Muslim bigotry

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I’m pretty much all done with Louis and the NOI. His church and where it is. and what it use to be. That really has nothing to do with anything I’m talking about. But I hear you.

Now as far as the comment about NOI being Christians? They most certainly are welcome to come over and attend. But I don’t think we’ll be seeing that happen anytime soon. What will happen, is what has happened, and continues to happen which “is” my point. They will continue to filter in the Mosques of Islam. Which I’m sure is no issue for you or Islam right? They are welcome to worship there also right? Or are they just considered as you said “Atheists and Christians” who attend a Greek Orthodox Church? Thats doesn’t sound right to me. But I don’t know I’ll leave that for those who are Orthodox to sort out. I’m Catholic raised.

What do you actually think about Mohammad? Did he actually move a mountain?

God Bless, Gary.
I think you’re misunderstanding me.

You are saying NOI and 5%er’s are Islamic and I’m saying, the NOI are more Christian than they are Islamic. And the 5%er’s are more Atheistic than they are Islamic.

And you also said they are sooo ‘Islamic’ because they attend a ‘Mosque’. I’m saying, it is actually a Greek Orthodox Church. And I’m sure you’re familiar with the saying, “Being in a church doesn’t make you a Christian any more than being in a garage makes you a car.” cough “Being in a mosque doesn’t make you a Muslim any more than being in a garage makes you a car.” 🙂

I don’t think I believe Mohammad was a prophet but I don’t believe Joseph Mormon, Ellen G White or Joseph Smith were either. 🤷 Do you?
 
The Homesexuals 🙂 Yup thats over the edge for sure. Catholics are dead set against it. But your right in other areas. California has to be slowed down also. Man they are insistant on pushing that abomonation through.

Whats the actual view with islam on abortion? I’ve heard varied things here also.
It’s scary. 😦
 
Ah, I thought it was an emergency sitiation there. Thats going to be an on-going issue anyway. It will be a topic with the candidates this term. But with the split of Catholic and Christian in the US. Honestly I don’t see much near future hope there. The 70’s thinking with Protestant denominations hurts us in that regard.

The rape and chao’s is just that backward thinking which doesn’t fit in a modern society.
 
I think you’re misunderstanding me.

You are saying NOI and 5%er’s are Islamic and I’m saying, the NOI are more Christian than they are Islamic. And the 5%er’s are more Atheistic than they are Islamic.

And you also said they are sooo ‘Islamic’ because they attend a ‘Mosque’. I’m saying, it is actually a Greek Orthodox Church. And I’m sure you’re familiar with the saying, “Being in a church doesn’t make you a Christian any more than being in a garage makes you a car.” cough “Being in a mosque doesn’t make you a Muslim any more than being in a garage makes you a car.” 🙂

I don’t think I believe Mohammad was a prophet but I don’t believe Joseph Mormon, Ellen G White or Joseph Smith were either. 🤷 Do you?
No I see it the same way. I just hope all these guys in areas like the NYC, NJ, CT where the overflow ends up in the mosques around here from all the crazy thinking, corrects itself, instead of corrupting other muslims.

You know what it is, its unfortunate but unless theres a solid majority of sound teaching, then its a case of will the good affect the bad or visa versa. And by large when a population is negative it will affect the postive. Or I would hope the Good people have enough sense to say, I’m out of here. And that has happened also which I was saying about GMA and Homeland security. Those were all Good Muslims who just said “hey were not down with bombing buildings” Which I found impressive.

Thats not to say they won’t be in witness protection for life now:shrug:

What do all you guys make of Walid Shoebat? I’m actually surprized he’s not in some sort of protection.

Since he is arab and born/learned speaking it, I didn’t know what to make on his Syntex Codex interpretation of 666. He claims the Greek Bible version is wrong amd original Hebrew version is clearly identified as Islam? I don’t speak arabic. So unless someone non-bias interpreted it for me I wouldn’t know what to believe.🤷
 
I don’t believe they will corrupt other Muslims. I can’t see a young Albanian boy interested in hearing about the white devil’s corruption and how black scientists revealed the Qur’an. 😃
 
That is essentially the problem with Shari’a (the last 4 words there), and I think it is a problem inherent in the Shari’a itself, not just this or that practice of it. How would it possible to implement amputation for theft or murder for matters of conscience (e.g., changing religion) in a “pleasant manner”? It’s not possible. So I oppose even allowing it for the particular communities, even as I recognize that this is hypocrisy with reference to the Jewish courts. Should the Jewish courts implement death sentences and mutilations and other things that are at variance with federal laws enacted to deal with the same situations, then they ought to be shut down, too. We can’t have a Christian state-within-a-state for the Christians, a Muslim state-within-a-state for the Muslims, a Jewish state-within-a-state for the Jews, etc. Not in a America, anyway. America is not analogous to any place in the Middle East, and we ought import or support that kind of legal system here. It does nothing but legitimize and solidify social stratification along religious lines. I don’t know about any of you, but as much as I love Lebanon as a symbol of the deep roots of indigenous Middle Eastern Christianity, I have no desire to see my own country fall to that kind of sectarianism, and I think that’s precisely what religious-based courts lay the groundwork for.

