Music Leader Thread Part III - Song Lists, Suggestions, and Comments

[benedictgal]

I have been asked to cantor this weekend at my dad’s parish. Here are my selections:

Entrance Processional: At the Lamb’s High Feast
Offertory: I Heard the Voice of Jesus Say
Communion: Shepherd of Souls
Meditation: Regina Caeli
Recessional: The Strife Is O’er

My parish music director went over the psalm with me so I think I will be ready. The reason why I put the Regina Caeli in there is because that parish typically has a second collection every Sunday. Don’t ask my why, but they have been doing that for nearly 30 years. Since the Regina Caeli is short, there is time for sacred silence.

 

[Sarabande]

I have been asked to cantor this weekend at my dad’s parish. Here are my selections:

Entrance Processional: At the Lamb’s High Feast
Offertory: I Heard the Voice of Jesus Say
Communion: Shepherd of Souls
Meditation: Regina Caeli
Recessional: The Strife Is O’er

My parish music director went over the psalm with me so I think I will be ready. The reason why I put the Regina Caeli in there is because that parish typically has a second collection every Sunday. Don’t ask my why, but they have been doing that for nearly 30 years. Since the Regina Caeli is short, there is time for sacred silence.

I’ve always loved “I Heard the Voice of Jesus Say” and “Regina Caeli”. You’re very fortunate you can choose your own hymns for Sunday mass.

 

[TheMc]

I have been asked to cantor this weekend at my dad’s parish. Here are my selections:

Entrance Processional: At the Lamb’s High Feast
Offertory: I Heard the Voice of Jesus Say
Communion: Shepherd of Souls
Meditation: Regina Caeli
Recessional: The Strife Is O’er

My parish music director went over the psalm with me so I think I will be ready. The reason why I put the Regina Caeli in there is because that parish typically has a second collection every Sunday. Don’t ask my why, but they have been doing that for nearly 30 years. Since the Regina Caeli is short, there is time for sacred silence.

That’s quite a lineup! Good choices!

 

[Justin1224]

Here is what we are singing tomorrow:

Entrance: Lift High The Cross
Offertory: Like A Shepherd
Communion: Unless A Grain of Wheat
Recessional: Lead Me Lord

 

[ArchStreetBand]

Hello, all!

Love Good Shepherd Sunday Hope your weekend is going well!

Here’s our list:

Preludes:
Blessed Be Your Name (Matt and Beth Redman)
God with Us (Hart, Liles)
Jesus, My Everything (Maher)
Our God Is Here (Muglia)
The Lord’s My Shepherd (Townend)
You Are Mine (Haas)

Processional: Rain Down (Cortez)
Psalm: The Lord Is My Shepherd (Blakesley)
Preparation: Strength for the Journey (Poirier)
Communion: Our God Reigns (Smith), Shepherd of My Heart (Tunney, et al)
Recessional: We Shall Rise Again (Young)
Postlude: We Are God’s People (Roscoe)

Happy Easter!

Jennifer

 

[Whitacre_Girl]

Hello, all!

Love Good Shepherd Sunday Hope your weekend is going well!

Here’s our list:

Preludes:
Blessed Be Your Name (Matt and Beth Redman)
God with Us (Hart, Liles)
Jesus, My Everything (Maher)
Our God Is Here (Muglia)
The Lord’s My Shepherd (Townend)
You Are Mine (Haas)

Processional: Rain Down (Cortez)
Psalm: The Lord Is My Shepherd (Blakesley)
Preparation: Strength for the Journey (Poirier)
Communion: Our God Reigns (Smith), Shepherd of My Heart (Tunney, et al)
Recessional: We Shall Rise Again (Young)
Postlude: We Are God’s People (Roscoe)

Happy Easter!

Jennifer

Blessed Be Your Name is a GREAT song!! How did you get that one? What music issue are you using? Info please!

 

[ArchStreetBand]

Blessed Be Your Name is a GREAT song!! How did you get that one? What music issue are you using? Info please!

