My marriage: disillusioned from day one

[jkiernan56]

We are selfish by nature

I’d like to make a clear distinction in response to the statement above.

We are NOT selfish by nature but rather selfish as a result of FALLEN NATURE. Human nature is basically GOOD but wounded because of original sin.

CCC #1714

“Man, having been wounded in his nature by original sin, is subject to error and inclined to evil in exercising his freedom.”

 

[PeterMuz]

“A marriage without sex is just like a same sex friendship.”

Thank you for pointing this out. I find it hard to believe that anyone who has experienced a sexless marriage would feel that sex is an unimportant component.

…

From reading the more thoughtful responses, I think that maybe the question I am trying to ask is: can you create sexual chemistry out of nothing?

I think you can, but it takes working together to solve whatever problem is there. For some reason you are nod feeling fulfilled. The two of you should work together to figure out why that is and see what can be done about it.

There is a book called Holy Sex that you might look into. amazon.com/Holy-Sex-Toe-Curling-Mind-Blowing-Infallible/dp/0824524713

You said in your first post that you would appreciate probing questions… Were you using contraception? Contraception can make sex feel like a chore, typically to the woman, because sex is not seen as a gift from God.

I know you said that you both went and saw a counselor, but maybe it would be a good idea for you to go alone. I think it is important for you to figure out what has you turned off. It could be that your sexual experience that took place outside of a marriage has made sex in marriage less exciting. I am not blaming or accusing, just throwing that out as a possibility.

Has your husband had any other sexual partners other than you? If not, and you can count the number of times the two of you had sex on one hand, then he is probably still learning what it means to be intimately involved during sex. Many many people will tell you that sex gets better over time, and I will not argue that point.

Remember, sex is an important part of marriage and life, mainly because it is the avenue that God gave to use to procreate. But sex should also be a way that you connect with your spouse.

Anyways, I will pray for you. Pray that you God gives you wisdom to know His will. I hope that you feel more peace during this hard time.

 

[newbetx]

I’d like to make a clear distinction in response to the statement above.

We are NOT selfish by nature but rather selfish as a result of FALLEN NATURE. Human nature is basically GOOD but wounded because of original sin.

CCC #1714

“Man, having been wounded in his nature by original sin, is subject to error and inclined to evil in exercising his freedom.”

My definition was incomplete. Your clarification is appreciated and I agree.

 

[Augusta_Sans]

There is a book called Holy Sex that you might look into. amazon.com/Holy-Sex-Toe-Curling-Mind-Blowing-Infallible/dp/0824524713

This was recommended by several people throughout the thread. It is on my reading list. (Fortunately, my local library even has a copy!) Most of the questions you posed have been answered in earlier posts.

Were you using contraception?

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=5984769&postcount=94

I know you said that you both went and saw a counselor, but maybe it would be a good idea for you to go alone.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=6008748&postcount=163

Has your husband had any other sexual partners other than you? If not, and you can count the number of times the two of you had sex on one hand, then he is probably still learning what it means to be intimately involved during sex. Many many people will tell you that sex gets better over time, and I will not argue that point.

He did not have sex before our marriage, and I think this is a very fair point. In hindsight, our sex was like playing tennis at two different skill levels. The more I think about the tennis analogy, the more I feel bad about not sticking it out until he was caught up to my level.

Thank you for your advice and for your fresh perspective!

 

[Augusta_Sans]

This thread is becoming my journal. Here’s just a little update.

Thursday night my husband stopped by my apartment. I was flustered before he arrived (putting together two different lasagna recipes simultaneously) and after he arrived, things went downhill, . I lost my temper and snapped at him; he ended up leaving to let me cool down. I’ve said here that we never fight–that’s true. We never fight–but I “fight at him.” I’m glad he is smart enough to walk away when I’m snippy.

Anyway, I invited him over for lunch today and we had a wonderful relaxing afternoon, eating lunch, folding laundry, talking about how we’d like to reconfigure the closets in his (our?) house. Sounds silly, but it was “connecting” time for us. I put forth a serious effort to be affectionate toward him from the minute he arrived to the minute he left. I complimented him more eloquently than usual–I think I overwhelmed him with my affection because he was speechless and almost in tears. When we kissed, it felt more romantic than it has in recent memory. It’s amazing how just a few hours of diving into the “obligation” helped me feel like we’re on the right track. Woohoo!

