My husband is having an emotional affair and it's killing me

[Eliza10]

Well, if you’re not already on the road to divorce, bugging your husbands car with a GPS tracker is a quick way make that a reality.

I mean honestly, you do that, and your wrong (and the husband finds out). It’s over.

That kind of suspicious lack of trust has no place in a marriage.

The thing is, jtauke, sometimes suspicions sometimes turn out to be true. Yes. Not all suspicions are unfounded. In fact, sometimes, things turn out to be exactly what they seem to be. And all the positive thinking in the world can’t change it.

If he is cheating, should she encourage his ongoing mortal sin by being complacent, and encouraging, and giving his suspicious activity a wide berth? That doesn’t seem very wise. Or moral.

As to acting on reasonable suspicions being the cause of the end of a marriage, that sounds like a very unreasonable line of thought. You should read what else has been posted in this thread. Look at Wampa’s post, #55. Wampa is a husband, and he has a very reasonable point of view. One that points to truth, IMO. Also as the poster Needing Grace wrote, Catholic talk show Drew Mariani would disagree with the point you’ve made here, too. And he is a husband.

Perhaps you have never been in such a devastating position, and cannot imagine the pain it causes to have every reason to believe that the foundation of your life is breaking apart for such a reason, and you are told its all in your head when you try to bring it out of the darkness… yet the secretive behavior continues, from the one you have loved and trusted and built your life around. If you could see it from those shoes, then you might comment differently. I hope.
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[Eliza10]

Does anyone recommend that the OP secure assets for herself? Also, my apologies for this darn autocorrect and what seems like auto memory for previously used words.

My heart goes out to everyone who has been through this.

Good idea. I forgot to say I did that too. I had a little time, because I did not let on to my ex that I had discovered his secret life and his plans. So I could retain a bit of dignity and keep my shock, panic and devastation to myself and not show it to he who would find some say to take advantage of it. (There was no point in talking, I knew from what I read). I had a friend who told me what to do. That helps, when you are in a shock-panic, to have someone who is outside the situation give give you wise, clearheaded advice. My friend advised me to get money out, and I did. And good thing, too. I was home with a young child, the first time not working in our whole marraige, having worked as a professional the whole marraige, first to put him through school, and he was in charge of how it was all spent. (Yes, I went to foolish lengths to make him happy). Anyway it was a good thing I got money when I did, because he cut me off from everything as soon as he knew I knew. Its a sordid story. But I tell it to advise the OP to get a good adviser. When you are upset you do not think of everything.
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[Pellehcim]

I don’t know if my suspicions are correct. **I have not proven anything. ** Everything I’ve said hasn’t been proven. Maybe it is all in my head. I don’t know.

Here’s why I think she works near him. I was shoe shopping with my son (an adult) on Saturday. He wanted to go to a store in the mall my husband works. I sent my husband a text saying we would be there if he wanted to come say hi (maybe I shouldn’t have warned him but my son was with me). He did join us. Why I shouldn’t be suspicious… it was my husband’s idea for us to go to a few different stores in the mall to see what they had and he walked along with us. When we left he didn’t have a problem kissing me goodbye in the open at the mall. Now, why should I be suspicious then? …He got a call on his work cell as we walked from one store to another. His tone was very sweet and he wasn’t talking very loud (very obvious it wasn’t one of his coworkers). He walked faster during that call to walk ahead of my son and I (but I walked faster too so I was right behind him). I didn’t understand everything he said but I do know he said ‘what are you doing?’ and ‘are you busy today, lots of customers?’. After visiting the third shoe store we were across from the food court, though quite a ways away. He became very distracted and kept looking at the food court several times so I asked my son loudly if he wanted to go to the food court to pick up something to eat to see how he would react. My husband began laughing nervously and said ‘you guys don’t want to eat there do you?’ and started walking the opposite direction of the food court so we would follow him which we did. Again, no proof just my mind filling in the blanks.

Once again today was his day off. He left in the morning and didn’t return home until 2:30 (I was at work) saying he hung out at work then went for lunch with his coworkers. He is a creature of habit so he likes to do things the same all the time which could explain why it’s always the same time on the same days. I don’t know!