Hey, W-Girl!

Thanks for your note. I totally agree! It’s a wonderful song and relatively easy for the congregation to learn.

You can find it in OCP’s (often-derided) Spirit and Song books. They’ve got a great assembly edition…

Has your community ever tried using music/worship programs in addition to the missals/music issues? I put together an 8-panel program that has the lyrics (not melody line) to all of the songs, summaries of the readings, and responses to the general intercessions. The “point” is to help people focus on the liturgy and not have to flip pages. It also discourages people from reading along in the missal during Mass…

A community close to ours uses a projection system to display the music for the congregation. Not sure what your situation is, but I’d be happy to share resources with you if that’d help!

All best,
jennifer

 

[benedictgal]

I was able to exercise one of the legitimate options for the Responsorial Psalm, the Grail Psalter, this past Saturday evening. I must say that the translation is quite beautiful. I used the same melody that my friend, my parish’s music director, gave me and it worked out well.

Last night, I used my favorite Mass setting, A Community Mass. The Gloria, though, came from A New Mass for a Congregation. I will miss this particular setting, as I understand it’s not going to be revised. I am going to start listening to the MP3 of the ICEL settings so that I can learn them. The great thing about ICEL is that the Gloria is straight-through and the musical setting is certainly worthy of the noble texts. Having heard the previews from OCP, I am dreading what they are releasing.

 

[TheMc]

Last night, I used my favorite Mass setting, A Community Mass. The Gloria, though, came from A New Mass for a Congregation. I will miss this particular setting, as I understand it’s not going to be revised. I am going to start listening to the MP3 of the ICEL settings so that I can learn them. The great thing about ICEL is that the Gloria is straight-through and the musical setting is certainly worthy of the noble texts. Having heard the previews from OCP, I am dreading what they are releasing.

We use A New Mass for a Congregation exclusively, and with Community Mass in “the rotation”. I have to say my favorite non-chant Mass setting is probably Prolux’s Mass for the City, which is especially awesome with our parish brass quintet.

I can’t wait for the new translation, however, the OCP settings… another story. Why waste the new text with, um… well… bad music?

 

[Whitacre_Girl]

Hey, W-Girl!

Thanks for your note. I totally agree! It’s a wonderful song and relatively easy for the congregation to learn.

You can find it in OCP’s (often-derided) Spirit and Song books. They’ve got a great assembly edition…

Has your community ever tried using music/worship programs in addition to the missals/music issues? I put together an 8-panel program that has the lyrics (not melody line) to all of the songs, summaries of the readings, and responses to the general intercessions. The “point” is to help people focus on the liturgy and not have to flip pages. It also discourages people from reading along in the missal during Mass…

A community close to ours uses a projection system to display the music for the congregation. Not sure what your situation is, but I’d be happy to share resources with you if that’d help!

All best,
jennifer

Wow!! What a congregation you serve! We have the spirit and song books, but we don’t use them because they are seen as “the kid books.”

My congregation is in a funny place. They love contemporary music, but don’t seem to have a good musical sense. For example - a horrific song (Mary Did You Know?) was played, and they went GAGA over it for the song itself, but didn’t take in the lyrics which are very much against catholic teaching. I am working at trying to get more (good and holy!) contemporary music in the door to get them back into the musical aspect of worship (which they clearly are thirsting for!) and then introduce them to traditional music and chant. I want them to have a wide appreciation for ALL holy music, and not fall into the horrific and destructive idea that one kind of music is holier than another.

I have been poring over the music issue and I have found some absolute gold-mines in there that are being neglected. Our repertoire consists of MAYBE 20 songs on three topics - communion, praise, and comfort. It’s my goal to expand that. We have NO songs celebrating the holy spirit, and we completely ignore some books.

I am thinking of making the first few minutes of communion a solo time to introduce new songs that are in the music issue and the other song books we have. I’d also like to see that time used solely for prayer and meditation with music. Communion is too often treated like a social hour because no one is singing - just the piano softly playing a hymn.