I understand and in a sense agree with the idea that banning such courts drives the same activity underground, but that does nothing but confirm to me the unavoidable and insurmountable problem with treating Islam the same as every other religion. We simply cannot allow one religion’s decrees to override the secular values embraced by the West with regard to freedom of conscience. To do so betrays the ex-Muslim (or questioning Muslim, or true pluralism-supporting Muslim) by virtue of their belonging to Islam in the first place. It essentially says “Sorry. You’re a Muslim, and Islam allows this treatment of you, so there’s nothing we can do. It is lawful according to your community, and we wouldn’t want to cause problems with that community.” In reality, it is that community that causes problems when they live by an inherently problematic law code, in so far as it conflicts with the law of the country in which they now find themselves.

Basically, you want to be able to stone suspected adulterers and rape victims, kill apostates and homosexuals, and deny women many of their fundamental rights as human beings? Sadly, there are many such places in the world where it is perfectly legal and encouraged to do so. The United States, Canada, Western Europe, and most other places where Muslims find themselves living outside of the Islamic world are NOT such places, and should not be allowed to become such places at any level. Even if it is just one FAMILY practicing this law completely within the confines of their own house, it should be treated as a crime when it causes them to commit crimes. (And it has happened several times in recent memory; see the Aqsa Parvez case in Canada, Noor Almaleki case in Arizona, Amina and Sarah Said case in Texas, etc.)

These are crimes. Your religious identity is not an excuse to be a criminal, and if your religion or its book say that these are not crimes but right and honorable acts, then your religion is wrong and needs to be dealt with accordingly.
 
I don’t believe they will corrupt other Muslims. I can’t see a young Albanian boy interested in hearing about the white devil’s corruption and how black scientists revealed the Qur’an. 😃
I hear you, 😉
 
That is essentially the problem with Shari’a (the last 4 words there), and I think it is a problem inherent in the Shari’a itself, not just this or that practice of it. How would it possible to implement amputation for theft or murder for matters of conscience (e.g., changing religion) in a “pleasant manner”? It’s not possible. So I oppose even allowing it for the particular communities, even as I recognize that this is hypocrisy with reference to the Jewish courts. Should the Jewish courts implement death sentences and mutilations and other things that are at variance with federal laws enacted to deal with the same situations, then they ought to be shut down, too. We can’t have a Christian state-within-a-state for the Christians, a Muslim state-within-a-state for the Muslims, a Jewish state-within-a-state for the Jews, etc. Not in a America, anyway. America is not analogous to any place in the Middle East, and we ought import or support that kind of legal system here. It does nothing but legitimize and solidify social stratification along religious lines. I don’t know about any of you, but as much as I love Lebanon as a symbol of the deep roots of indigenous Middle Eastern Christianity, I have no desire to see my own country fall to that kind of sectarianism, and I think that’s precisely what religious-based courts lay the groundwork for.

I understand and in a sense agree with the idea that banning such courts drives the same activity underground, but that does nothing but confirm to me the unavoidable and insurmountable problem with treating Islam the same as every other religion. We simply cannot allow one religion’s decrees to override the secular values embraced by the West with regard to freedom of conscience. To do so betrays the ex-Muslim (or questioning Muslim, or true pluralism-supporting Muslim) by virtue of their belonging to Islam in the first place. It essentially says “Sorry. You’re a Muslim, and Islam allows this treatment of you, so there’s nothing we can do. It is lawful according to your community, and we wouldn’t want to cause problems with that community.” In reality, it is that community that causes problems when they live by an inherently problematic law code, in so far as it conflicts with the law of the country in which they now find themselves.

Basically, you want to be able to stone suspected adulterers and rape victims, kill apostates and homosexuals, and deny women many of their fundamental rights as human beings? Sadly, there are many such places in the world where it is perfectly legal and encouraged to do so. The United States, Canada, Western Europe, and most other places where Muslims find themselves living outside of the Islamic world are NOT such places, and should not be allowed to become such places at any level. Even if it is just one FAMILY practicing this law completely within the confines of their own house, it should be treated as a crime when it causes them to commit crimes. (And it has happened several times in recent memory; see the Aqsa Parvez case in Canada, Noor Almaleki case in Arizona, Amina and Sarah Said case in Texas, etc.)