When we’re together, walking in a store, outside and at home we are often touching (mostly from him reaching out to me first). We sleep in an embrace instigated by both of us from the time we go to sleep to when we wake up in the morning (over the last few months it almost feels like we are holding on for dear life though). But then the sky falls and he leaves the house as soon as he gets up in the morning to ‘check on things at work’ first thing in the morning and at the end of EVERY day (yes even Christmas day and on my birthday). …I don’t know!

Every time we have discussed this he tells me he is honestly just going in to check on things, sometimes doing a little work to finish up a project or just to chat and have coffee with his coworkers. He says he’s not doing anything wrong like many men who go drink in a bar or go to parties (he doesn’t drink alcohol). He is rarely gone for more than two hours. …I don’t know!

And what about the cooked food he brings home several times a week. He says an old lady comes by with food (like a caterer) where they (him and his coworkers) buy as they like on account that he pays each pay day. Seems reasonable I suppose but why is it that he has opened a container in front of me at home and has been openly surprised with its contents? …I don’t know.

I am going to see a priest at my church tomorrow right after work. Maybe he can help me find peace.

 

[jtauke]

I don’t know if my suspicions are correct. **I have not proven anything. ** Everything I’ve said hasn’t been proven. Maybe it is all in my head. I don’t know.

Here’s why I think she works near him. I was shoe shopping with my son (an adult) on Saturday. He wanted to go to a store in the mall my husband works. I sent my husband a text saying we would be there if he wanted to come say hi (maybe I shouldn’t have warned him but my son was with me). He did join us. Why I shouldn’t be suspicious… it was my husband’s idea for us to go to a few different stores in the mall to see what they had and he walked along with us. When we left he didn’t have a problem kissing me goodbye in the open at the mall. Now, why should I be suspicious then? …He got a call on his work cell as we walked from one store to another. His tone was very sweet and he wasn’t talking very loud (very obvious it wasn’t one of his coworkers). He walked faster during that call to walk ahead of my son and I (but I walked faster too so I was right behind him). I didn’t understand everything he said but I do know he said ‘what are you doing?’ and ‘are you busy today, lots of customers?’. After visiting the third shoe store we were across from the food court, though quite a ways away. He became very distracted and kept looking at the food court several times so I asked my son loudly if he wanted to go to the food court to pick up something to eat to see how he would react. My husband began laughing nervously and said ‘you guys don’t want to eat there do you?’ and started walking the opposite direction of the food court so we would follow him which we did. Again, no proof just my mind filling in the blanks.

Once again today was his day off. He left in the morning and didn’t return home until 2:30 (I was at work) saying he hung out at work then went for lunch with his coworkers. He is a creature of habit so he likes to do things the same all the time which could explain why it’s always the same time on the same days. I don’t know!

When we’re together, walking in a store, outside and at home we are often touching (mostly from him reaching out to me first). We sleep in an embrace instigated by both of us from the time we go to sleep to when we wake up in the morning (over the last few months it almost feels like we are holding on for dear life though). But then the sky falls and he leaves the house as soon as he gets up in the morning to ‘check on things at work’ first thing in the morning and at the end of EVERY day (yes even Christmas day and on my birthday). …I don’t know!

Every time we have discussed this he tells me he is honestly just going in to check on things, sometimes doing a little work to finish up a project or just to chat and have coffee with his coworkers. He says he’s not doing anything wrong like many men who go drink in a bar or go to parties (he doesn’t drink alcohol). He is rarely gone for more than two hours. …I don’t know!

And what about the cooked food he brings home several times a week. He says an old lady comes by with food (like a caterer) where they (him and his coworkers) buy as they like on account that he pays each pay day. Seems reasonable I suppose but why is it that he has opened a container in front of me at home and has been openly surprised with its contents? …I don’t know.

I am going to see a priest at my church tomorrow right after work. Maybe he can help me find peace.

You need to be talking to you husband…not working yourself up with suspicion.

 

[Eliza10]

I don’t know if my suspicions are correct. **I have not proven anything. ** Everything I’ve said hasn’t been proven. Maybe it is all in my head. I don’t know.

Well its good to keep an open mind because even if everything points to a thing, it can always be a rare case of exception and of course its wise to keep open to that possibility however remote, when you don’t have something solid.

You’ve been advised to talk to your husband here but I am a bit confused by that. I had the idea that you keep trying to talk to him and he keeps deflecting you.