 

[benedictgal]

Wow!! What a congregation you serve! We have the spirit and song books, but we don’t use them because they are seen as “the kid books.”

My congregation is in a funny place. They love contemporary music, but don’t seem to have a good musical sense. For example - a horrific song (Mary Did You Know?) was played, and they went GAGA over it for the song itself, but didn’t take in the lyrics which are very much against catholic teaching. I am working at trying to get more (good and holy!) contemporary music in the door to get them back into the musical aspect of worship (which they clearly are thirsting for!) and then introduce them to traditional music and chant. I want them to have a wide appreciation for ALL holy music, and not fall into the horrific and destructive idea that one kind of music is holier than another.

I have been poring over the music issue and I have found some absolute gold-mines in there that are being neglected. Our repertoire consists of MAYBE 20 songs on three topics - communion, praise, and comfort. It’s my goal to expand that. We have NO songs celebrating the holy spirit, and we completely ignore some books.

I am thinking of making the first few minutes of communion a solo time to introduce new songs that are in the music issue and the other song books we have. I’d also like to see that time used solely for prayer and meditation with music. Communion is too often treated like a social hour because no one is singing - just the piano softly playing a hymn.

My parish does not really sing the contemporary stuff. However, when the choir is not there and my parochial vicar chooses the music (he selects Traditional hymns), the people do sing and loudly.

Last night, I filled in for the regular cantor at my dad’s parish. Having gone with my dad to Mass there a few times when she is singing, I can tell you that no one sings when she chooses contemporary songs. However, the people sang the hymns that I selected and they also sang the Mass settings. The only thing that they did not sing was the Regina Caeli since I did it as a solo piece while the second collection was being taken up.

I did allow for some silence after Holy Communion. This is a very important component and something that Pope Benedict XVI strongly recommends in Sacramentum Caritatis.

My concern with a lot of the contemporary stuff out there is that it does not have anything solid in the theological content and, musically, the form just is not conducive to the sacred mysteries that unfold before us at every Mass. Contemporary music can work outside of the bounds of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, but, I find it to be incompatible with the sacred, solemn nature of the liturgy.

I had a long talk with the priest who might be heading the reconstituted diocesan liturgical commission down here. He agreed that this form of music was not the ideal for the Mass. However, a lot of it has to do with proper catechesis and a good reading of the Church documents, including Sacramentum Caritatis. Sadly, not a few people take the suggestions and seminars that the publishing houses offer as being on par with the Holy See when that is not necessarily the case. That is why I believe that it is important that anyone wanting to engage in music ministry first read the authoritative documents of the Holy See and the writings of the Popes. This kind of formation is essential and it should prove to be a good and solid guide in choosing music that is fit for the Holy Sacrifice.

What I do not understand is this: if the Church, in the GIRM, lists the antiphons as the first order of importance (insofar as what is to be sung at Mass is concerned), why are we giving so much importance and credence to the last order (hymns)? The Church already gives us the texts of what to use: the Propers. We don’t need to have a plethora of songs for the Entrance Processional and Holy Communion if we just sing the Propers.

 

[moreorless]

What I do not understand is this: if the Church, in the GIRM, lists the antiphons as the first order of importance (insofar as what is to be sung at Mass is concerned), why are we giving so much importance and credence to the last order (hymns)? The Church already gives us the texts of what to use: the Propers. We don’t need to have a plethora of songs for the Entrance Processional and Holy Communion if we just sing the Propers.

I have the same question. I do not understand why more parishes do not sing the propers instead of all these hymns. We run to the last choice on the list of options as though it were the first choice. The Church gives us music and text to sing for the entrance, offertory, and communion. No need to worry about finding just the right hymn that “fits” the readings: we can use the propers that are themselves the text of the Mass.

 

[TheMc]

I have the same question. I do not understand why more parishes do not sing the propers instead of all these hymns. We run to the last choice on the list of options as though it were the first choice. The Church gives us music and text to sing for the entrance, offertory, and communion. No need to worry about finding just the right hymn that “fits” the readings: we can use the propers that are themselves the text of the Mass.

