Muhammad Mentioned 34 Times in the Bible?

[Sam_777]

Emotions all too often do indeed get in the way of logical reasoning.

Hamba, since you are speaking about logic, is it logic that God sent His Word to all nations, then suddenly decided to send a sinful man to contradict all His Word teachings !!!

 

[wwolverine]

WOAH! NOWAY! gasp I did not know that!
Okay okay, it’s too obvious I’m being sarcastic. But seriously!
Jesus (pbuh) is mentioned in the Holy Quran because muslims believe that he is a prophet sent down from God.
Muhammed (pbuh) is not mentioned in the bible because he is yet to exist. Also I do not believe in the bible even though it still has some true and good teachings.
tu comprendre senor?

wasalam

Zaki, what belony you are saying?

If Jesus was foretold in the Books of Isiah, almost 800 years before the birth, How come Mohammed was not foretold who came only 500 years after Jesus?

As for your believing Holy Bible its sad, as for you its a corrupted book but for Christians its the Word of One and Only One God, Who was, Is and Will always be.

 

[jakasaki]

Since it is claimed by muslims all over that the Torah and the Bible are “corrupt” and have been changed over time, Jews & Christians would have “corrupted” every single verse pertaining to this “mohamad found in the Bible & Torah” deal.

There would be no Moses & mohamad comparison

There would be no Jesus & parachete comparison

There would be no Song of Songs comparison

etc… etc… etc…

They, muslims will go to any length to discredit the Bible, and, the same time, they will go to the same length to state loudly that mohamad in found in the Bible.

Seriously!!! I believe member SedonaMan has been asking all along.

Why can’t the koran and mohamad just stand on their own without looking in the Bible.

Nothing will change with this conversation today, tomorrow or the next day or even the next year(s)

If Deuteronomy 18.18 was refering to mohamad’s comming by Judaism/Jews, well then, when the Jews of Arabia were testing mohamads prophetic called he would have passed.

But alas, mohamad failed the Jews testing of the time and therefore D:18:18 does not speak of him.

And for the muslim posters, if you go any Jewish forum site on the web and post this D:18:18 vs K:7:157 the Jews will make it clear.

In closing:

The Jews know D:18:18 does not speak of mohamad
The Christians know D:18:18 does not speak of mohamad

 

[hamba2han]

The reason why I don’t post here as often as before is because my threads are being deleted.

It seems to me that forum participants are more interested in talking fluff than to learn about and engage in substantive dialogue on the true teachings of Islam as taught by the great Muslim teachers in history.

 

[hamba2han]

Hamba, since you are speaking about logic, is it logic that God sent His Word to all nations, then suddenly decided to send a sinful man to contradict all His Word teachings !!!

ALL nations you say??.. How is the following for logic then bearing in mind this poignant reminder from BibleGateway.com…

((The most reliable early manuscripts and other ancient witnesses do NOT have Mark 16:9-20.))…

… And so, which of the following Biblical verses is more likely to be true?

EITHER

He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the good news to ALL creation. … Mark 16:15

OR

"I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel." … (Matthew 15:24)

and also

"These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: 'Do NOT go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel." … (Matthew 10:5-6)

OR

… perhaps Christians are saying that there is NO contradiction between the above Biblical verses found in Mark and Matthew?

It makes absolutely no sense at all that Jesus (pbuh) would spend the entire period of his ministry preaching to the lost sheep of Israel only and then immediately after his alleged crucifixion orders his disciples to go to all nations and preach to all people.

If the divine message that he brought was intended for all of humankind, then why couldn’t he declare it in no uncertain terms right from the beginning of his mission like what Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) did?

How was the danger to his life faced by Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) any lesser than the danger that Prophet Jesus (pbuh) faced in carrying out his own mission?

The Lord protected Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) from his enemies and so why couldn’t He do the same for Prophet Jesus (pbuh)?

If I were to accept the Christian explanation that it was all part of the grand strategy of God, then I would have to conclude that Jesus (pbuh) … and by extension God Himself… intentionally lied when he said “I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel” in Matthew 15:24.

I just cannot accept that it was necessary for Jesus (pbuh), or any of the Prophets of God (peace be upon them all), to lie about their mission because this is something which clearly breaks one of the Ten Commandments not to bear false witness.