Here’s why I think she works near him. I was shoe shopping with my son (an adult) on Saturday. He wanted to go to a store in the mall my husband works. I sent my husband a text saying we would be there if he wanted to come say hi (maybe I shouldn’t have warned him but my son was with me).

Yes, next time don’t warn him. Call him while you are in the food court and ask him to join you. Be sweet and loving, in case there is anyone there who questions that he is engaged in a loving marraige.

In fact, you could plan a surprise romantic food-court date! Maybe set up a table with a little cloth and bring a rose in a vase and a little gift and have the food ordered and arranged - his favorite… Dress attractively. You could ask him to meet you at a store Mall to help you pick something out - well, think of some place that is not the food court, and when he gets to the mall, surprise-switch the meeting place and ask him to join you at the food court. Its a “Surprise! Just because I love you!” lunch! You could say you picked that “romantic” setting because you know he likes it there so much I mean be sincere, not mocking, and just enjoy your husband like you already do other times. Ignore his discomfort and furtive looks in whichever direction and remain cheerful.

As to letting him know what you are doing, it might be good to seem to keep similar serets and see how he reacts to that. I would go about your business shopping and doing errands but maybe change it up to strange times. Have a friend call and talk sweet and covertly to her and immediately then run out for “a quick errand” and answer him in the same evasive way as he does - however he talks to you when he leaves to go food-courting - give him the same thing back.

Really, this is how my friend re-trained her cheating husband. She would give back what he gave her. Not with drama, just very calmly. Seems wrong in some sense, and I would not have done it, but truly it taught home his own behaviors. He really has improved over the years, and like I said, they are happy now and their family stayed intact.

He did join us. Why I shouldn’t be suspicious… it was my husband’s idea for us to go to a few different stores in the mall to see what they had and he walked along with us.

Or, the stores in the mall are not the problem. Its only the food court apparently.

When we left he didn’t have a problem kissing me goodbye in the open at the mall. Now, why should I be suspicious then?

How far from the food court?

…He got a call on his work cell as we walked from one store to another. His tone was very sweet and he wasn’t talking very loud (very obvious it wasn’t one of his coworkers).

Wow, that’s so wrong. Yes, its a very reasonable reason for suspicion.

What if you did the same thing?

He walked faster during that call to walk ahead of my son and I (but I walked faster too so I was right behind him). I didn’t understand everything he said but I do know he said ‘what are you doing?’ and ‘are you busy today, lots of customers?’.

Wow. Its pretty hard to explain that away. (But there is always that remotest possibility that its possible).

After visiting the third shoe store we were across from the food court, though quite a ways away. He became very distracted and kept looking at the food court several times so I asked my son loudly if he wanted to go to the food court to pick up something to eat to see how he would react. My husband began laughing nervously and said ‘you guys don’t want to eat there do you?’ and started walking the opposite direction of the food court so we would follow him which we did. Again, no proof just my mind filling in the blanks.

No, that’s not proof but it sure does do anything to move you mind over to that remote possibility that this is all nothing, does it?

Once again today was his day off. He left in the morning and didn’t return home until 2:30 (I was at work) saying he hung out at work then went for lunch with his coworkers. He is a creature of habit so he likes to do things the same all the time which could explain why it’s always the same time on the same days. I don’t know!

His heart is somewhere else on his days off…

[continued in next post]

 

[Eliza10]

[continued from previous post]

When we’re together, walking in a store, outside and at home we are often touching (mostly from him reaching out to me first). We sleep in an embrace instigated by both of us from the time we go to sleep to when we wake up in the morning (over the last few months it almost feels like we are holding on for dear life though). But then the sky falls and he leaves the house as soon as he gets up in the morning to ‘check on things at work’ first thing in the morning and at the end of EVERY day (yes even Christmas day and on my birthday). …I don’t know!

Aw, you really do have a good connection - except for this horrible problem. My first marraige, now annulled, was different. My ex was a Narcissist Personality Disorder (I want to add that I know a lot about NPD and I think its a VERY remote possibility that this is your husband’s problem) and within the first months of marraige, intimacy had progressed to extremely rare, plus he never was affectionate. Like other NPD’s, he was quite amorous and romantic in winning me, and once he did, the disinterest was sudden and permanent.