I also wonder about this. While not every choir can sing from the gradual, there are some that could, and choose not to, or could with a little bit of practice. Not to mention all of the different simpler settings of the propers you could find.

It’s not that people can’t do it, it’s that they don’t want to.

 

[Sarabande]

I also wonder about this. While not every choir can sing from the gradual, there are some that could, and choose not to, or could with a little bit of practice. Not to mention all of the different simpler settings of the propers you could find.

It’s not that people can’t do it, it’s that they don’t want to.

I can’t speak for all, but just based on what I’ve experienced at various parishes where I’ve worked, I think more of the reason lies within the fact that many music directors or musicians involved in the music for liturgy, don’t actually know about the propers. If you come across the musicians my age (early 30s) I can say that if they haven’t done much reading of the documents, they won’t know. I know I didn’t when I was in my early 20s and was just learning. None of us grew up with it and the music directors of the time weren’t teaching it.

 

[TheMc]

I can’t speak for all, but just based on what I’ve experienced at various parishes where I’ve worked, I think more of the reason lies within the fact that many music directors or musicians involved in the music for liturgy, don’t actually know about the propers. If you come across the musicians my age (early 30s) I can say that if they haven’t done much reading of the documents, they won’t know. I know I didn’t when I was in my early 20s and was just learning. None of us grew up with it and the music directors of the time weren’t teaching it.

My mistake. I didn’t say it, but I was referring to the people that know about them and why they are important, and still don’t use them. You are absolutely right though. Many people don’t know about them.

 

[Whitacre_Girl]

My parish does not really sing the contemporary stuff. However, when the choir is not there and my parochial vicar chooses the music (he selects Traditional hymns), the people do sing and loudly.

Last night, I filled in for the regular cantor at my dad’s parish. Having gone with my dad to Mass there a few times when she is singing, I can tell you that no one sings when she chooses contemporary songs. However, the people sang the hymns that I selected and they also sang the Mass settings. The only thing that they did not sing was the Regina Caeli since I did it as a solo piece while the second collection was being taken up.

I did allow for some silence after Holy Communion. This is a very important component and something that Pope Benedict XVI strongly recommends in Sacramentum Caritatis.

My concern with a lot of the contemporary stuff out there is that it does not have anything solid in the theological content and, musically, the form just is not conducive to the sacred mysteries that unfold before us at every Mass. Contemporary music can work outside of the bounds of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, but, I find it to be incompatible with the sacred, solemn nature of the liturgy.

I had a long talk with the priest who might be heading the reconstituted diocesan liturgical commission down here. He agreed that this form of music was not the ideal for the Mass. However, a lot of it has to do with proper catechesis and a good reading of the Church documents, including Sacramentum Caritatis. Sadly, not a few people take the suggestions and seminars that the publishing houses offer as being on par with the Holy See when that is not necessarily the case. That is why I believe that it is important that anyone wanting to engage in music ministry first read the authoritative documents of the Holy See and the writings of the Popes. This kind of formation is essential and it should prove to be a good and solid guide in choosing music that is fit for the Holy Sacrifice.

What I do not understand is this: if the Church, in the GIRM, lists the antiphons as the first order of importance (insofar as what is to be sung at Mass is concerned), why are we giving so much importance and credence to the last order (hymns)? The Church already gives us the texts of what to use: the Propers. We don’t need to have a plethora of songs for the Entrance Processional and Holy Communion if we just sing the Propers.

Actually I attribute this to a lack of experience with “contemporary” music. Now, if you are thinking of a specific genre of contemporary music (ex: Rock) then you are right. SOME genres don’t lend themselves well to good theology. There are a LOT of contemporary songs that are very theologically sound and have a vast amount of depth to them. Having been steeped in music from various churches, concerts, rasio stations (let’s face it, I’m a JUNKIE) I’ve listened to HOURS of contemporary, classical, and ANCIENT songs from christendom. There is great stuff, there is also trash. You just have to be able to sift through the trash for the good stuff. I personally think the OCP music issue as well as the “kid books” (as they are called) do a good job of that.