How on earth is it possible that a true Prophet of God will intentionally break any of the Commandments in order to spread the Message of the Lord?:

 

[Booklover]

ALL nations you say??.. How is the following for logic then bearing in mind this poignant reminder from BibleGateway.com…

((The most reliable early manuscripts and other ancient witnesses do NOT have Mark 16:9-20.))…

… And so, which of the following Biblical verses is more likely to be true?

EITHER

He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the good news to ALL creation. … Mark 16:15

OR

"I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel." … (Matthew 15:24)

and also

"These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: 'Do NOT go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel." … (Matthew 10:5-6)

OR

… perhaps Christians are saying that there is NO contradiction between the above Biblical verses found in Mark and Matthew?

It makes absolutely no sense at all that Jesus (pbuh) would spend the entire period of his ministry preaching to the lost sheep of Israel only and then immediately after his alleged crucifixion orders his disciples to go to all nations and preach to all people.

If the divine message that he brought was intended for all of humankind, then why couldn’t he declare it in no uncertain terms right from the beginning of his mission like what Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) did?

How was the danger to his life faced by Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) any lesser than the danger that Prophet Jesus (pbuh) faced in carrying out his own mission?

The Lord protected Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) from his enemies and so why couldn’t He do the same for Prophet Jesus (pbuh)?

If I were to accept the Christian explanation that it was all part of the grand strategy of God, then I would have to conclude that Jesus (pbuh) … and by extension God Himself… intentionally lied when he said "I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel" in Matthew 15:24.

I just cannot accept that it was necessary for Jesus (pbuh), or any of the Prophets of God (peace be upon them all), to lie about their mission because this is something which clearly breaks one of the Ten Commandments not to bear false witness.

How on earth is it possible that a true Prophet of God will intentionally break any of the Commandments in order to spread the Message of the Lord?:

Where is the proof that Muhammad stated from the beginning that he was sent to all mankind? If that were true, why did he expel so many people from Arabia?

Vickie

 

[hamba2han]

What you are really saying here is that God actually changed His mind about why He had sent Jesus (pbuh) down to the world for.

I cannot and will not believe that the Lord is fickle-minded because such a weakness clearly shows either ignorance or uncertainty about future events.

It makes absolutely no sense at all that an Omnipotent Deity can be fickle-minded in that He would change His mind about the mission of a Prophet who He had already sent down to the world.

 

[jakasaki]

Lothair ~ we all knew this would thread would go into so many directions.

Mark 16:9-20

This passage had been recorded in certain manuscripts but not in others.

The Codices named Alexandrinus, Ephraemi Rescriptus and Bezae Cantabrigensis, which are generally considered reliable, include the end of the Gospel according to Mark.

Remarkable is the evidence of one ancient fragment.

In the Curetonian manuscript the Gospel according to Mark got lost, except the last four verses - those in dispute. The disputed text is also found in the oldest manuscripts, like the Syriac and Peshito texts.

The Memphitic, Sahidic and Thebaic texts of upper and lower Egypt contain it as well. The “church father” Irenaeus (2nd Century) testifies to this text.

This gives us full assurance to accept it, particularly as it is fully supported by Matthew 28:19-29.

It is unfortunate that the NIV states in the text, “the two most reliable early manuscripts do not have Mark 16:9-20”.

This creates the impression that these are really the most dependable sources.

Meant are the Codex Sinaiticus and the Codex Vaticanus.

But these are by no means the oldest.

Info credit: Gerhard Nehls, LCA 1992, pp. 119-129.

Mark 16

Verses:[1-8]
The purpose of this narrative is to show that the tomb is empty and that Jesus has been raised (⇒ Mark 16:6) and is going before you to Galilee (⇒ Mark 16:7) in fulfillment of ⇒ Mark 14:28.

The women find the tomb empty, and an angel stationed there announces to them what has happened. They are told to proclaim the news to Peter and the disciples in order to prepare them for a reunion with him.

Mark’s composition of the gospel ends at ⇒ Mark 16:8 with the women telling no one, because they were afraid. This abrupt termination causes some to believe that the original ending of this gospel may have been lost.

Verses:[9-20]
This passage, termed the Longer Ending to the Marcan gospel by comparison with a much briefer conclusion found in some less important manuscripts, has traditionally been accepted as a canonical part of the gospel and was defined as such by the Council of Trent.

Early citations of it by the Fathers indicate that it was composed by the second century, although vocabulary and style indicate that it was written by someone other than Mark.

It is a general resume of the material concerning the appearances of the risen Jesus, reflecting, in particular, traditions found in Luke 24 and John 20.