 

[whatevergirl]

Oh my gosh, this is great!

 

[monicatholic]

–I think I overwhelmed him with my affection because he was speechless and almost in tears.

augusta, we ***love ***this guy (and we love you, too!)

I can only imagine how hard he’s been praying for you. i can only imagine…

 

[Chovy]

Augusta, I have been mostly away from CAF for a while and read this whole thread last night. I just have to say that this is my new favorite love story. I really hope and will pray that you two can make this work. I have no helpful guidance to give but lots of prayers.

God bless.

 

[Augusta_Sans]

Thanks for the continued support, everyone. Chovy, this is becoming my favorite love story too (ha!) monicatholic, he is a really lovable guy.

The revelations keep coming now that I’m embracing the “if you build it, they will come” attitude toward love. It explains why he is always so “in love”–he is always acting lovingly toward me. It all seems so simple now–wish I had gotten the memo before the wedding night!

 

[silentstar]

I have read through only about the first four pages of this thread. However in those pages, I found that no one raised the issue of child sexual assault or rape as a teenager/adult, even though those experiences are unfortunately, a lot more common than they should be.

Abuse happens to boys and men as well as girls and women. It is especially difficult for abuse survivors to have a sexual relationship when they are emotionally very connected to someone. It can seem too much like repeating the past.

I’m not saying either of you was abused, but have you ever talked about this subject? I find that most people don’t like to think about this stuff, even though it can have a lot of impact on adult sexual functioning.

 

[Augusta_Sans]

I’m not saying either of you was abused, but have you ever talked about this subject?

Nope, no sexual abuse or rape in either of our pasts, though it’s definitely a good question to have asked!

 

[FrenchGwen]

Thanks for the continued support, everyone. Chovy, this is becoming my favorite love story too (ha!) monicatholic, he is a really lovable guy.

The revelations keep coming now that I’m embracing the “if you build it, they will come” attitude toward love. It explains why he is always so “in love”–he is always acting lovingly toward me. It all seems so simple now–wish I had gotten the memo before the wedding night!

It’s so awesome. Keep on building !!

 

[AngelEyes4Jesus]

This thread is becoming my journal. Here’s just a little update.

Thursday night my husband stopped by my apartment. I was flustered before he arrived (putting together two different lasagna recipes simultaneously) and after he arrived, things went downhill, . I lost my temper and snapped at him; he ended up leaving to let me cool down. I’ve said here that we never fight–that’s true. We never fight–but I “fight at him.” I’m glad he is smart enough to walk away when I’m snippy.

Anyway, I invited him over for lunch today and we had a wonderful relaxing afternoon, eating lunch, folding laundry, talking about how we’d like to reconfigure the closets in his (our?) house. Sounds silly, but it was “connecting” time for us. I put forth a serious effort to be affectionate toward him from the minute he arrived to the minute he left. I complimented him more eloquently than usual–I think I overwhelmed him with my affection because he was speechless and almost in tears. When we kissed, it felt more romantic than it has in recent memory. It’s amazing how just a few hours of diving into the “obligation” helped me feel like we’re on the right track. Woohoo!

OMgosh! this is so wonderful! I couldn’t help but be moved to smiles when reading this, and when my fiance / DH came in here asked me wht on earth I was so happy about! lol so it was plainly apparent that I was so happy for you that I wore it on my face! lol Your’re in my prayers still, YAY!! I am so happy for you!!~

In Christ,
Nicole

 

[humble_maid]

I am grateful for your progession Augusta. It shows that a community of believers can really help. God is helping you along the way; just keep listening. Lots of love.

 

[John21652]

Why does this world place such a huge emphasis on sex? why, why? You get along, your respectful to eachother, your friends, I know it takes sex to have babies, but sex is not the most important thing in a marriage, but the secular world wants to tell everyone that. Marriage is based on mutual respect, love for God, kindness and thoughtfulness to eachother, not sex…

I agree with dashso here.Sex is a very important part of a marriage and a very necessary part of the bonding. But it aint everything.