So after a long marriage with little legitimacy or affection, he decided on his own to end ours (Also I want to add that I don’t think this is your husband’s goal from what you share) and went searching, as I saw in his emails, for a period, til he found an old high school girlfriend hungry for romance. She was settled in a marriage with a nice man and a nice home and her older teens were busy with their own lives and she wanted some excitement, IMO. At any rate, they had this affair that I discovered as I described above. In one of the emails there was an email from her husband to her, heart-wrenchingly begging her to consider staying as he had discovered the affair before me.

So I had his email, and wrote him, and we ended up communicating a lot, being in the same horrible trench. And something came out in our conversation that really surprised me - they still (until his discovery of the affair came out - which, he also did not let on he knew about right away) were regularly intimate. During the affair (that he was unaware his wife was engaged in). In fact, he had read her the book out-loud in bed, “Bridges of Madison County” that I had found in our house, because she had asked my ex read while she was having it read to her at the same time so they could share the story (My ex had explained to me that he “found it at a book table at work”). Anyway, it really surprised me that his paramour and her husband had a normal affectionate and intimate marraige - even while his wife was hot and heavy in an affair.

Every time we have discussed this he tells me he is honestly just going in to check on things, sometimes doing a little work to finish up a project or just to chat and have coffee with his coworkers. He says he’s not doing anything wrong like many men who go drink in a bar or go to parties (he doesn’t drink alcohol). He is rarely gone for more than two hours. …I don’t know!

This is where you add, “Yes, I am glad you don’t go to bar and parties - or, worse, flirt or carry on friendships with other women! Especially that! I am so glad I am all yours and that I am your only best friend and all your affections and interest are for me alone!”

… what about the cooked food he brings home several times a week. He says an old lady comes by with food (like a caterer) where they (him and his coworkers) buy as they like on account that he pays each pay day. Seems reasonable I suppose but why is it that he has opened a container in front of me at home and has been openly surprised with its contents? …I don’t know.

One more thing that does get you any closer to the hope that this is all in your head, huh?

I am going to see a priest at my church tomorrow right after work. Maybe he can help me find peace.

Oh, I hope you are able to see him today! I will pray.

Did you ever consider that if he were having an emotional or full affair that you would want him back if he completely repented? I would not rule that out.

So, if he is having an affair or emotional affair, do you think you would be able to, with the help of a WISE counselor, consider under which conditions the marraige could continue when/if this issue is past?

There is a book that I think would help you. Its James Dobson’s Love Must Be Tough/U]. It tells the betrayed spouse how to act when their spouse is straying. Its very very wise, and its not how you’d think you would act. Its for people in very similar situations to yours. Click on that link, and you can see reviews. There are millions in print so, as you can see, you can get a copy used for one cent plus shipping. Its a fast read and it will give you some amazing perspective. I really recommend it. Its a perspective you may seriously want to consider.

[P.S. all advice on how to interact with your husband please take with a grain of salt. What you say and do it up to your discretion and what your heart tells you is wise. But my book reccommend, Love Must be Tough - I really do hope you read it soon; I think you will be glad you did.]
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[Eliza10]

I just want to add, I really think you should read that Love Must Be Tough book, as soon as possible. I think you are who this book is written for. I think its what you need now because you need to be considering what you will do find out that your suspicions are in fact true. To consider what you will do then, is important, and this book will give you a perspective you never thought about.

As I said, its for the spouse of the spouse who wanders, who becomes disinterested and distracted from his partner. James Dobson based it on his wife’s behavior when they were dating, and had been for some time, and when it came to be about the time he would normally propose, considering the place in their relationship, he was becoming preoccupied, sort of disinterested now, in his dear gal. And her behavior in response to his disinterest reeled him right back in. And he is well known for his very happy long marriage today!

Dobson is a psychologist, and he explains quite clearly why her behavior worked, and why strictly monitoring your natural, normal response to this distressful situation is VITAL. Its a great how-to for one in your shoes. Dobson’s view is that, generally, the marriage be saved, and, based on that assumption (which he admits is not easy for the scorned spouse) he gives his plan for how to switch the tables. Even if you decide that if he is having an affair, you are gone - still, whatever you do, this book will offer you choice *and *your dignity back. Or, you can choose to have him back on your terms (meaning: exclusive fidelity!).

