Must every woman be a feminist?

[JMMJ]

What about all the women here in their 30s and 40s who have had unplanned children? There are a lot of them. let’s not be spreading incorrect information that womans’ fertility evaporates at the age of 30. Please.

 

[Lea101]

What about all the women here in their 30s and 40s who have had unplanned children?

Pretty sure my mother had all her kids after her 30s!

Women’s fertility varies. You definitely get less fertile, but if you were fertile as heck in the first place, you shouldn’t have a problem conceiving. If you’re having issues with irregular/non existing periods etc in your 20s, your decreased fertility is going to be very, very, noticeable when you get older.

 

[MagdalenaRita]

You said yourself that you stopped listening/keeping up.

I also said earlier that I work part time since my family is grown, and many, if not all, of the women I work with are feminists. Some claim to be Christian or even Catholic feminists but continue the same arguments I have heard for 40 years, so it is pretty hard to turn it off.

I am also friends with “Catholic feminists” at my parish.

So being around them very frequently, I get advised by these Catholic feminists to neglect my home and my husband and Church teaching, so it is, again, pretty hard not to hear feminist ideology.

The advice I hear from non Christian feminists, well lets just say I won’t repeat it here. It is not Christian at all.

God bless

 

[EnglishTeacher]

That’s frankly their problem for not listening in Biology. Men should also start paying attention since I’m seeing more and more men completely unaware that their sperm quality gets worse overtime. It’s boggling how people blame everything else for their ignorance! If you want kids then at least be aware of the possible issues of having them early or later.

This is a good point also. Interestingly, the man is a factor in infertility in about 40% of cases. People tend to think of fertility as a woman’s issue and assume that the woman is the “problem” when couples have difficulty conceiving, when it is just as likely that the issue is the man or both partners.

Bottom line is that fertility issues are more common than people think; so if you are married and reasonably healthy, don’t wait too long to find out.

 

[Edmundus1581]

I think you dismissed an oversimplified perspective for another oversimplified one.

Gender roles were honestly more complicated than you and I both know. It’s more than women sitting pretty at home while men die, or men controlling everyone while women die.

…

It’s easier to filter out the other sex’s struggles and focus on your own, but doing that gives you tunnel vision.

Just for background, this was in response to my post in which I raised some of the injustices men have suffered in the past - including being the gender which expected to fight in wars, while women have participated in shaming those who didn’t volunteer.

Somehow, that part of my post was edited out, either by myself by mistake, or by a moderator.

---

Responding then to @Lea101.

Firstly, thanks as always for the well-thought reply!

I raised the issue of men being sent to war as just one of the many injustices suffered disproportionately by men in the past.

For centuries men have done these things, and taken on all the sufferings and obligations which go with manhood, without complaining and without even being aware that as men we are being discriminated against.

It’s only in very recent times that men have started to become aware of these discriminations and to draw attention to them, and the only reason we do so is because we have seen women get equal rights in all areas, largely complete by the early '70, and yet feminists still:

1. Continue to bring up alleged injustices against women in the past, with no regard for context, to paint a picture of women as perpetual “victims” and men as “oppressors”.
2. Continue to look for new “injustices” by manipulating definitions and statistics, and shutting out male victims from their analysis. They do so with massive government funding and support from the MSM, government and academia. The “domestic violence” industry is probably the front organisation in this. Women, by and largely, respond sympathetically to every complaint as it is aired.
3. Shut out any discussion of the very serious problems which men are raising. In Australia we are attempting to redress the widespread misuse of “domestic violence” orders in custody proceedings, which has dire implications for men and children. The feminist response is to shout it down as an issue.

From this men have learned that there will be no end to the feminist “victim” myth. Even the Church participates, in the heirarchy, various bodies, and the laity.

In response, among ourselves we have started to become aware of the many injustices men have traditionally faced and continue to face.

We are also becoming aware of our status as second class citizens in society and the Church, and the dire, deadly perils our sons face in a female dominated world. The “dire, deadly perils” they face are at a whole different level to the problems women face. (Of course, as individuals many women face serious problems, just as men do - the difference is that feminists portray individual women’s problems as part of a pattern of “oppression”, and succeed in getting sweeping intervention).

 

[Edmundus1581]

We don’t expect feminists will ever listen to us and our suffering, but rather, on the contrary, they will ever ramp up their complaints, and continue with legislation and spending which favors women at the expense of men.

We don’t expect feminists will listen, nor do we expect that, by and large, women will either.

So, feminists will continue to hold their reins over society, but men are responding by starting to admit among ourselves just how bad we have it, and how bad our sons will have it.

That is why men are, at long last, talking about the injustices we have faced and continue to suffer. For us, it’s a defensive and long-overdue response to a perpetual and dishonest attack.

This is going to effect women too, as men withdraw from a society they know is increasingly set against them, knowing that talking is pointless and self-damaging.

The same will go for the Church, as men will contribute the bare minimum required, but no more.

What will be be doing instead? Just working for ourselves and enjoying life, freeing ourselves from social obligations and the traditional expectations of men, and keeping one step ahead of the rapid disintegration of society under feminism.

 

[MagdalenaRita]

Thank you for this post. These are the issues I know men have faced and our sons are facing today. Please know that there are women, I know there are many, who hear you, are concerned and are praying for men, husbands and sons.

