when you tell your next white lie!

That’s how you know what you have discovered is truly from God. This coming from one who used to mock this truth with disdain…knowing nothing about what I was doing accept breathing the ideas that some one breathe on me. In that I hear

Father forgive them for they know not what they do”

It’s when you discover what is true and still don’t follow it, well that can be a problem.

Rich
[www.utahmission.com](http://www.utahmission.com/)

One more thing to think about:
Can you your self Parker see good fruits arising out of the Sacarament of Reconciliation? What might they be to you?
What problems might you see in it?

In Christ
Rich
“We cannot preach forgiveness and reconciliation to others if we are not personally penetrated by it.”
*~ Pope Benedict XVI *

• Lenten Message to Priests*

 

[KathleenGee]

Yes, we are being encouraged to make confession a more frequent use of the sacrament. It definitely strengthens one’s heart and soul.

When I said that the confession is anonymous…we can choose to not be seen…so let’s say then…a Mormon bishop would not even see the penitent…and this also protects the penitent from being blackmailed…if someone were to be so deviant…I am not directing that to a Catholic priest or Mormon bishop…but it is good as well not to be seen…

The priests always tell me they are very aware of their own sinfulness when hearing others’ sins, so they don’t have this sanctimonious attitude towards the penitent.

The other reality is that at absolution, one experiences a great and loving presence of Christ…supernatural that no priest can create. Christ is present in the priest…

Christ is the High Priest. And the new foundation for our priesthood.

 

[catholic-rcia]

Yes, we are being encouraged to make confession a more frequent use of the sacrament. It definitely strengthens one’s heart and soul.

When I said that the confession is anonymous…we can choose to not be seen…so let’s say then…a Mormon bishop would not even see the penitent…and this also protects the penitent from being blackmailed…if someone were to be so deviant…I am not directing that to a Catholic priest or Mormon bishop…but it is good as well not to be seen…

The priests always tell me they are very aware of their own sinfulness when hearing others’ sins, so they don’t have this sanctimonious attitude towards the penitent.

The other reality is that at absolution, one experiences a great and loving presence of Christ…supernatural that no priest can create. Christ is present in the priest…

Christ is the High Priest. And the new foundation for our priesthood.

My experiance as well Kathleen. The great loving real presence of Christ. Not saying this so Parker can hear this. Its just fact, real…
In Christ
Rich

 

[ParkerD]

I know that the LDS are asked to confess serious sin to the LDS Bishop as Zerinus pointed out previously. This has been my own experience as well. I am pretty sure you would agree Parker.

I believe the LDS Bishop would give his (name removed by moderator)ut as to guidance. I believe he would suggest where this one needs to make the changes in ones life.

It seems that what you do not like about the Catholic Sacrament of Confession is actually what your church does.

Catholic-RCIA,

No, there are pretty substantial differences. An LDS member is required to meet with a bishop as far as confession only when the sin has been a serious sin such as adultery or pre-marital similar sin or “petting”, or breaking the law of the land, or child or spouse abuse, or similar serious sins that involve hurting someone else and hurting oneself. This is so the bishop can be a “second witness” as to the repentance of the person, by the Holy Ghost confirming to the bishop when the person has overcome the tendency that led to that sin, especially if it was a repeated sin.

The repenting person is the “first witness”–they should be repentant and repenting, through prayer and confession to Heavenly Father and the Savior, and through having asked the forgiveness of the person they harmed by their act, including setting things right as much as is possible, and through having asked forgiveness from God through the Savior’s atoning grace. Until a person in that situation has been told by the bishop that they have permission to partake of communion, they should pass the communion tray on to the next person without partaking of it. This is a major role of the bishop in this kind of case–to watch over the sacredness of communion.

You must be saying that yes we are supposed to confess serious sins to our LDS Bishop but not to God because the Bishop can not stand in for God. So you do not go to God when you confess serious sin, rather unlike the Catholics you go to a man. Am I on the right tract here?