*not *what you need.]

Dobson’s book is short and sensible and eye-opening.

As a matter of fact, my friend, who is happily married now and further planning her evolving future with her longtime husband - her husband whom you could hardly characterize, back in the beginning when she had her first baby with him, as being much more than a compulsive liar and a cheat - used this book at one crisis point and has held to its principals since, and she holds this book as one of the top, key things that enabled her to keep the marraige together. And she did not lose any of her dignity in the process! It helped her take control of and change the impossible-seeming situation her husband had created. And the result was was certainly to his advantage, too! How different his life would have been, had they divorced (which you’d have expected in their situation!). But now he has enjoyed a beautiful and faithful wife and an intact home - how blessed to have an unbroken home and raise your family intact! They have found common ground (they vacation together as a family well) and are making plans for their future (moving south to more sun), and are now very involved in their teens’ lives… an outsider would never know what they went through to this point!

Anyway, please do get the book. I am writing again to stress that, and also, especially to tell you that you must not tell him you have the book. Hide it, put another book jacket on it, whatever, just ***don’t let him see it. ***If you heed Dobson’s advice, he will grow increasingly curious and his reading it will give your secret away. And you don’t want that.

 

[1990Domer]

Well, if you’re not already on the road to divorce, bugging your husbands car with a GPS tracker is a quick way make that a reality.

I mean honestly, you do that, and your wrong (and the husband finds out). It’s over.

That kind of suspicious lack of trust has no place in a marriage.

If you haven’t walked a mile in her shoes well, enough said…

 

[ckcollins]

I’m so sorry you are having trouble. In having trouble with my marriage too. I’m an at home mother and my husband works all the time. When he is home he doesn’t really help out with our daughter. During the week he has the car. I’m stuck at home. I’ve tried talking to him but nothing seems to be working. I’m so lonely and burnt out. The only time I get to myself is when I meet with a support group once a week for a few hours. I feel lost and I don’t know what else to do.

 

[mommy_k]

I think the way to handle this is to talk to a priest before anything is done here.

As Catholics, we are taught by Jesus how to deal with things like this.

First you are to talk to your husband–if he does not listen, then get another involved–a priest. You can also pray to the Holy Spirit to guide you.

We are not supposed to cover anothers sins with sins of our own. Tracking, spying, I am sorry to say, is also bearing false witness. Transparency is needed here if a relationship is to continue with trust–on both ends.

When pushed to the wall-is when it counts most. This is when we must be most careful not to offend God. God comes first. Jesus advice comes first. Not semi-secular advice of nailing a husband by means of deceptive behavior.

To catch your husband would be very easy. Throwing away his cellphone and watching him scramble would also be fun. Telling him yuou are planning mall trips in the evening around the same time-would make him sweat and perhaps see what’s up. I have a list of things that would drive him nuts and put a damper on his plans. But this is not how a person who is dedicated to Christ operates.

 

[Eliza10]

…
As Catholics, we are taught by Jesus how to deal with things like this…

We are not supposed to cover anothers sins with sins of our own. Tracking, spying, I am sorry to say, is also bearing false witness…

When pushed to the wall-is when it counts most. This is when we must be most careful not to offend God. God comes first. Jesus advice comes first. Not semi-secular advice of nailing a husband by means of deceptive behavior.

To catch your husband would be very easy. Throwing away his cellphone and watching him scramble would also be fun. Telling him you are planning mall trips in the evening around the same time-would make him sweat and perhaps see what’s up. I have a list of things that would drive him nuts and put a damper on his plans. But this is not how a person who is dedicated to Christ operates.

I don’t think that would be “fun” for her. Do you really think she is of the mindset of “fun” right now? She is looking for truth. Nor does she want to drive him nuts. Put a “damper on his plans” and actions that would divert from his paramour, yes. That sounds like a plan.

Also tracking and spying is NOT bearing false witness, nor is it covering another’s sins with her own.

Maybe you did not read the whole thread. Earlier it was explained that using a GPS tracker in a case where a spouse has reasonable suspicion was advocated by Catholic talk show Drew Mariani and his co-hosts. Its safe to assume the matter was well-thought through from the point of view of Catholic Morality (including the sin of “deceptiveness”) before it was aired on Catholic Radio.

