My daughter says she is Agnostic

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My 17 year old daughter recently announced she is agnostic and doesn’t want to go to Mass anymore because she doesn’t believe Church teachings, particularly about homosexuality. She has been raised as a Catholic her entire life and this has come as a surprise to me. I don’t know if I should force her to go to Mass on Sunday or let her stay home or what to do. Any advice?
 
My 17 year old daughter recently announced she is agnostic and doesn’t want to go to Mass anymore because she doesn’t believe Church teachings, particularly about homosexuality. She has been raised as a Catholic her entire life and this has come as a surprise to me. I don’t know if I should force her to go to Mass on Sunday or let her stay home or what to do. Any advice?
I would insist that she attends Mass however I wonder what the underlying problem is. I knew a teenager who announced that he didn’t believe in God because he was a homosexual and didn’t agree with the Church’s teaching on that. I’m not suggesting that this is your daughter’s problem but maybe a friend of her’s has announced that she/he is homosexual.

Annie
 
I can’t imagine that “forcing” her would be good on any level, for anyone.
If she doesn’t believe and is not going willingly, I imagine that will only upset and frustrate both of you…and perhaps make her resent you and the religion.
This is an age when it’s natural for teens to re-think what they’ve been taught and try to figure it out for themselves–it is an important phase.
My advice is to let her think this through at her pace. A person cannot be “forced” to believe–that defeats the whole meaning and marriage of faith and free will.

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If only I had a dollar every time an American liberal said “it’s natural for kids under 18 to do XYZ” that isn’t good and the parents should just back off and let the teenager live their own lives. :rolleyes:
 
You can force her to attend mass if you *want *her to resent Catholicism.

Or you can leave her be. I’ve had friends who have stopped attending their religious services. For some it was a phase, for some it wasn’t, and others in between. However, the ones who were forced to go to church are the ones who no longer value any religious influence in their life what so ever.
 
My 17 year old daughter recently announced she is agnostic and doesn’t want to go to Mass anymore because she doesn’t believe Church teachings, particularly about homosexuality. She has been raised as a Catholic her entire life and this has come as a surprise to me. I don’t know if I should force her to go to Mass on Sunday or let her stay home or what to do. Any advice?
As her parent, I think you should insist she attend Mass so long as she is living under your roof. You should also educate her on Church teaching, which is very logical and compassionate towards GLBTQ folks but like all things Catholic, calls for us to take the higher path. 👍

If she cannot accept Catholic teaching, I would tell her to seriously consider not receiving Christ at Communion.

Also, I agree with what someone else said. This may be just a case where a friend has come out as gay as she’s just going overboard on the support. Teenagers have a tendency to do that and some of them erroneously think their friendships are the most important relationships in their lives.
 
Try and guide her to some real substantive books on Theology of the Body. See if maybe someone in your area is teaching a class? Is she interested in philosophy? Real philosophy will wake someone up from agnosticism.

Explain to her that the Church loves homosexuals. Reiterate Pope Francis’ and Pope Benedict XVI’s compassionate words on the care of homosexuals. Send her this link

Be a model of true Christian love and joy for her. I’ll be praying!
 
She may also just have homosexual friends or just the pressure of the societal norms telling her that these are acceptable behaviors.

Either way, there’s not a lot you can do. As another poster said, forcing her may backfire and make her bitter. Many people aren’t willing to listen to the Church’s teachings whether they actually know what they are or not.

The best thing to do is be a great and shining example of what it is about to be a Catholic. Maybe years from now she’ll come back and realize how empty life is outside of the Church.
 
You can force her to attend mass if you *want *her to resent Catholicism.

Or you can leave her be. I’ve had friends who have stopped attending their religious services. For some it was a phase, for some it wasn’t, and others in between. However, the ones who were forced to go to church are the ones who no longer value any religious influence in their life what so ever.
Don’t you think she should at least find out why the change is happening instead of just throwing up her hands or saying “kids these days”?

I really am curious now as to the style of parenting these friends of yours have had.
 
Don’t you think she should at least find out why the change is happening instead of just throwing up her hands or saying “kids these days”?

