Mother Teresa's Crisis of Faith

  • Thread starter Thread starter thechrismyster
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Well, there is fodder here for believers and unbelievers, isn’t there? For me, in the final analysis, these disclosures change nothing, add nothing, and subtract nothing. But they will furnish material for a lot of observations from all sides of the table.

For those who doubt, no explanation is adequate; for those who believe, no explanation is necessary.
 
exiled said:
How many of us, in human relationships and in our relationship with God, put much emphasis on some “burning in our bosom”, as though it is the be-all-end-all in faith. And then, when we determine that we are not “being fed”, abandon Our Lord.
She lived by faith. That is, believed what she could not see or feel. She simply lived, “Jesus, I trust in you.”
“Crisis of faith” is, in my mind, a misnomer. “Crisis of feeling” might work, but I think her faith was far from in “crisis”.
Click to expand...
Hey, I missed that! That is a jibe at Mormonism! There is an answer to it though. Mother Teresa was indeed a great and saintly woman, and the acts of charity and kindness that she performed will without doubt earn her a great reward in heaven. The Protestants would tell you that it doesn’t matter what works you do; all you have to do is to believe, and you are saved! Don’t you believe it. It don’t work that way. What works you do matters an awful lot. However, the prolonged “night of darkness” that she experienced is very telling. That spiritual witness, assurance, or testimony that she sought, that dispels all doubt and darkness, and fills the soul with light, joy, and great hope, is a precious gift of the Holy Spirit that can only come to one who is, or seeks to become a member of the true Church of Christ, which currently is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. It cannot come in any other way. That is what she was yearning for in her innermost soul, not knowing where to find it. She will I am convinced find it in the next life.

zerinus
 
Rolltide said:
Examining her private papers is a mandatory part of the canonization investigatory process.
Click to expand...
If you want to become a saint, I will show you an easy way. Join the LDS Church! We are all saints in here!

zerinus
 
zerinus said:
Hey, I missed that! That is a jibe at Mormonism! There is an answer to it though. Mother Teresa was indeed a great and saintly woman, and the acts of charity and kindness that she performed will without doubt earn her a great reward in heaven. The Protestants would tell you that it doesn’t matter what works you do; all you have to do is to believe, and you are saved! Don’t you believe it. It don’t work that way. What works you do matters an awful lot. However, the prolonged “night of darkness” that she experienced is very telling. That spiritual witness, assurance, or testimony that she sought, that dispels all doubt and darkness, and fills the soul with light, joy, and great hope, is a precious gift of the Holy Spirit that can only come to one who is, or seeks to become a member of the true Church of Christ, which currently is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. It cannot come in any other way. That is what she was yearning for in her innermost soul, not knowing where to find it. She will I am convinced find it in the next life.

zerinus
Click to expand...
Zerinus,
There is no witness, assurance or testimony that can dispel *all *doubt and/darkness. That would mean perfect faith, which none of us can possibly have, given our fallen human nature. And to suggest that you, or any LDS does have perfect faith would be putting yourselves about the Lord Jesus Christ.
I’m not a Biblical scholar, but isn’t hope referred to as a belief or trust in that which is unseen? If that is the case, Mother Theresa had greater hope, by it’s proper definition, than anyone who claims their soul is filled with light.
The only “telling” thing about Mother Theresa’s spiritual darkness, is that Christ strength shined in spite of her personal weaknesses. He made her strong, because she allowed Him to work in and through her.
Waaayyyyy too much emphasis on what feels good in today’s world.
 
Zerinus,
Mother Teresa should be a lesson to you and to all Mormons. Per your post and the experience of all ex-Mos, Mormons are never allowed to express (or feel) any doubts, fears or sadness at any time. In Mormondom, that would be an indication of personal unworthiness, because all Mormons know that the only reason one is not shiny and grinning every moment is because he has committed some grave sin that has driven the Holy Ghost away.

It is this belief that drives so many Mormon women to prescription anti-depressants, and why Utah has the nation’s highest teen suicide rate. No LDS can ever be genuine or honest about his feelings at any time, because it would result in gossip and condemnation from the other “saints”. Mormons learn this painful truth very early in life.

If Mormons would recognize that everyone has the occasional “long dark night of the soul” and realize that it is one of the normal trials of life, then perhaps Mormons could become genuinely happy instead of desperately play-acting at being happy, as has been my consistent experience with Mormons.

God bless,
Paul
 
PaulDupre said:
Zerinus,
Mother Teresa should be a lesson to you and to all Mormons. Per your post and the experience of all ex-Mos, Mormons are never allowed to express (or feel) any doubts, fears or sadness at any time. In Mormondom, that would be an indication of personal unworthiness, because all Mormons know that the only reason one is not shiny and grinning every moment is because he has committed some grave sin that has driven the Holy Ghost away.