Its not very romantic to track and spy and I am sure the OP wishes with all her heart that she were not in a position to have to consider such a thing. But sometimes, things don’t happen like they are supposed to. Because people are fallible.

Deceptiveness, as in espionage, is sometimes necessary and not an immoral means to an end. Think of the military. Or police work. However, if there is any question in her mind on that, she certainly should run the question by her priest, who is in a position to clarify the truth of the matter.

 

[1990Domer]

I think the way to handle this is to talk to a priest before anything is done here.

As Catholics, we are taught by Jesus how to deal with things like this.

First you are to talk to your husband–if he does not listen, then get another involved–a priest. You can also pray to the Holy Spirit to guide you.

We are not supposed to cover anothers sins with sins of our own. Tracking, spying, I am sorry to say, is also bearing false witness. Transparency is needed here if a relationship is to continue with trust–on both ends.

When pushed to the wall-is when it counts most. This is when we must be most careful not to offend God. God comes first. Jesus advice comes first. Not semi-secular advice of nailing a husband by means of deceptive behavior.

To catch your husband would be very easy. Throwing away his cellphone and watching him scramble would also be fun. Telling him yuou are planning mall trips in the evening around the same time-would make him sweat and perhaps see what’s up. I have a list of things that would drive him nuts and put a damper on his plans. But this is not how a person who is dedicated to Christ operates.

One could look at her actions the same way the undercover files were obtained from Planned Parenthood, and with the blessing of Father Pavone!

As I see it, she’s looking out for the soul of her husband and perhaps saving him from mortal sin. If he’s doing something he shouldn’t be, he can go to Confession and clean his soul.

I think Eliza’s suggestion was more in the “mixing up your routine” advice. And actually, the OP’s first commitment is to his wife, not his job or job extracurriculars. If his job demanded it for a short time period, sure. But this does not seem to be the case. He should want to be with his wife, not avoiding her night after night (and days off).

 

[mommy_k]

Eliza10–Bearing false witness is lying and engaging in deceptive behavior.

Secretive behavior is used to confuse, omit details, hide something, or deceive another person-to spy on a spouse is being deceptive-- Therefore-it is bearing false witness.This will not lead to peace, quite frankly the opposite.

Commandments are not relative to feelings, such as anger or anxiety nor are they conditional.

I do not live my life with following the advice of radio hosts. I am sure he means well, but I answer to a higher Authority. I follow His teachings–and in this case, it would be to address this with her husband–next step if he does not listen, get 2 or 3 to talk to him, and then bring it to the church. These are Jesus’ words. I can look up the scripture for you if you are unfamiliar.

For sure this is a very difficult thing to go through. But if Jesus teachings are followed here, it will result in the best outcome for both.

 

[mommy_k]

One could look at her actions the same way the undercover files were obtained from Planned Parenthood, and with the blessing of Father Pavone!

As I see it, she’s looking out for the soul of her husband and perhaps saving him from mortal sin. If he’s doing something he shouldn’t be, he can go to Confession and clean his soul.

I think Eliza’s suggestion was more in the “mixing up your routine” advice. And actually, the OP’s first commitment is to his wife, not his job or job extracurriculars. If his job demanded it for a short time period, sure. But this does not seem to be the case. He should want to be with his wife, not avoiding her night after night (and days off).

Yes Domer-- this is why Jesus says to bring it to the church.

 

[Eliza10]

I’m so sorry you are having trouble. In having trouble with my marriage too. I’m an at home mother and my husband works all the time. When he is home he doesn’t really help out with our daughter. During the week he has the car. I’m stuck at home. I’ve tried talking to him but nothing seems to be working. I’m so lonely and burnt out. The only time I get to myself is when I meet with a support group once a week for a few hours. I feel lost and I don’t know what else to do.

ckcollins, I’m sorry. I’m saying a prayer for you now…

Its a huge and important vocation you are in, being a Mom, and a wife. The Lord is close to you, an He hurts for you when you hurt. He knows how hard it is. He is proud of your small accomplishments to overcome difficulties and drudgeries. Its not easy taking care of the day-to-day same things over and over again and not feeling appreciated. But its appreciated in Heaven, and your work is dignified and important.

 

[1990Domer]

Yes Domer-- this is why Jesus says to bring it to the church.