There are songs that are great for meditation (repetitive lyrics centered around a specific theme), singing the praise of God, the mysteries…yeah. Just remember (and this is vital for ANY musician to know) all music was contemporary at some point. Did you ever read the letters and writings when they are trying to get the organ through the church doors when it was new? The organ was thought by many to be a tool of satan himself because it was used primarily in operas. Now look at it - there isn’t a catholic out there that thinks there is a “holier” instrument.

The truth is, there is no music style, genre, or instrument that isn’t fitting. It’s all in how you play it/write it/ sing it.

However, there are genres out there that have a near vacuum of GOOD music for CHURCH.

Do you have Pandora? If not go to www.pandora.com and create a station for contemporary christian music. Listen to it every chance you get. Tune into the local christian station and soak it in. Yes, you are going to get a lot of trash and pithy garbage, but the gems you find (same here is true for our missal at times!) are truly remarkable. Also, a congregation knows good music when they hear it. However, they also need to be able to sing it - this means they KNOW the song. And finally, every congregation is different. If I got up there next sunday and did antiphons and latin chant…I’d lose them. It’s be the same as if I got up there and did reggae. No one would get it. We also have to keep in mind that God created music for us. It resounds with us so personally and profoundly that it is the best tool for most people to get in touch with God in a personal and relevant way. It’s also personal - if people can’t relate to chant, it doesn’t matter how much you yell at them and tell them there is something wrong with them - they aren’t going to change and likely join the 4 in 5 catholics who don’t attend mass anymore. The same is true for contemporary music. If your congregation can’t relate to it, then for heaven’s sake DON’T play it! But don’t do something just because ONE person says “this is the holiest kind of music.” It’s been done in the past and I kid you not when I say WARS have been fought over this in the past. The point is to glorify God, and not vandalize and burn organs (as was done back in the day when the organ was seen as the tool of satan)

(sorry for the edit, had to change some of the words I used to describe music that isn’t worth a spit in the dirt. haha)

 

[Sarabande]

Did you ever read the letters and writings when they are trying to get the organ through the church doors when it was new? The organ was thought by many to be a tool of satan himself because it was used primarily in operas. Now look at it - there isn’t a catholic out there that thinks there is a “holier” instrument.

That’s not quite true and although I didn’t read the letters which that was stated, I’m fairly certain those people may have been a little confused or misled about this. Whitacregirl, I hope I don’t sound like I’m nitpicking on this and I’m not trying to debate. I do like your posts. I just want to make sure that the history is straight.

It IS true that it was initially used a secular instrument back in the very early centuries. So you are right about it used as a secular instrument at one time and it probably did get some flack when it was originally instituted in churches. Apparently, there was, according to Benedict, a “theo-political” history behind it. But it wasn’t primarily used in operas. (I’m a professional opera singer and had to study opera history heavily.) The first operas began in around the late 16th century. The organ was used in churches prior to this, although I believe the pipe organ did have its start in the same century. Most operas do not incorporate the organ, at least the the operas I’ve studied, listened to or performed. I’ve heard the organ used once in an opera and that was because it had something to do with church within the storyline.

Here is a thread discussing Benedict XVI’s article “Theological Problems of Church Music”

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=360606

Here’s the actual article:
musicasacra.com/theological-problems/

And here is the Catholic Encyclopedia’s history of the organ
newadvent.org/cathen/11297a.htm

He also goes into a little about the history of the organ and how/why it started to be used for liturgy. I’ll quote some here:

