Muslims - Why the Two Claims?

[expounder]

Jesus is said to be fully God, God cannot die so the notion of Jesus dying on the cros in incorrect.

Absurd according to Islam and its idea of God. Any loving parent, for example, would do that for their child.

You need to read all of Deuteronomy 24. It has nothing to do with salvation and the sacrifice of Christ. There is no teaching to be “abrogated.”

Same for Exodus. Plenty of innocents suffer on earth because of the sins of others. Others suffer as part of God’s plan. For instance, the “Massacre of the Innocents.”

God can do anything He wants.

As someone else wrote: " It can be a limitation if God is forced to do it. It is not when God wants to do it. There’s the difference. "

What exactly is islam’s idea of God?

There are two types of suffering in this world suffering caused by HUMANS and suffering from God as a test of faith, to bring someone close to God or punishment.
Other people suffer due to other people’s sins because the suffering is caused by other humans.

 

[expounder]

Also it is like person A murdering person B, but person C gets punished for it, logical?

 

[Stylteralmaldo]

Also why would God have soul if he is omnipresent? A soul confines someone to one place

Not sure if anyone addressed this.

Christians believe in the Holy Trinity which means three persons in one God.

God is not confined to a soul. The person of Jesus was.

Since God is omnipresent, could He not, as being God, be both flesh (Jesus) and also not (Father, Holy Spirit) at the same time? To say God must be one or the other would contradict His nature as omnipresent would it not?

 

[expounder]

Not sure if anyone addressed this.

Christians believe in the Holy Trinity which means three persons in one God.

God is not confined to a soul. The person of Jesus was.

Since God is omnipresent, could He not, as being God, be both flesh (Jesus) and also not (Father, Holy Spirit) at the same time? To say God must be one or the other would contradict His nature as omnipresent would it not?

So Jesus is 2 separate entities? One Human the other sharing Godhood. So does this mean that Jesus and the God inside Jesus are different?

 

[Stylteralmaldo]

So Jesus is 2 separate entities? One Human the other sharing Godhood. So does this mean that Jesus and the God inside Jesus are different?

Jesus is human and shares in the Godhead.

Jesus performs a different function within the Godhead compared to the Father and Holy Spirit. God is not different than Jesus.

Let’s compare it to a head. The eyes perform a different function compared to the nose. The ears also perform a different function than the other two.

The head in this example represents God. The eyes represent Jesus in this example. The ears represent the Father, and the nose the Holy Spirit.

The ears, nose, and eyes are all a part of the head.

 

[LtTony]

What exactly is islam’s idea of God?

There are two types of suffering in this world suffering caused by HUMANS and suffering from God as a test of faith, to bring someone close to God or punishment.
Other people suffer due to other people’s sins because the suffering is caused by other humans.

Yes, that’s what I said. We all suffer in this life because of other peoples’ sins, but because of Jesus, we don’t have to in the next life. If we accept Him, His sacrifice and live by His teachings.

 

[LtTony]

Also it is like person A murdering person B, but person C gets punished for it, logical?

No, but what if everyone sinned, and it totally cut them off the God, that there was nothing they could do about it unless one took it upon themselves to make it right, and that was acceptable to God?

tektonics.org/lp/paydaddy.html

Jesus said He is the only way to God the Father. Does that make sense?

 

[expounder]

No, but what if everyone sinned, and it totally cut them off the God, that there was nothing they could do about it unless one took it upon themselves to make it right, and that was acceptable to God?

tektonics.org/lp/paydaddy.html

Jesus said He is the only way to God the Father. Does that make sense?

What does it mean by God calling himself jealous?

Deut. 5:9 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me…

That does not sound like God at all?? God is all-loving… merciful.

 

[LtTony]

Not sure what you mean.

 

[MartinJordan]

Of course He’s a jealous God. He’s jealous on His terms. Not the human kind of jealousy. God wants full allegiance to Him. He is also a loving God who wants the best for His people, His Creation formed from His image. There should be no other gods except him.

MJ

 

[MartinJordan]

What does it mean by God calling himself jealous?

Deut. 5:9 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me…

That does not sound like God at all?? God is all-loving… merciful.

I already responded to this but failed to include your comment. As such just wanted to add that the verse 5: 9 is part of Deut 5 so you would need to see the full context of Deut 5 wherein God’s speaks of love that He desires from His people.

MJ

 

[expounder]

Of course He’s a jealous God. He’s jealous on His terms. Not the human kind of jealousy. God wants full allegiance to Him. He is also a loving God who wants the best for His people, His Creation formed from His image. There should be no other gods except him.

MJ

Then i don’t see why Christians fail to see the problem with the muslim idea of God.
Similarly he wants full allegiance through obedience…but he still loves us, he responds to our wishes and if we don’t get something it is only because God knows there is something better out there which we are not knowledgeable enough to know about.

 

[IgnatianPhilo]

History is Islam’s greatest enemy. Ultimately they have to admit corruption happened near immediately during the life of the apostles as they taught Christ did die on the cross and was risen. This however puts the quran in a questionable position in which there was clearly a remnant faithful and that would “prevail” as it were to the day of ressurection. There was no Christian group that prevailed that had islamic beliefs, therefore we must conclude the message of Jesus died with him or the short lived ministry of apostles that failed to effectively communicate the message.

 

[MartinJordan]

Then i don’t see why Christians fail to see the problem with the muslim idea of God.
Similarly he wants full allegiance through obedience…but he still loves us, he responds to our wishes and if we don’t get something it is only because God knows there is something better out there which we are not knowledgeable enough to know about.

I never doubt Muslims love for God my friend. Not to worry. I have lived in a Muslim country and experienced nothing but respect by my fellow countrymen.

That said, and I speak for myself, although born in to a Catholic family, I have only relatively recently (3 years now) been studying the Faith and research into History of Christianity and learn why we believe what we believe. It is so rich and vast with records to show for it.

MJ