It is this belief that drives so many Mormon women to prescription anti-depressants, and why Utah has the nation’s highest teen suicide rate. No LDS can ever be genuine or honest about his feelings at any time, because it would result in gossip and condemnation from the other “saints”. Mormons learn this painful truth very early in life.

If Mormons would recognize that everyone has the occasional “long dark night of the soul” and realize that it is one of the normal trials of life, then perhaps Mormons could become genuinely happy instead of desperately play-acting at being happy, as has been my consistent experience with Mormons.

God bless,
Paul
Click to expand...
You either know nothing about Mormonism or you are deliberately misrepresenting what you know. More likely the latter.

zerinus
 
zerinus said:
You either know nothing about Mormonism or you are deliberately misrepresenting what you know. More likely the latter.

zerinus
Click to expand...
Zerinus,
Why would you say, “more likely the latter.” Have you had lots of negatives from this particular poster?
 
40.png
Zerinus:
That spiritual witness, assurance, or testimony that she sought, that dispels all doubt and darkness, and fills the soul with light, joy, and great hope, is a precious gift of the Holy Spirit that can only come to one who is, or seeks to become a member of the true Church of Christ, which currently is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Click to expand...
Wow. I have a wealth of Mormon friends but every one of them, to the man, has revealed moments of doubt- some prolonged and agonizing. These are not jack Mormons (their term, not mine), but devout Mormons who go to Temple and embrace their many callings: seminary teachers, scout leaders, relief society, and visiting teachers.

The next time we have discussions of faith (some of them try to convert me from time to time) I will be able to demonstrate- by your words- that the Holy Spirit cannot have given them that precious gift because they still have moments of darkness and they do not have absolute hope and joy. Since the Holy Spirit has not gifted that to them, then they cannot truly be Mormon.

Thank you for that. Sometimes I think I am getting through to them but then they will close down and back away. Being patient, I await the next time that they will try to convert me so that we can talk again. In the interim, I pray that the little seeds of wisdom will grow into a beautiful faith with reason (the one thing lacking in the LDS church.) If I can show them that their temple worship, tithing, praying, scripture reading, priesthoods, and callings have all been for naught, they may yet see the light and be welcomed home to the one true Church. You have just given me inspiration for our next series of chats.

Peace be with you.
 
deb216 said:
Wow. I have a wealth of Mormon friends but every one of them, to the man, has revealed moments of doubt- some prolonged and agonizing. These are not jack Mormons (their term, not mine), but devout Mormons who go to Temple and embrace their many callings: seminary teachers, scout leaders, relief society, and visiting teachers.
Click to expand...
Some Church members have stronger testimonies than others. That is true. But that does not fall into the same category as the experience that Mother Teresa is describing.

Many of the people who join the LDS Church, usually do so after going through a period of doubt and darkness similar to what Mother Teresa is describing; and are humbled by it to be led to seek divine help out of it; and then are led by the Spirit to the LDS Church, where their doubt and darkness is forever dispelled.

Those who are born into the Church too have to obtain their testimonies at some point; and some of them go through a period of doubt and uncertainty before appealing to the Lord in fervent prayer to obtain it.

It is also true that some Church members sometimes lose their testimonies altogether, and struggle to remain active in the Church. That usually happens because of transgression. Such people, unless they repent and regain their testimonies, usually go inactive, or leave the Church, or apostatize.

None of this, however, is comparable to the experience that Mother Teresa is describing. Such an experience never happens to a fully active worthy member of the LDS Church who is living his/her life in the Church as they should.

zerinus
 
zerinus said:
None of us knows exactly whether or not someone is living life as they should. You have no idea what kinds of sinful actions and thoughts another person is having, no matter how pristine they may look from the outside. Jesus repeatedly pointed out the hypocrisy of the Pharisees who looked so pious from the outside, yet inside they were full of everything that lacked mercy and true Christian love for other men.
I know nothing about the LDS church, except what I read on these boards (and I don’t read them alot). However, this stuff you’re putting forth on this thread, Zerinus, about total light and such, is absurd. That is reserved only for those in Heaven, and we are told by St. Paul to persevere until death. Now, why would such perseverance be necessary of one had such perfection of faith that you claim? Additionally, if people of the Biblical era were walking with such perfection, how could an apostacy have taken place? Some true Mormon in apostolic times (or whenever this apostacy occurred), who did everything as he/she should, apparently fell away? Or is it that nobody believed the testimony of the earliest Mormons, and that is how the church disappeared? Cannot have been too strong or convincing a testimony.🤷
Click to expand...
 