I really am curious now as to the style of parenting these friends of yours have had.
Sure she should, but there’s a difference between talking about it with your kid and forcing them to go to a Mass they don’t care about or believe in. That just leads to resentment.
 
She may also just have homosexual friends or just the pressure of the societal norms telling her that these are acceptable behaviors.

Either way, there’s not a lot you can do. As another poster said, forcing her may backfire and make her bitter. Many people aren’t willing to listen to the Church’s teachings whether they actually know what they are or not.

The best thing to do is be a great and shining example of what it is about to be a Catholic. Maybe years from now she’ll come back and realize how empty life is outside of the Church.
That’s giving up too easily. I think she can at least find what the root problem is and go from there.

Yes, it’s probably going to take some digging to find it out and the teenager may not be completely honest at first.

I really, really don’t like the “well, there’s nothing you can do about it”.

That’s hogwash, and if I only I had a dollar every time I heard an American say that about parenting.

Parenting takes effort and time if you want to do a good job. It’s easy to just throw your hands up and say “well, that’s what teenagers do!” or to not care.
 
Sure she should, but there’s a difference between talking about it with your kid and forcing them to go to a Mass they don’t care about or believe in. That just leads to resentment.
Oh, I’m not talking about forcing. :dts: I had a friend who was forced into going to Confirmation, and from what I could it tell it was just so his mom, who I don’t think even goes to Mass anymore due in some part to her husband, could say she got all her kids through Confirmation. :rolleyes:

There is an element of parental authority that demands respect, and I don’t think Kelly’s situation is anywhere near that yet. It may just be a simple explanation or it may not, but I am convinced she needs to engage her daughter on this and not just let it be :yup:
 
I’m not talking about forcing.

There is an element of parental authority that demands respect.
I agree.

I was “forced” to do all kinds of things as a kid. Go to school, go to the doctor and the dentist, be home by curfew. I wasn’t physically restrained or abused if I didn’t, but these were expectations my parents had set my entire life. We didn’t go to church, but if we did, it would have been very consistent for my parents to say, “I’m sorry you are having this time of difficulty in your faith, however, in our family we go to Mass on Sundays. You will attend with us out of respect.”

If I thought my parents were wrong, and said so, depending on how I said so, my father tended to go crazy about being disrespectful and so on, but my mother, at least, would sit me down and have a conversation about it. You can guess who I was more likely to listen to. 😉

In addition, as part of a conversation, I would ask your daughter to explain to you what the Church teaches about homosexuality and why it teaches it. I am going to hazard a guess that she won’t know, or only have a vague idea. She may not be mature enough to grasp the reality of it (I remember being a teenager and thinking there could be no greater good than what I wanted that exact minute :p), but at least that opens the door for her to consider that she may not have every answer 100% and that the Church has reasons for why it teaches what it does - on any subject.
 
If I thought my parents were wrong, and said so, depending on how I said so, my father tended to go crazy about being disrespectful and so on, but my mother, at least, would sit me down and have a conversation about it. You can guess who I was more likely to listen to. 😉
That’s the other side of the equation. Your father’s behaviour is not helpful. Simply saying “well, I’m in charge” doesn’t cut it anymore, especially in today’s world. I think kids often want explanations and reasons, especially teenagers.

I wonder how many parents there are who are all about #4 in the Commandments but think going to Mass on Sunday is optional.
 
I’m 16. I’ve been through what your daughter has been through. And I know a thing for certain - If she announced to the family this position on the existence of God, taking her to Mass won’t do her any good in her own perspective. The best thing I think you can do is to see what she disagrees with the Church, look up the moral basis on which those reasons are done, and try to explain them in order to show that there’s a bigger rational cogency with that than with her opinion. I mean seriously, if homossexuality is all of her reasons to become an agnostic, she’s just going in a bit of a phase. Take it easy on her, but don’t let her go.

