Most are damned?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Maxirad
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
ChunkMonk said:
You should say:

“Good for you that you are orthodox and actually listen to the words of our Lord instead of changing or ignoring them due to a desire to satisfy secular attitudes.”
Click to expand...
That is not right or fair. The “most are damned” position is not the only “orthodox” one allowed to Catholics, and you would know this if you just took the time to study the whole question.
 
Last edited:
I’m not so sure one can be totally orthodox and not believe that most are damned, but I agree the question is not quite as sure as being settled. I have a strong feeling that someone who thinks most are saved is probably unorthodox in other areas.
 
ChunkMonk said:
I’m not so sure one can be totally orthodox and not believe that most are damned, but I agree the question is not quite as sure as being settled. I have a strong feeling that someone who thinks most are saved is probably unorthodox in other areas.
Click to expand...
No, that’s also not fair. There are solid reasons for going the other direction, all based on orthodox belief in Catholic dogma. My own position is based not on universalism, but based on what the Church herself teaches about God and grace. I myself support Ludwig Ott’s reasoning for this position (he does not advocate it over the other, but just explains how it can also be so).

My counter to those who take the rigorist position is that they can be less than orthodox on the question of God’s sovereignty, putting too much emphasis on man’s free will.
 
Right, so it kind of feeds into that old paradox about how God is omnipotent, but we still have free will.
 
Maxirad said:
What should I say to a Catholic who insists that most human beings are damned upon death? I have read this blog commentary by Jimmy Akin, but…
Click to expand...
Well, first, keep in mind that Augustine believed that most would go to hell. But I would argue that it was all based more on Philosophy than theology because he did assume God’s vast love for us.

So you need to learn how to argue against St. Augustine (which can be done) first in order to reach someone who today holds that view.
 
Last edited:
A great reason why mortification, charity, and a perfection of the virtues should be strived for.
 
Socrates92 said:
Right, so it kind of feeds into that old paradox about how God is omnipotent, but we still have free will.
Click to expand...
Right, and again, how this is reconciled depends. Are you Thomist or Molinist?

Augustine is a bit too old and undeveloped in this question, and I don’t even take his opinions on it without passing through later thinkers like Aquinas, Banez, and Molina.
 
It is good to allow God to sanctify us so we can be as holy as we can. We can focus on Him using all the helps He gave us, and desire that He gets the glory and that we can love Him more each day.

I like St. Pio’s saying: “Pray, hope, and don’t worry!”

There are so many wonderful spiritual books available to inspire us.

Pray much!
 
I don’t know anything about Molinism, other than what I just gleaned from a quick Google. Is he much different than Aquinas?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top