These are crimes. Your religious identity is not an excuse to be a criminal, and if your religion or its book say that these are not crimes but right and honorable acts, then your religion is wrong and needs to be dealt with accordingly.
Sad, how many times of recent this has already happened in a private household.

What I find even more disturbing is attorneys who make a legal claim that because its of their country, that some legal slack should be given. Even to the degree with Korean citizens I’ve seen this.

There lies the issue, being the Constitution is a legal document, when a solid defense attorney slides something though. Then it sets a presence for the next legal battle.
 
I fail to see what you’re laughing about? And when did I say they’re pushing ANY agenda? I said “as long as they don’t” push any agenda. That is subjunctive, right?

And if you know me at all, you’ll know I’m not a FOX News fan. :eek:
What agenda is Islam in America pushing? LOL

The only agendas being pushed on everybody else are the homosexuals and anything the Fox network propagates… a network with hosts who are supposed ‘Catholics’ with ‘Christian values’ spreading lies and hate about another religion. :rolleyes:
 
I fail to see what you’re laughing about? And when did I say they’re pushing ANY agenda? I said “as long as they don’t” push any agenda. That is subjunctive, right?

And if you know me at all, you’ll know I’m not a FOX News fan. :eek:
They did a horrid job reporting the Japan reactor situation… They false reported melt-downs at least twice.
 
Faux News is notorious for bad reporting and bias that is off the charts. Their coverage of George W. Bush’s election is infamous for what went down.

Several times now Jon Stewart of the Daily Show has caught Sean Hannity using false footage attributed to what he was talking about. Example: he had Michele Bachmann on his show (sigh) and he told her how impressed he was with the turnout of her parade of Tea Partiers. As he was talking he said that the footage on the screen was impressive. Problem was, that was the event from over a year ago! The trees were different colors because the footage was in Fall and the real event was in summer! The numbers in the real event she held were about 50% less than the previous year so Hannity wanted to make it look more impressive. Then there were other times he showed someone being accosted by liberal demonstraters but it was old footage, etc. He’s a real piece of work, Hannity. O’Reilly is a bit off, Greta is truly bizarre, and Glen Beck…wow, where to start with that guy!??:confused::eek:
They did a horrid job reporting the Japan reactor situation… They false reported melt-downs at least twice.
 
I’ll take CNN hands-down over Faux News. Fox is just the worst. MSNBC is super liberal. CNN tends toward more liberal thinking but is more moderate than MSNBC or Fox IMO. As a teacher and a union steward, I can’t stand listening to Fox. I need dramamine! LOL
And let’s not even start with CNN… :rotfl:
 
I think we ran this thread into the ground. Mark is right though we need to engage in dialogue with followers of Islam, just isn’t happening on this thread. So I don’t see that this thread will serve us anymore. I don’t see where we haven’t pretty much bought anyone who cared to be, up to speed with the social/political issues. Which will serve another thread well.

Theres not many threads where at some point the Bible/Quran quotes don’t begin or the interpretation of the opposites faith in scripture begins. Those just go no-where very fast and perpetuate anger instead of even moving in the direction of resolving it. I believe while its all well and fine should one choose to deeply understand the other faith. The real issue is social/political in living together. That from what I’m reading is the focus

I would do it, but as you see my thought process is to easily distracted. We need someone to keep it focused and stay on point, should we again start another. It may not even get off the ground, for whatever reason I don’t see many followers of Islam as of lately. Most likely because this thread really became our own issues. Not so much in Bigoty but in better understanding and getting up to speed together.

Peace,

God Bless, Gary
 
I watched a CNN Special over the weekend that was about hate crimes and persecution of Muslims in America. Honestly, it was an eye-opener. They showed this Muslim community in Tennessee trying to build a mosque. These good ole boys burned all the bulldozers and construction equipment during the dead of night to stop it. Then they showed these folks banning together to fight the mosque’s construction. They tried to claim to the city that Islam wasn’t a religion. You see, in this town in TN if you’re building a religious edifice you don’t need to go through the process of getting special permits that other buildings require. These hardcore anti-muslim folks were claiming Islam is not a religion but a terrorist culture and they don’t believe in a real god so as a result they need to request all the other permits, etc. The court proceedings were a total joke. The arguments were so stupid. They showed the protestors yelling and cussing out the Muslims, a girl got a verbal beat-down by a Republican female senator when she couldn’t win the argument. It was something else. When some Muslims went out to check out the damage to the construction equipment, some good ole boys fired off some shots in a nearby wooded area that scared them to death. There was graffiti, etc.