The Shorter Ending: Found after ⇒ Mark 16:8 before the Longer Ending in four seventh-to-ninth-century Greek manuscripts as well as in one Old Latin version, where it appears alone without the Longer Ending.

The Freer Logion: Found after v 14 in a fourth-fifth century manuscript preserved in the Freer Gallery of Art, Washington, DC, this ending was known to Jerome in the fourth century.

It reads: "And they excused themselves, saying, "This age of lawlessness and unbelief is under Satan, who does not allow the truth and power of God to prevail over the unclean things dominated by the spirits [or, does not allow the unclean things dominated by the spirits to grasp the truth and power of God]. Therefore reveal your righteousness now.’ They spoke to Christ. And Christ responded to them, "The limit of the years of Satan’s power is completed, but other terrible things draw near. And for those who sinned I was handed over to death, that they might return to the truth and no longer sin, in order that they might inherit the spiritual and incorruptible heavenly glory of righteousness. But . . . .’ "

Verses:[20]
THE SHORTER ENDING - [And they reported all the instructions briefly to Peter’s companions. Afterwards Jesus himself, through them, sent forth from east to west the sacred and imperishable proclamation of eternal salvation. Amen.]

vatican.va/archive/ENG0839

 

[Lothair]

Since Christians claim that Jesus (pbuh) is the “begotten Son of God”, then are they also making the same claim for Moses (pbuh)?

If the answer is ‘No’, then it surely defies all sense of logic for them to say that it is really Jesus (pbuh) who is the “prophet like Moses” referred to in Deuteronomy 18:18-19.

And so then, who indeed do Christians believe is the “prophet like Moses” the Lord says He will raise up in the aforementioned Biblical verses?

These are pretty common objections by the Muslims. Jesus is the ‘prophet like Moses’, while Moses is not the ‘Son like Jesus’. Jesus possess many attributes that Moses did not. A few things to consider: [1] Muhammad did not specifically claim to be the Prophet of Deuteronomy. That was a polemic invention ny Muslims in order to adapt to Chrisitian and Jewish criticism. Muhammad placed himself, wrongly, in the lineage and traditions of the Prophets, but did not name Moses as the Prophet he followed. In fact, Muhammad re-created Moses as an inferior to himself.

On the other hand, the evidence in support of Jesus is overwhelming. Moses and all the Prophets spoke of Jesus [Lk 16:19-31] and Abraham himself warns us that if we do not accept the warnings recorded by Moses and the Prophets, even a man rising from the dead will not convince them. Sound to me like St. Luke was worried about Muslims! Let’s not forget that even the Apsostles needed to be lead and taught the centrality of Jesus’ Prophetic office [Lk 24:27]. Even the Apostles were called ‘fools and slow of heart’, so we can’t be too intense in our criticism of Islamic error.

 

[hamba2han]

Where is the proof that Muhammad stated from the beginning that he was sent to all mankind? If that were true, why did he expel so many people from Arabia?

Vickie

The proof is in the Qur’an… and lest anyone would forget, the Qur’an came from the lips of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).

Say (O Muhammad): People! I am the Messenger of Allah sent to you all… … (Al-Qur’an, 7:158)

And We have not sent you (O Muhammad) but to the whole of mankind as a giver of glad tidings and a warner, but most people have no knowledge. … (Al-Qur’an, 34:28)

"I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel" … (Matthew 15:24)

Muslims have no problem at all in accepting the truth of all 3 verses above.

On the other hand, it is Christians who are saying that none of the 3 verses above is the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

Why then are Christians accusing Muslims of calling Prophet Jesus (pbuh) a liar?

 

[Lothair]

I cannot and will not believe that the Lord is fickle-minded because such a weakness clearly shows either ignorance or uncertainty about future events.

It makes absolutely no sense at all that an Omnipotent Deity can be fickle-minded in that He would change His mind about the mission of a Prophet who He had already sent down to the world.

Really?! How about Allah letting Jews and Christians corrupt the Torah and Injil, only to finally get it right by protecting the Quran? It looks like Allah was *unable *to forsee that Jews and Christians would alter the Bible or was just indifferent to his *own *previous revelation! Looks like Allah may have changed his mind a few times!

 

[jakasaki]

The proof is in the Qur’an… and lest anyone would forget, the Qur’an came from the lips of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).