exiled said:
None of us knows exactly whether or not someone is living life as they should. You have no idea what kinds of sinful actions and thoughts another person is having, no matter how pristine they may look from the outside. Jesus repeatedly pointed out the hypocrisy of the Pharisees who looked so pious from the outside, yet inside they were full of everything that lacked mercy and true Christian love for other men.
Click to expand...
If I had been judging a particular individual, you would have been right. But I was not. I was making a general observation. As a general observation, what I had said is a true statement.
I know nothing about the LDS church, except what I read on these boards (and I don’t read them alot). However, this stuff you’re putting forth on this thread, Zerinus, about total light and such, is absurd. That is reserved only for those in Heaven, and we are told by St. Paul to persevere until death. Now, why would such perseverance be necessary of one had such perfection of faith that you claim?
Click to expand...
You are the one who is talking about “total light” and “perfection of faith”. I did not. You are putting words in my mouth which I did not say.
Additionally, if people of the Biblical era were walking with such perfection, how could an apostacy have taken place? Some true Mormon in apostolic times (or whenever this apostacy occurred), who did everything as he/she should, apparently fell away? Or is it that nobody believed the testimony of the earliest Mormons, and that is how the church disappeared? Cannot have been too strong or convincing a testimony.🤷
Click to expand...
Apostasy occurs because of transgression. People can be righteous and then fall into transgression; or they can be sinners, but repent and become righteous. The rest of what you have said in this passage does not make sense. I don’t know what you are talking about.

I find your posts to be logically incoherent and lacking in clarity of thought and logical continuity. You appear to be unable to think through things very clearly. That makes your posts difficult to reply to. That is why I had not replied to your previous post.

zerinus
 
**Zerinus:**QUOTE=zerinus;2676103]If I had been judging a particular individual, you would have been right. But I was not. I was making a general observation. As a general observation, what I had said is a true statement.

**Exiled:**From your post on pg 2,
**Zerinus:**B]" However, the prolonged “night of darkness” that she experienced is very telling. That spiritual witness, assurance, or testimony that she sought, that dispels all doubt and darkness, and fills the soul with light, joy, and great hope, is a precious gift of the Holy Spirit that can only come to one who is, or seeks to become a member of the true Church of Christ, which currently is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. It cannot come in any other way. That is what she was yearning for in her innermost soul, not knowing where to find it. She will I am convinced find it in the next life."**Exiled:**You are judging Mother Theresa here.

**Zerinus:**COLOR=“DarkRed]You are the one who is talking about “total light” and “perfection of faith”. I did not. You are putting words in my mouth which I did not say./COLOR]
**Exiled:**here is the quote…
Zerinus:"B]that dispels all doubt and darkness, and fills the soul with light, joy, and great hope,”
“**where their doubt and darkness is forever dispelled/**B].” (from your post to deb)

**Zerinus:**COLOR=“DarkRed”]Apostasy occurs because of transgression. People can be righteous and then fall into transgression; or they can be sinners, but repent and become righteous. The rest of what you have said in this passage does not make sense. I don’t know what you are talking about.
**Exiled:**COLOR=“Black”]Well, Zerinus, I would agree that I am not the brightest crayon in the box, so let me try again.
How did the original apostacy occur? Did the last faithful, 1st century Mormon apostacize, and therefore spread lies, or did no one believe the true testimony of that last Mormon?
**Zerinus:**COLOR=“DarkRed”]I find your posts to be logically incoherent and lacking in clarity of thought and logical continuity. You appear to be unable to think through things very clearly.**Exiled:/**COLOR]Perhaps someone else on the board, with more rhetorical savvy, can help rework my question so that it is logical and coherent.

** Zerinus:That makes your posts difficult to reply to. That is why I had not replied to your previous post.
zerinus**
 
What did I say about being a bright crayon? I’ve never used the multiple quote system, and it appears I’ve really made a mess of my previous post.
That said, I’m sure you can follow is Z, because most of the quotes are yours.
For anyone else who may read this, good luck!😊
 
zerinus said:
It is also true that some Church members sometimes lose their testimonies altogether, and struggle to remain active in the Church. That usually happens because of transgression. Such people, unless they repent and regain their testimonies, usually go inactive, or leave the Church, or apostatize.
zerinus
Click to expand...
I rest my case.
Paul
 
From our parish bulletin this weekend - I think Fr. Perrone explained this beautifully:

Word got out that Mother Teresa’s diary shows she had doubts about God’s existence. This is just the sort of “religious news” the secular press wants. The media today is set against faith generally and against the Catholic Church specifically. Either not knowing the difference between the trials of faith experienced by the devout and deliberate atheism embraced by the impious–or pretending not to know the difference–the media exploits this discovery to promote its own anti-religious prejudices. One of the most prominent spokesmen for the faith was allegedly herself unconvinced. This is a jejune and silly way to interpret the facts and reveals the naivete of those who lack understanding or the malice of those who know better. One should not conclude that Mother Teresa ever committed a sin against faith, a willful refusal to believe, nor that she, remaining a religious all the while, was a hypocrite. …

Read the rest HERE

~Liza
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top