Absolutely not on the right track–you have totally misunderstood. The bishop doesn’t “stand in for God”–that is correct. But the serious sin was to have been confessed to God before meeting with the bishop. The person is to know that their primary relationship is with Heavenly Father and the Savior as far as staying worthy and confessing their sins, each and every day. They should, if living rightly, never get to the “big sins” and never need to confess to a bishop about “big sins” because they will have caught themselves in time through confessing to God about sins that would lead up to the “big sins”. (But people don’t always “live rightly”, so there are some few cases, but not many. I was a bishop once–I know first-hand. The cases I dealt with involved teens, so those cases weren’t adultery.)

The Holy Spirit keeps reminding me that when I go to Confession I am going to God. He also lets me know that the Priest, who is in the persona of Christ at that time also goes to confession just like the rest of us.

Yes, that is significantly different, since an LDS bishop knows he holds keys about membership in the church and about being a “common judge” and thus having discernment through the Holy Ghost, but that he is not “in the persona of Christ” and that the person has a personal and direct relationship with the living Christ, the Savior and Redeemer and Advocate with the Father. An LDS bishop would confess to Heavenly Father and to a stake president and be immediately released from his calling if he had committed a serious sin. He would then be on probation for membership until a church court would meet and consider the matter in a confidential review of the circumstances.

For other sins, the bishop confesses them to Heavenly Father and is on the same “plane” as everyone else in that all need to be doing that in their personal prayers, and asking forgiveness if they have offended someone.

Getting over vanity is good when it is getting over it for the love of God. Think about that. Think about the beauty in that, just how big it is. The confessional in that sense is like a room with the light of God descending upon you then shooting up towards the heavens.

Yes, that sounds like getting over “vanity”. But trusting one’s relationship with God directly is a case of needing humility and needing the Holy Ghost so that one knows deep inside that they are “right with God.”

The LDS confess their sins to a man, then get a mans advice Since the LDS Bishop does not hold the priesthood to forgive sins in the name of Jesus Christ as you yourself have pointed out here?

Heavenly Father and the Savior forgive sins. The priesthood is not given to a bishop so he can be a “stand-in” or forgive sins, and the person should not have the impression they are being forgiven by the bishop–their forgiveness relationship is with Christ who is their Advocate with the Father.

In my short Catholic life I have to say I would never confess my sins to a mere man unless I had the faith that he was truly a man of God, a Priest. I do

I’ve never had the personal situation in my life, so I wouldn’t know, but I certainly know the Bible well enough to know that Christ didn’t delegate in the way you have described for a person to act as though He were there present. He is present already, as the person confesses to God in prayer in the name of Jesus Christ.

I’ll add more later.

 

[ParkerD]

One more thing to think about:
Can you your self Parker see good fruits arising out of the Sacarament of Reconciliation? What might they be to you?
What problems might you see in it?

In Christ
Rich
“We cannot preach forgiveness and reconciliation to others if we are not personally penetrated by it.”
*~ Pope Benedict XVI *

• Lenten Message to Priests*

Catholic-RCIA,

I would not want to discourage anyone from going to confession if that is their belief and the way they have been taught to do things, so I don’t know that I should answer your last question. I would hope that each person does as you noted earlier, prays and asks forgiveness directly from God the Father and the Savior every night, and that they learn to trust their relationship with Them and to feel in their heart when they have been forgiven through having sincerely repented of their sin and changed their life by not doing it again. Then they will have new growth items in their life, since relationships are almost always going to involve doing something that will offend or hurt someone in some way and both will need to be communicating and forgiving each other and growing in their relationship.

Thus the love manifest in how one treats others, and their compassion, grow as they repent and change. This is my hope, that people have this kind of growth in their life.