This mass hysteria against the Muslims, the idea that they’re all out to ruin us, this Tea Party stuff, it reminds me of Hitler’s anti-Jewish stuff in the 1930’s, the paranoia that we have dangerous aliens amongst us.

Crazy…
I think we ran this thread into the ground. Mark is right though we need to engage in dialogue with followers of Islam, just isn’t happening on this thread. So I don’t see that this thread will serve us anymore. I don’t see where we haven’t pretty much bought anyone who cared to be, up to speed with the social/political issues. Which will serve another thread well.

Theres not many threads where at some point the Bible/Quran quotes don’t begin or the interpretation of the opposites faith in scripture begins. Those just go no-where very fast and perpetuate anger instead of even moving in the direction of resolving it. I believe while its all well and fine should one choose to deeply understand the other faith. The real issue is social/political in living together. That from what I’m reading is the focus

I would do it, but as you see my thought process is to easily distracted. We need someone to keep it focused and stay on point, should we again start another. It may not even get off the ground, for whatever reason I don’t see many followers of Islam as of lately. Most likely because this thread really became our own issues. Not so much in Bigoty but in better understanding and getting up to speed together.

Peace,

God Bless, Gary
 
Faux News is notorious for bad reporting and bias that is off the charts. Their coverage of George W. Bush’s election is infamous for what went down.

Several times now Jon Stewart of the Daily Show has caught Sean Hannity using false footage attributed to what he was talking about. Example: he had Michele Bachmann on his show (sigh) and he told her how impressed he was with the turnout of her parade of Tea Partiers. As he was talking he said that the footage on the screen was impressive. Problem was, that was the event from over a year ago! The trees were different colors because the footage was in Fall and the real event was in summer! The numbers in the real event she held were about 50% less than the previous year so Hannity wanted to make it look more impressive. Then there were other times he showed someone being accosted by liberal demonstraters but it was old footage, etc. He’s a real piece of work, Hannity. O’Reilly is a bit off, Greta is truly bizarre, and Glen Beck…wow, where to start with that guy!??:confused::eek:
Gurney,

Don’t faint. I am posting a little, again. 😉 I love the Daily Show. Stewart shows no mercy when pointing out the lies, inconsistencies, and shortcomings of public figures.
I watched a CNN Special over the weekend that was about hate crimes and persecution of Muslims in America. Honestly, it was an eye-opener. They showed this Muslim community in Tennessee trying to build a mosque. These good ole boys burned all the bulldozers and construction equipment during the dead of night to stop it. Then they showed these folks banning together to fight the mosque’s construction. They tried to claim to the city that Islam wasn’t a religion. You see, in this town in TN if you’re building a religious edifice you don’t need to go through the process of getting special permits that other buildings require. These hardcore anti-muslim folks were claiming Islam is not a religion but a terrorist culture and they don’t believe in a real god so as a result they need to request all the other permits, etc. The court proceedings were a total joke. The arguments were so stupid. They showed the protestors yelling and cussing out the Muslims, a girl got a verbal beat-down by a Republican female senator when she couldn’t win the argument. It was something else. When some Muslims went out to check out the damage to the construction equipment, some good ole boys fired off some shots in a nearby wooded area that scared them to death. There was graffiti, etc.

This mass hysteria against the Muslims, the idea that they’re all out to ruin us, this Tea Party stuff, it reminds me of Hitler’s anti-Jewish stuff in the 1930’s, the paranoia that we have dangerous aliens amongst us.

Crazy…
Couldn’t agree more. The mass hysteria shows no trace of Christian love or even rational thinking.

We must stand firm in our Christian faith and prevent false doctrines from infiltrating our Churches; but this is entirely different from “terrorizing” our Muslim neighbors.

I think many on the extreme right are inciting fear and hatred–Glenn Beck really works it. Many Christians are unaware of the fact that Beck is Mormon and worships a god who is an exalted man.

Peace,
Anna
 
I read about Tenn. I agree, even the nut down in Fla with the Quran issue.

We have some insane thinking in different areas of the US no doubt. Its no secret many down South still insist that the US ends at the Virginia State Line. That attitude to some extent never disappeared completely.

How does atheism relate to islam with bigotry?

God Bless, Gary
 
I like the BBC reporting also. US News has been all over the map. Here is NE they scared the death out of everyone with just the weather reporting this winter. Today is was be on look out for Brush Fires state wide :eek: I have never in History heard that reported to the extent it was in alarm this morning.

Its go all the way to extreme, and we can’t be wrong because the Truth will fall short somewhere in the report. Thats what I seen this winter anyway.

Blessings, Gary
 
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