Homossexuality is a sensitive topic among us teens indeed. I know some and I’m good friends with them, and it still hits me that I ought not to assist their marriage in the future. But I know perfectly well why it is wrong, as you can’t call God as a witness or mediator to an union of two individuals that don’t match in the spiritual sense of things. Most of my age tend to argue from a emotional standpoint, and don’t realize that their feelings in one matter or another don’t really change the objective reality of such things. And it’s a matter of helping your daughter to grow up a bit and realize that fact. 👍

I’ll pray for you tonight. I was about to be lost forever, hadn’t the Lord twisted my path back here. But I know that such grace isn’t usually given to many people, and my prayers is all I’ve got to try and help those who are where I were. Good luck bringing her back to the Light 😉
 
There is an element of parental authority that demands respect
There certainly should be, but these days I wonder if a lot of parents are losing that respect through trying to be “cool parents” or to be “their kids’ friends”.
 
You can’t force her to believe, but her duty to her conscience is not the only question she is raising. It is, after all, easy for a Catholic who has become lukewarm out of sloth, misinformation (and the devil is sowing a lot of it!), or a desire to fit in to conclude they don’t believe in God at all. Since there are many churches in Christendom which agree with her stance, after all, why does she conclude she is an agnostic, rather than wanting to change denominations? Although perhaps her solution is more rash than her beliefs, you are forced to consider with her that there is more than the question of homosexuality at work here.

The domestic Church has an evangelical duty, and so a parent may not simply capitulate to children who decide on apostasy. Besides, there is an element of “when in Rome” here. A person accepting free room and board, not to mention all of the benefits of a well-provided childhood with her parents, has some duty to conform to the culture of the house, simply out of gratitude.

First of all, I’d thank the child for being honest about her problem. I think I would explain to my child that while I believe her when she says she has honest scruples with the Church and sympathize with her position, I also have my own problem to take into account. Your joint solution will have to be made in respect to both your conscience and hers, start with that.

You might mention the scene from A Man for All Seasons in which Thomas More being visited in prison by his friend, the Duke of Norfolk, who again urges him to sign the oath expressing approval of the king’s divorce and remarriage and proclaiming the King of England the supreme head of the church in England, which is of course the reason More is imprisoned. Norfolk points out that of the nobility and all the bishops but one had signed that the oath. (The other holdout was Blessed John Fisher.)

Norfolk: “Look at these names, Thomas. Won’t you come with us, for fellowship?”

More: “And when you have gone to Heaven for following your conscience,and I have gone to Hell for not following mine, will you come with me — for fellowship?”

It is OK to accept in charity that your daughter is honestly following her conscience in this matter, misinformed as it is. You can concede that. Do not freak out. Do not berate her. Do not assign any but the best of motives to her change of heart. Do explain that her change of heart presents you with this problem: Since she is still a member of your household and your material dependent, it is your duty to form her conscience rightly, and it is your duty to see to it that she does not neglect her duty to the virtue of religion. If she has accepted confirmation, it is also her duty to consider her decision very seriously before she chooses to become an apostate. (I would not mince words, but would use the word for what she is doing. She is not just “becoming an agnostic”. She is also “becoming an apostate.”) Some apostates are given the grace to return to the Church, but not all are. Of those who come back, many wish they had never left! She ought to be taught that nothing as serious as a religious faith or a marriage ought to be thrown away lightly, not without first having done a lot of “devil’s advocate” work against the desire to abandon former obligations, to confirm that it is the right course. We live in a time in which rash decisions cause many heartaches. The way of integrity is to avoid anything of the kind. If she wants out of the Church, it is only right that she require herself to work for it and to respect the religion of your household for as long as she is living in it. It is your duty as a parent to insist that she does these things. Exactly what will that look like? I would look for the advice of a pastor on that, and probably more than one priest.

Agree that she does not need to receive Holy Communion while she is in her current spiritual state, but let her know that you cannot violate your conscience by permitting her to stay home while the rest of the family goes to Mass, nor can you fail to carefully take her through the Church teachings which she has rejecting, in case she is rejecting them out of a lack of understanding. Let her know that you will consult your pastor and at least one other priest about how to go about this, and get back to her. (With a serious matter, it is good to get more than one opinion. I’d get a third, if the first two do not agree or if they both counsel letting you off your duty in this matter.) If she is going to choose apostasy, she ought to require herself to really work for it. Even if she does leave, at least that habit of erring on the side of integrity will serve her in good stead as she gets older. (I would put this in terms of appeasing the demands of integrity, and not just appeasing you. There is a life lesson to be had here, no matter what happens.)
 