 

[catholic-rcia]

Catholic-RCIA,

I would not want to discourage anyone from going to confession if that is their belief and the way they have been taught to do things, so I don’t know that I should answer your last question. I would hope that each person does as you noted earlier, prays and asks forgiveness directly from God the Father and the Savior every night, and that they learn to trust their relationship with Them and to feel in their heart when they have been forgiven through having sincerely repented of their sin and changed their life by not doing it again. Then they will have new growth items in their life, since relationships are almost always going to involve doing something that will offend or hurt someone in some way and both will need to be communicating and forgiving each other and growing in their relationship.

quote]

Fair enough

I would like to continue this Parker and if you don’t mind here is some ground work that should interest you.
The numbers you see our for Scripture reference, along with the early Church Fathers writings. When you get to the page scroll up to 1422
scborromeo.org/ccc/p2s2c2a4.htm#1456

Parker, It should go un said that Catholics always turn to Christ in prayer for the forgiveness of sins…you already know this. The Sacrament of Confession is a very special and unique way to enter into Christ’s Mercy withion the Whole of the Church.

What I am hearing from you reminds me of those who say, like I used to say:

“I don’t need Church, organized religion, a Priest, because I am with God in the mountains, or in my Garden”

Confession is a need to be reconciled to God within the Body of Christ, His Church. We are all members of this One Body. When one part suffers we all suffer, when one part feels joy we all feel joy"

The Catholic Priesthood was established by Jesus at Pentacost, the beginning fo the Church. For the forgiveness of sins. This is why Jesus died for us as we are all sinners in need of Him. Only with Him and through Him can we be sinless. Nothing we can do can accomplish this. We cannot become Saints, only Jesus can make us Saints. By the Blood of His Cross.

God, the Father of mercies,
through the death and the resurrection of his Son
has reconciled the world to himself
and sent the Holy Spirit among us
for the forgiveness of sins;
through the ministry of the Church
may God give you pardon and peace,
and I absolve you from your sins in the name of the Father, and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit

Only God forgives sin
1441 Only God forgives sins.39 Since he is the Son of God, Jesus says of himself, “The Son of man has authority on earth to forgive sins” and exercises this divine power: "Your sins are forgiven."40 Mk 2:5,10; Lk 7:48
Further, by virtue of his divine authority he gives this power to men to exercise in his name.41 Jn 20:21-23
Reconciliation with the Church
1443 During his public life Jesus not only forgave sins, but also made plain the effect of this forgiveness: he reintegrated forgiven sinners into the community of the People of God from which sin had alienated or even excluded them. A remarkable sign of this is the fact that Jesus receives sinners at his table, a gesture that expresses in an astonishing way both God’s forgiveness and the return to the bosom of the People of God.44
1444 In imparting to his apostles his own power to forgive sins the Lord also gives them the authority to reconcile sinners with the Church. This ecclesial dimension of their task is expressed most notably in Christ’s solemn words to Simon Peter: "I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."45 "The office of binding and loosing which was given to Peter was also assigned to the college of the apostles united to its head."46
1445 The words bind and loose mean: whomever you exclude from your communion, will be excluded from communion with God; whomever you receive anew into your communion, God will welcome back into his. *Reconciliation with the Church is inseparable from reconciliation with God. *

 

[zaffiroborant]

Parker, It should go un said that Catholics always turn to Christ in prayer for the forgiveness of sins…you already know this.

No he doesn’t know this at all, and what’s more you will never convince him of this. He has decided exactly what we believe and no amount of words will convince him otherwise.

For others who are honestly here to learn and will actually read and ponder our teachings here is Canon Law on Confession:

Can. 987 In order that the faithful may receive the saving remedy of the sacrament of penance, they must be so disposed that, repudiating the sins they have committed and having the purpose of amending their lives, they turn back to God.

Can. 988 §1 The faithful are bound to confess, in kind and in number, all grave sins committed after baptism, of which after careful examination of conscience they are aware, which have nor yet been directly pardoned by the keys of the Church, and which have not been confessed in an individual confession.
§2 The faithful are recommended to confess also venial sins.

Can. 989 All the faithful who have reached the age of discretion are bound faithfully to confess their grave sins at least once a year.

And something from Father Vincent Serpa explaining it on another thread.