Say (O Muhammad): People! I am the Messenger of Allah sent to you all… … (Al-Qur’an, 7:158)

And We have not sent you (O Muhammad) but to the whole of mankind as a giver of glad tidings and a warner, but most people have no knowledge. … (Al-Qur’an, 34:28)

~ snip ~

You skipped the koran verses which speak of only mohamad being sent to “among you” and “messenger of your own”

Chapter 2 - koran verse #151
A similar (favour have ye already received) in that We have sent among you an Messenger of your own, rehearsing to you Our Signs, and sanctifying you, and instructing you in Scripture and Wisdom, and in new knowledge.

Chapter 2 - koran verse #164
Allah did confer a great favour on the believers when** He sent among them an apostle from among themselves, **rehearsing unto them the Signs of Allah, sanctifying them, and instructing them in Scripture and Wisdom, while, before that, they had been in manifest error.

searchtruth.com/list.php

 

[Booklover]

You skipped the koran verses which speak of only mohamad being sent to “among you” and “messenger of your own”

Chapter 2 - koran verse #151
A similar (favour have ye already received) in that We have sent among you an Messenger of your own, rehearsing to you Our Signs, and sanctifying you, and instructing you in Scripture and Wisdom, and in new knowledge.

Chapter 2 - koran verse #164
Allah did confer a great favour on the believers when** He sent among them an apostle from among themselves, **rehearsing unto them the Signs of Allah, sanctifying them, and instructing them in Scripture and Wisdom, while, before that, they had been in manifest error.

searchtruth.com/list.php

His message didn’t become “universal” until after his goals became imperialistic!

Vickie

 

[hamba2han]

Really?! How about Allah letting Jews and Christians corrupt the Torah and Injil, only to finally get it right by protecting the Quran? It looks like Allah was *unable *to forsee that Jews and Christians would alter the Bible or was just indifferent to his *own *previous revelation! Looks like Allah may have changed his mind a few times!

Christians need to examine what Jesus (pbuh) himself says in the Bible because this is where they would be able to find the explanation to the above question.

"I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel." (Matthew 15:24)

and also

"These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: 'Do NOT go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel." (Matthew 10:5-6)

What this means is that since Prophet Jesus (pbuh) was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel, then there really was no reason at all why Allah would need to preserve the Gospel that was given to him, was there?

The Prophet Muhammad (pbuh), on the other hand, is the Seal of the Prophets and he was sent as a Mercy for all of humankind and so Allah has indeed promised to protect and preserve the Qur’an till the time when the world as we know it finally comes to an end.

And as for the corruption of the scriptures by the Jews, the Bible has the following verses within it:

`How can you say, “We [the Jews] are wise, for we have the law of the LORD,” when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?’ … (From the NIV Bible, Jeremiah 8:8)

Deuteronomy 31:25-29
25 he gave this command to the Levites who carried the ark of the covenant of the LORD :
26 "Take this Book of the Law and place it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God. There it will remain as a witness against you.
27 For I know how rebellious and stiff-necked you are. If you have been rebellious against the LORD while I am still alive and with you, how much more will you rebel after I die! 28 Assemble before me all the elders of your tribes and all your officials, so that I can speak these words in their hearing and call heaven and earth to testify against them.
29 For I know that after my death you are sure to become utterly corrupt and to turn from the way I have commanded you. In days to come, disaster will fall upon you because you will do evil in the sight of the LORD and provoke him to anger by what your hands have made."

The Book of Moses predicted that the Law (Bible) will get corrupted. The Book of Jeremiah which came approximately 826 years after did indeed confirm this corruption.

Do Christians accept the validity of the above verses in their Bible?

Muslims do not have a problem accepting these verses as being true.

 

[hamba2han]

You skipped the koran verses which speak of only mohamad being sent to “among you” and “messenger of your own”

Chapter 2 - koran verse #151
A similar (favour have ye already received) in that We have sent among you an Messenger of your own, rehearsing to you Our Signs, and sanctifying you, and instructing you in Scripture and Wisdom, and in new knowledge.

Chapter 2 - koran verse #164
Allah did confer a great favour on the believers when** He sent among them an apostle from among themselves, **rehearsing unto them the Signs of Allah, sanctifying them, and instructing them in Scripture and Wisdom, while, before that, they had been in manifest error.

searchtruth.com/list.php

I am not sure where you are going with this argument as I really do not see any contradiction or discrepancy whatsoever here.

For instance, President Obama was nominated from among the people of Chicago and is therefore an elected President of their own.

Does this mean then that he is not the President of the rest of the United States?

Of course not and similarly, how does Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) being from among the tribe of Quraish prevent him from being the Messenger for all of humankind?