I’m confused. So is what happened with the PP videos wrong? And was Father Pavone and other people like Lila Rose wrong? Was I deceptive when I was asked to call my local PP to ask if they do mammograms to see how they would answer?

Honestly, I can see how the OP would be fighting for her marriage by wanting to seek out more time with DH. If he’s not going to spend time with her, then by goodness let her spend time with him. She’s not hiring a PI…she’s having dinner in a different venue. Perhaps you may feel more comfy with her making dinner reservations at another place as a first step. I think it could serve the same purpose…to see how comfy he is not going back to the job and out to dinner with her.

I do not think this replaces marriage counseling or talking together with their priest. But if being less passive allays her anxiety, I think she should go for it. Make it a family dinner by inviting son. And perhaps there may be other pressing issues she could talk to him about (perhaps retirement, her son moving back home) because he’s otherwise not making himself available to her.

Food for thought and prayers for all.

 

[mommy_k]

I am very surprised and disappointed.

Domer—if Father Pavone gave a blessing–he is a priest and is part of the church. The church therefore gave it’s blessing for this matter…

That’s why the OP should go to a priest–to get counsel, and not take advice of lay people on the internet telling her to track and spy on her husband-as upthread.

I did not address anyone in particular-just the tone of the thread----- -eliza questioned me–just as you are now.

The works of mercy say to give advice to others to avoid potential sinful behavior-- and it is being spun.I am being admonished for suggesting for her to speak with a priest.I guess somewhere on earth this makes sense–bully the person who suggests counsel with a priest.

 

[1990Domer]

I am very surprised and disappointed.

Domer—if Father Pavone gave a blessing–he is a priest and is part of the church. The church therefore gave it’s blessing for this matter…

That’s why the OP should go to a priest–to get counsel, and not take advice of lay people on the internet telling her to track and spy on her husband-as upthread.

I did not address anyone in particular-just the tone of the thread----- -eliza questioned me–just as you are now.

The works of mercy say to give advice to others to avoid potential sinful behavior-- and it is being spun.I am being admonished for suggesting for her to speak with a priest.I guess somewhere on earth this makes sense–bully the person who suggests counsel with a priest.

You were not admonished for the suggestion of the OP seeing a priest. Can you state where that was openly said to you in concrete words? I agreed with you and said her actions should include seeing a priest and/or Catholic marriage counselor. My husband read the whole thread with me. He agreed that it is not “spying” to go to your spouse’s workplace to have dinner with him/her, especially if it is a public place. You are twisting my suggestion. I gave no implication of spying, so please don’t lump me in that category.

I think your use of the word “bullying” for the suggestion of asking a priest is a loaded word. No offense, but I know bullying all too well. The word should not be used lightly.

 

[Eliza10]

You were not admonished for the suggestion of the OP seeing a priest. Can you state where that was openly said to you in concrete words? I agreed with you and said her actions should include seeing a priest and/or Catholic marriage counselor. My husband read the whole thread with me. He agreed that it is not “spying” to go to your spouse’s workplace to have dinner with him/her, especially if it is a public place. You are twisting my suggestion. I gave no implication of spying, so please don’t lump me in that category.

I think your use of the word “bullying” for the suggestion of asking a priest is a loaded word. No offense, but I know bullying all too well. The word should not be used lightly.

Right, it was the judgmental accusations of immorality and of going against the ways of Our Lord that was a problem with aforementioned post. Yes, its perfectly clear that no one here seems to think seeing a priest is a bad idea, in fact most of us have already suggested it *, and it seems the OP was on her way to do that this week. I sure hope the priest was available for her.

Domer, its great that your husband read the thread with you. He sounds like a good man. Its helpful to get the advice of a husband in this thread, particularly since it is a husband who is the suspected culprit in this scenario.

My husband is like that, too. (we have both been blessed in that way!). First, he is a good man. Also he is interested in what I am interested in (and visa versa!) and though I did not share this particular thread with him yet I am sure he would agree with most of us here, and with the aforementioned Catholic radio host, that it is *not *immoral to take reasonable steps such as those discussed here to get the info needed. If he is sinning, its natural to withhold that. Sin gets a hold on people, and one does not easily disengage from it once it takes a hold. Sin thrives in secret. (Exposing the secret means the sin does not thrive…).