 

[ParkerD]

No he doesn’t know this at all, and what’s more you will never convince him of this. He has decided exactly what we believe and no amount of words will convince him otherwise.

For others who are honestly here to learn and will actually read and ponder our teachings here is Canon Law on Confession:

And something from Father Vincent Serpa explaining it on another thread.

Z,

So I am reading that they should “confess their grave sins at least once a year.” That sounds different than what Catholic-RCIA wrote, and I have not “decided what you believe”–I think it is unclear what is believed about confession and repentance in the things I’ve read, especially when someone writes that repentance is not about “progressing”, as someone wrote in posts conversing with me.

By the way, Z, it’s enough–it’s become tiresome. Bye.

 

[catholic-rcia]

Z,

So I am reading that they should “confess their grave sins at least once a year.” That sounds different than what Catholic-RCIA wrote, and I have not “decided what you believe”–I think it is unclear what is believed about confession and repentance in the things I’ve read, especially when someone writes that repentance is not about “progressing”, as someone wrote in posts conversing with me.

Almost live!

I myself confess at least once a year. (not enough) Sometimes I will refrain from Holy Communion out of love for Jesus. He wants me without the guilt and shame. As that’s Satans game. Mortal sins need to be confessed quickly. There is no way I progess anywhere accept to be with Jesus, To progress is not why I go to Confession. I go to get closer to Jesus, so that He can transform me into what He knows I can be. Instead of the word progressing I would say a relationship with Christ who causes all progression. I am not the cause of that. I am along for the ride. Again Parker, the wooden beam upon His back, the lost lamb being carried home. Confesion is jumping up into His arms to be carried. Some go to Confession daily as it is the porthole to Sainthood.

How many times one goes is up to each soul. We don’t get called in and we don’t go because we have been caught. Sometimes maybe reluctanly due to a lack of faith, but always willingly do to a lack of pride, even if only a bit.

To bed I go!

 

[KathleenGee]

There is great grace of the living action of Christ to further strengthen us to avoid sin and likewise, grow in grace.

As I shared before, the Scriptures do say Christ gave His authority to forgive sins to His apostles, the first Ministers of the Blood of Christ.

Christ never left us alone…It is through the institution the Church…through the holy priesthood and the sacraments, that Christ is continually made present to us.

To fully understand more the context of Scripture, – it is not meant for us to pick and choose what we want to believe – you have to then see how the Apostles began to integrate the faith among the people. And Mormonism refuses to do so.

 

[ParkerD]

There is great grace of the living action of Christ to further strengthen us to avoid sin and likewise, grow in grace.

As I shared before, the Scriptures do say Christ gave His authority to forgive sins to His apostles, the first Ministers of the Blood of Christ.

Christ never left us alone…It is through the institution the Church…through the holy priesthood and the sacraments, that Christ is continually made present to us.

To fully understand more the context of Scripture, – it is not meant for us to pick and choose what we want to believe – you have to then see how the Apostles began to integrate the faith among the people. And Mormonism refuses to do so.

Kathleen,

Mormonism doesn’t “refuse to do so.” You have no idea whether Mormonism “integrates the faith among the people.” How would you know one way or the other about that?

As far as the one, single verse which has been used by priests to foster the idea that Christ gave priests the authority to forgive sins, that verse appears in the book of John, and was talking about a situation specifically dealing with the Apostles and the Holy Ghost, and if one reads the epistles of John one is not confused at all–John did not say the priests had the authority to forgive sins, but instead said:

“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” (1 John 1:9) “…we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:” (1 John 2:1)

John also uses the word “confess” to describe testifying that “Jesus Christ is come in the flesh” (1 John 4:2) The emphasis is on believing that Jesus really did come to earth, really is the Messiah, really does give the grace that opens the way to eternal life through being “cleansed from all unrighteousness” (meaning there is ongoing repentance), really does teach us to love as Christ loved, and really is eternally alive and is the single Advocate with the Father.

Peace to you and all.