 

[jakasaki]

Christians need to examine what Jesus (pbuh) himself says in the Bible because this is where they would be able to find the explanation to the above question.

"I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel." (Matthew 15:24)

and also

"These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: 'Do NOT go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans. Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel." (Matthew 10:5-6)

What this means is that since Prophet Jesus (pbuh) was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel, then there really was no reason at all why Allah would need to preserve the Gospel that was given to him, was there?

The Prophet Muhammad (pbuh), on the other hand, is the Seal of the Prophets and he was sent as a Mercy for all of humankind and so Allah has indeed promised to protect and preserve the Qur’an till the time when the world as we know it finally comes to an end.

And as for the corruption of the scriptures by the Jews, the Bible has the following verses within it:

`How can you say, “We [the Jews] are wise, for we have the law of the LORD,” when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?’ … (From the NIV Bible, Jeremiah 8:8)

Deuteronomy 31:25-29
25 he gave this command to the Levites who carried the ark of the covenant of the LORD :
26 "Take this Book of the Law and place it beside the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God. There it will remain as a witness against you.
27 For I know how rebellious and stiff-necked you are. If you have been rebellious against the LORD while I am still alive and with you, how much more will you rebel after I die! 28 Assemble before me all the elders of your tribes and all your officials, so that I can speak these words in their hearing and call heaven and earth to testify against them.
29 For I know that after my death you are sure to become utterly corrupt and to turn from the way I have commanded you. In days to come, disaster will fall upon you because you will do evil in the sight of the LORD and provoke him to anger by what your hands have made."

The Book of Moses predicted that the Law (Bible) will get corrupted. The Book of Jeremiah which came approximately 826 years after did indeed confirm this corruption.

Do Christians accept the validity of the above verses in their Bible?

Muslims do not have a problem accepting these verses as being true.

Yeah Osama Abdallah and answering Christianity ~ Like this dude knows anything!!!

Surely you jest by posting this.

He, Osama Abhallah is just another Christian hater like Deedat.

 

[jakasaki]

I am not sure where you are going with this argument as I really do not see any contradiction or discrepancy whatsoever here.

For instance, President Obama was nominated from among the people of Chicago and is therefore an elected President of their own.

Does this mean then that he is not the President of the rest of the United States?

Of course not and similarly, how does Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) being from among the tribe of Quraish prevent him from being the Messenger for all of humankind?

Surely you jest again!

 

[hamba2han]

Surely you jest again!

Like I said before, emotions all too often do indeed get in the way of objective and logical reasoning.

 

[jakasaki]

QUOTE=hamba2han;5758480]

`How can you say, “We [the Jews] are wise, for we have the law of the LORD,” when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?’ … (From the NIV Bible, Jeremiah 8:8)

**Identical to: **

Quote: Osama Abdallah
answering-christianity.com/que3.htm?search=Select+a+Search%3A&text_field=Deuteronomy+31
“`How can you say, “We [the Jews] are wise, for we have the law of the LORD,” when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?’ (From the NIV Bible, Jeremiah 8:8)”

Quote: hamba2han:
The Book of Moses predicted that the Law (Bible) will get corrupted. The Book of Jeremiah which came approximately 826 years after did indeed confirm this corruption.

Identical to:

Quote: Osama Abdallah
answering-christianity.com/que3.htm?search=Select+a+Search%3A&text_field=Deuteronomy+31
The Book of Moses predicted that the Law (Bible) will get corrupted. The Book of Jeremiah which came approximately 826 years after did indeed confirm this corruption.

You know hamba, please, if you are going to quote someone or some site, state your sources for discussion/debate.

Osama Abdallah, Oh please!!!

Edit to add - because I complete forgot my thought process…

Hamba ~ if you read D:31 very carefully without some Osama doing the talking or thinking for you, it does NOT say about corrupting the Law of the Books/God which Moses had.

It clearly speaks about corruption of man ~ do not confuse corruption of man with corruption of the Laws,.

 

[Jay53]

How on earth is it possible that a true Prophet of God will intentionally break any of the Commandments in order to spread the Message of the Lord?:

Indeed! How is it that God commanded us “Thou shalt not commit adultery” in the Ten Commandments, Jesus affirms this in His teachings, but yet, Muhammad, in the Quran, says it is OK to have sex with slave women who are not one’s wife? You are right - a TRUE prophet of God would not spread teachings that go against teachings already affirmed as being from God.