The OP has a desire to uncover and expose and make it difficult for the sin to thrive, not to persecute her husband, whom she loves with a breaking heart right now. If attempts at exposition prove her fears are unfounded I have no doubt she will simply be very glad!

When you have never been in an stuck in a mucky, ugly situation like this, its easy to judge that you would deal with it cleanly and neatly, and not get mucky like those engaged in the mucky situation. I know, because I have misjudged others in such situations when I was not in them, and in fact, I am sorry to say of myself, I imagined such situations were beneath me, since I, thus far in my life, had managed to deal with my difficult situations with dignity. Then one day in spite of all my efforts to stay clean I got dragged into the mud beyond my control, against my will. And the mud is dirty. And people judge you when you are smeared with it. And its not nice…
.

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Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. - Matthew 10:16
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.*

 

[1990Domer]

Right, it was the judgmental accusations of immorality and of going against the ways of Our Lord that was a problem with aforementioned post. Yes, its perfectly clear that no one here seems to think seeing a priest is a bad idea, in fact most of us have already suggested it *, and it seems the OP was on her way to do that this week. I sure hope the priest was available for her.

Domer, its great that your husband read the thread with you. He sounds like a good man. Its helpful to get the advice of a husband in this thread, particularly since it is a husband who is the suspected culprit in this scenario.

My husband is like that, too. (we have both been blessed in that way!). First, he is a good man. Also he is interested in what I am interested in (and visa versa!) and though I did not share this particular thread with him yet I am sure he would agree with most of us here, and with the aforementioned Catholic radio host, that it is *not **immoral to take reasonable steps such as those discussed here to get the info needed. If he is sinning, its natural to withhold that. Sin gets a hold on people, and one does not easily disengage from it once it takes a hold. Sin thrives in secret. (Exposing the secret means the sin does not thrive…).

The OP has a desire to uncover and expose and make it difficult for the sin to thrive, not to persecute her husband, whom she loves with a breaking heart right now. If attempts at exposition prove her fears are unfounded I have no doubt she will simply be very glad!

When you have never been in an stuck in a mucky, ugly situation like this, its easy to judge that you would deal with it cleanly and neatly, and not get mucky like those engaged in the mucky situation. I know, because I have misjudged others in such situations when I was not in them, and in fact, I am sorry to say of myself, I imagined such situations were beneath me, since I, thus far in my life, had managed to deal with my difficult situations with dignity. Then one day in spite of all my efforts to stay clean I got dragged into the mud beyond my control, against my will. And the mud is dirty. And people judge you when you are smeared with it. And its not nice…
.

---

Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. - Matthew 10:16
.
.

Eliza, it sounds like you also have a supportive spouse. When he read the part about the OP surprising him for dinner, he felt it was perfectly within her wifely duties to do that. Any information she ascertains is a bonus. But it’s not like she’s hiring the FBI to wiretap the food court or the mall (all DH’s thoughts). He didn’t feel she needed a priest’s blessing to have dinner with her own husband. He’s averted her questions, he avoids her (including days off) and now she is hopefully taking steps to be more assertive. I think God gave the OP a well-formed conscious in that she tried to do the right things first (asked if anything is askew with their marriage on multiple occasions). DH’s behavior didn’t change but got worse. Their son moved back in with them and he noticed the behavior.

My thought…if there is a breakdown in communication, a set family time to talk is a great first step. But, if he won’t come to her, then she and possibly son need to come to him. It’s really that simple. If her husband doesn’t like any of the food court places, then they pick a mutually enjoyable place to try to get their marriage back to where it was. And yes, I hope she saw her priest this week. If husband balks, then it’s time for some serious counseling or attend a marriage retreat. We were part of our Church’s pre-Cana team for about 10 years (we left after my son’s needs became too great). Our wisdom–mine and my husband’s–comes from training we received in our diocese and archdiocese from…priests. The things we heard and saw. And the things that were not cool to do. I don’t believe I supported some of the more extreme ideas, so I did not mention those ideas. However, I don’t get the sense that the OP’s husband understands the full effect he is having on her. She does need to tell him this either on her turf or his, without the fear that he will not stay and head off to work. He should be contrite and stay with her until she feels true transparency has taken place.

Lack of transparency stinks. No matter what type of relationship, it does harm in the short and definitely in the long term.