Reposting 1ke’s post from the other thread because I liked it so much:
I think that the answer needs to come from your heart, and your spouse’s. Are you both practicing Catholics? Does the family pray together, prayers such as the faimly rosary, mealtime prayer? Are you involved in the corporal and spiritual works of mercy as a family? How are you living out the virtues as a family?

What will resonate with your son is both the example you and your spouse set for him, your personal relationship with Jesus lived out in daily life, and your own sincere testimony to him. Not our intellectually ramblings here on CAF.
 
“I’m sorry you are having this time of difficulty in your faith, however, in our family we go to Mass on Sundays. You will attend with us out of respect.”
I would be really careful about wording it that way. You don’t want to teach your child that to respect people you have to practice their faith with them even if it’s something you don’t believe in. That could backfire. If one of the child’s siblings one day converted to Islam, Mormonism, etc you wouldn’t want your child to feel as though they had to practice one of those religions when visiting their sibling out of “respect”, would you?

In general, I think these threads get a little melodramatic on both sides. When a teenager, particularly an adult or one bordering so close to adulthood loses their faith, I really don’t think that whether or not you force them to go to mass is going to have a huge effect in the long run. Sure, they may spend a few years in anger and resentment at their parents, but it won’t keep them from returning to church if they really believe. Likewise, not forcing them to attend is not going to wash away the first 17 years of religious practice and education, and I don’t think that a few extra months of mass attendance is going to make them believe again. The choice of whether or not you make them go is probably of little consequence.

However, I would not force a child to pray, say the rosary, go to confession, etc if they did not believe. It’s cruel to push someone into actively practicing a religion that they feel is incorrect, immoral, or that they just don’t believe in. Have them sit there quietly? Sure, they’ll be fine. But mandating active participation? That’s going a bit far.

I attended church through my early teens even though I didn’t believe because my elderly grandmother, who I loved dearly, was very devoted to her faith and church, so I went with her because I knew she wouldn’t be around much longer and I didn’t want to break her heart. Once she died, I stopped attending. However, going for her was a choice that I made on my own, though I did talk it out with my mom and had her support. (At this point, I didn’t admit to my mom, or to myself really, that I didn’t believe, I just knew that I didn’t like going to church and that it made me uncomfortable.) My husband, also an atheist, stopped believing when he was 16 or 17, but didn’t want to upset his family so he just told them that he was more comfortable attending mass on his own. He usually just left for an hour, hit a drive through, read in the parking lot, and then went home. Growing up, we both experienced a lot of discomfort paying lip service to a religion that we didn’t believe in. It just isn’t a good feeling to be surrounded by people who believe that something that transcends time and space is happening right at that very moment when you believe nothing of the sort.
 
My 17 year old daughter recently announced she is agnostic and doesn’t want to go to Mass anymore because she doesn’t believe Church teachings, particularly about homosexuality. She has been raised as a Catholic her entire life and this has come as a surprise to me. I don’t know if I should force her to go to Mass on Sunday or let her stay home or what to do. Any advice?
I would try to be somewhat happy she still believes in a God. They may use different language to emphasize that, “Creator”, “spirit”, etc., but they believe something’s probably out there.
 
It is not surprising particularly she has come to this conclusion. If she has been in the public schools and socializing as the average kid she’s been indoctrinated that homosexuality is a good and joyous thing that if you don’t actively promote you’re a bigot or hater.

I’d tell her I’d respect her opinion, but I need to know that she has thought it out. Then have her literally research and write an argument for both sides of the issue. Not just newspaper headlines, but true research.

When she brings both sides have an adult discussion and if she wants to choose not to believe or be Catholic she can. As part of that though, make sure she understands the consequences of walking away from the faith. The Gospel according to John is a great resource for that.

Realistically the time to teach against this was the past 17 years, not now. That said, every teen needs to “rebel” against their parents at some point, and religion is a great area of assault. This is an opportunity to help her become “educated about her faith, not indoctrinated into yours”.

Good luck.
 
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