 

[Alyosha1984]

A great joke I heard from a relative (a general contractor) who lives in a hotbed of radical feminism in northern California…

“There are 3 kinds of feminism.
The first kind hates all men.
The second kind hates all men and wants to imprison them.
The third Kind hates all men, wants to round them up into concentration camps and exterminate them all.”

I have many radical feminists in my family and friends and I’d have to say this joke speaks very accurately and succinctly to what feminism has become nowadays. Feminism has changed from a noble movement into a narcissistic, misandrous preoccupation of very wealthy women on the coasts, who rip apart the “patriarchy” while making $100,000+ per year…They disdain or at best ignore that passage in Genesis (the very beginning of scripture) that underpins all feminism…The one about God creating man, male and female, in his image.

They don’t have much respect for women who focus on their family, either, even if those women still work.

So the short answer is…I believe your response to your friend was perfectly understandable. You intuitively understand what modern feminism has become and want nothing to do with it. Kudos to you.

 

[Lea101]

disproportionately

I take issue with this term, because this doesn’t hold much meaning when you limit the criteria. It’s possible to make a case that women disproportionately suffered when you only look at other issues that mainly involved them as well. So it’s best to be objective.

If we were to look at all the injustices everyone faced, we would notice it really sucked for everyone. Maybe except for rich folks, as we know that rich women had enough financial security and access to education, and rich men don’t have to toil and support his family as much as poorer men.

For centuries men have done these things, and taken on all the sufferings and obligations which go with manhood, without complaining and without even being aware that as men we are being discriminated against.

By the same system that placed men above women in terms of hierarchy. Ironically, a lot of men suffered from this (and are still suffering when we look at mental health).

men have started to become aware of these discriminations and to draw attention to them, and the only reason we do so is because we have seen women get equal rights

I do agree that we are generally more aware of men’s issues after we shed a light on it.

I don’t think you agree with this take, though, but I feel like men’s interests back then can be conflated with worker’s rights, unions, political movements etc back then, since this mostly affected men. There’s a tendency to address men’s issues that way. Not saying it was perfect, but I don’t think the narrative for men was “Treat us like you would to a woman”, but rather “Stop exploiting us”

Continue to bring up alleged injustices against women in the past, with no regard for context, to paint a picture of women as perpetual “victims” and men as “oppressors”

Context matters. We still have due process although the public doesn’t take it seriously anymore. We can acknowledge that. I think more and more women are tired of a victim hood complex, too.

Continue to look for new “injustices” by manipulating definitions and statistics, and shutting out male victims from their analysis

I see this in the red pill spheres too. Everyone enjoys being a victim. Feminists are just more mainstream at the moment.

Shut out any discussion of the very serious problems which men are raising.

Context probably matters here too. I mean, as a more conservative person I can’t speak about women’s issues without people trivialising it. Remember when you (or at least i think it was you) who tried to say men were more oppressed in India when we talked about rape and violence against women there.

We all could do a better job at listening

 

[Lea101]

In Australia we are attempting to redress the widespread misuse of “domestic violence” orders in custody proceedings, which has dire implications for men and children.

It’s difficult to comment on this without more information, as I have no idea how these men’s activists are trying to get it done, or the implications this would have on the affected women as well. Domestic violence and law had a pretty tricky relationship too, in my country, as men were pretty angry at the way it was handled. But after studying it, I realised that they didn’t grasp the full picture of why it is the way it is.

Even the Church participates, in the heirarchy, various bodies, and the laity.

Can you elaborate?

We are also becoming aware of our status as second class citizens in society and the Church

Again how so? The Church is still very patriarchal. Female servers and readers don’t threaten it (I’m assuming you’re referring to the changes).

Of course, as individuals many women face serious problems, just as men do - the difference is that feminists portray individual women’s problems as part of a pattern of “oppression”, and succeed in getting sweeping intervention

I agree with the first part of the sentence, but aren’t you doing the same for men in the latter part?

 

[Lea101]

So, feminists will continue to hold their reins over society, but men are responding by starting to admit among ourselves just how bad we have it, and how bad our sons will have it.

To be honest, I notice the men who are talking about this issues all tend to prefer a patriarchal society regardless. Rather than an egalitarian one. What’s your take on this? It’s difficult for me to understand their perspective when I know many of their solutions is to cut back feminist advancements (so that they’re in charge) instead of extending it or ensuring that men are protected.

“There are 3 kinds of feminism.
The first kind hates all men.
The second kind hates all men and wants to imprison them.
The third Kind hates all men, wants to round them up into concentration camps and exterminate them all.”

Which one am I?

Feminism has changed from a noble movement into a narcissistic, misandrous preoccupation of very wealthy women on the coasts, who rip apart the “patriarchy” while making $100,000+ per year…They disdain or at best ignore that passage in Genesis (the very beginning of scripture) that underpins all feminism…The one about God creating man, male and female, in his image.

They don’t have much respect for women who focus on their family, either, even if those women still work.

This is probably accurate if you’re talking about the “figureheads” of feminism. The politicians, the celebrities and so on.

If you close your eyes and pick a random voter at the polls though, you would find that they’re pretty moderate and relaxed about ‘feminism’.

Same if you were to randomly pick a Republican voter. You would find that their views are more moderate than the guy they’re voting for.

With social media and the incessant politics and less social skills in the West, , I honestly think you guys are victim to what social psychologists call cultivation.