The organ is a theological instrument whose original home was the cult of the emperor. When the Emperor of Byzantium spoke, an organ played. On the other hand the organ was supposed to be the combination of all the voices of the cosmos. Accordingly, the organ music at imperial utterances meant that when the divine emperor spoke, the entire universe resounded. As a divine utterance, his statement is the resounding of all the voices in the cosmos. The “organon” is the cosmic instrument and as such the voice of the world’s ruler, the imperator.18 As against this Byzantine custom, Rome stressed a cosmic Christology and on that basis the cosmis function of Christ’s Vicar on earth: what was good enough for the Emperor was quite good enough for the Pope. Naturally, it is not a case here of superficial problems concerning prestige, but it is a matter of the public, political and cultic representation of the mandates received in each case. To the exclusivity of an imperial theology which abandoned the Church to the Emperor and degraded the bishops to mere imperial functionaries,19 Rome opposed the Pope’s cosmic claim and with it the cosmic rank of belief in Christ, which is independent of and indeed superior to politics. Therefore the organ had to resound in the papal liturgy as well.

Such a borrowing from imperial theology is not regarded with favour by contemporary theological scholarship, which considers such acceptance as “Constantinian” or as “Romanisation,” which is naturally far worse than Hellenisation. As a matter of fact, what has been said thus far suffices to indicate clearly the convincing reasons for the whole process, as well as its logic within a Christian context: this detour made it possible to avoid turning the Church into a synagogue and to carry out in practise the true claim of the Christian faith, which accepts the inheritance of the Temple and surpasses it by far, into the very dimensions of the Universal.

Furthermore, the history of the organ remained a theo-political history for quite a long time: the fact that an organ resounds at the Carolingian court is an expression of the Carolingian claim to equality with Byzantium. Conversely, the Roman usage was transferred to the cathedrals and abbey churches. Less than a lifetime ago it was still customary for the organ to play as background to the abbot’s recitation of the Pater noster in Benedictine abbeys, and this is to be understood as a direct inheritance from the ancient cosmic liturgy.20

 

[Cavaille-Coll]

The pipe organ in its present form developed in the mid-1200’s, long before opera. Before this time, pipes of a similar design were used as drones to accompany chant, and in the days of the Byzantine empire, they were used something like air-blown steam whistles as war signals. The organ as we know it today is purely a product of the Church.

Fourth Sunday of Easter

Processional: Ye Sons and Daughters
Kyrie: Plain chant
Gloria: Heritage Mass
Offertory: Christ the Lord is Risen Again
Sanctus: Plain chant
Euch. Acc.: Christ has died (Danish Mass)
Amen: Danish Mass
Agnus Dei: Plain chant
Communion: At the Lamb’s High Feast
Recessional: Alleluia, Alleluia, Let the Holy Anthem Rise

 

[Sarabande]

Fourth Sunday of Easter

Processional: Ye Sons and Daughters
Kyrie: Plain chant
Gloria: Heritage Mass
Offertory: Christ the Lord is Risen Again
Sanctus: Plain chant
Euch. Acc.: Christ has died (Danish Mass)
Amen: Danish Mass
Agnus Dei: Plain chant
Communion: At the Lamb’s High Feast
Recessional: Alleluia, Alleluia, Let the Holy Anthem Rise

What a beautiful rep for 4th Sunday!

 

[Sarabande]

The pipe organ in its present form developed in the mid-1200’s, long before opera. Before this time, pipes of a similar design were used as drones to accompany chant, and in the days of the Byzantine empire, they were used something like air-blown steam whistles as war signals. The organ as we know it today is purely a product of the Church.

Fourth Sunday of Easter

Processional: Ye Sons and Daughters
Kyrie: Plain chant
Gloria: Heritage Mass
Offertory: Christ the Lord is Risen Again
Sanctus: Plain chant
Euch. Acc.: Christ has died (Danish Mass)
Amen: Danish Mass
Agnus Dei: Plain chant
Communion: At the Lamb’s High Feast
Recessional: Alleluia, Alleluia, Let the Holy Anthem Rise

Forgot to ask… do you do the choral extensions to the Amen? I think there were four of them. One was by Byrd and another by Victoria, but I can’t remember the other composers. They were short, but I miss hearing and singing them from my old parish.