I read somewhere years ago that the greatest thing for love and marriage is friendship and I now agree totally. If your husband has lost some interest, then YOU can revive it. If his sex drive has been lowered, then find out why. If he never had a strong sex drive in the first place, then tough, you married him and it is still fixable. Maybe he is nervous of you. To turn your back on him is cowardly and despicable. Talk to him about it and find a fix, or at least some common ground. Gee whiz, one day you’ll both be old and slow and how important will sex be then?

 

[NoxSineStellae]

I agree with dashso here.Sex is a very important part of a marriage and a very necessary part of the bonding. But it aint everything.

I read somewhere years ago that the greatest thing for love and marriage is friendship and I now agree totally. If your husband has lost some interest, then YOU can revive it. If his sex drive has been lowered, then find out why. If he never had a strong sex drive in the first place, then tough, you married him and it is still fixable. Maybe he is nervous of you. To turn your back on him is cowardly and despicable. Talk to him about it and find a fix, or at least some common ground. Gee whiz, one day you’ll both be old and slow and how important will sex be then?

You didn’t bother to read the thread, did you?

Augusta, thank you for continuing to share. Your story makes my heart swell with happiness - you and your husband are both good people, and I know you will have a long and wonderful marriage.

 

[Musician]

Augusta, I check this thread several times a week to see how you both are doing. I am praying for you and your husband (ex-husband…? Not sure how to refer to him now!).
What a beautiful love story! It brings me to tears. I do think that you two will reconcile and end up having a wonderful marriage.
I’ll share my daughter’s story: when she married her husband in 2007, he was a virgin with no experience. For months she dealt with his seeming lack of desire and was so upset over the lack of intimacy. I am not sure what happened, but she did turn it over to God and began praying; also asked her father-in-law to have a private word with her husband. Somewhere a switch flipped on. They are now trying for their second baby!
God is so good!

 

[Augusta_Sans]

Thanks to you all! Musician, I generally refer to him as “husband” around Catholics and “ex-husband” around non-Catholics (since that’s pretty accurate!) I consider him my husband and, even since our divorce was finalized, have had a hard time calling him anything but “my husband.”

We’re seeing each other more frequently and planning our future together again. Every time I see him, he seems even handsomer than the day before. (I’ve always thought he got continually handsomer, but I think now I’m taking the time to appreciate it and verbalize it.) This week I started up my NFP fertility charting again, just in case!

I’m glad you’re finding my story heartwarming. The transformation has obviously been heartwarming for me! I certainly would not be where I am if I hadn’t joined this forum and sought your advice. I did join a secular forum to ask the same questions about two years ago, but I think (1) I was looking for “permission” to leave, rather than reasons to stay, and (2) without the Church’s teachings to back up the advice, nothing really “stuck” for me.

 

[shannyk]

Augusta I am so happy to hear of this recent progress. Believe it or not I have been thinking about you and your husband a lot and how inspirational your story is. Truly it’s a blessing to all of us reading to see how this is unfolding. I truly think we will see you and your husband on EWTN someday, giving your testimony of God’s healing of your marriage. I bet you guys will be marriage experts, have books and CD’s and everything I really admire you personally for coming here with an open heart and mind and willingness to make things right. God bless you both, and keep us posted.

What plans do you two have for Christmas?:angel1::heaven::harp::hug1:

 

[vames]

Hi, Augusta.
I’ve read the thread and I want to add a few things, as I can relate to an extent with your experience.

You seem inhibited by some things:

• your initial trauma (being kinda rejected, no matter how subtly, back then when you were attracted to your husband; this usually leaves traces, even if you may not realize or accept this)
• the guilt that has been induced to you (you have the obligation… you are committed for life… why did you have sex before marriage… why didn’t you try harder… and so on)
• the pressure of your own perfectionism (something like “I have to do this… it’s my duty… this time it must be perfect, if I read all these books and do what others say”)
• your husband’s lack of experience, which may be the real problem here after all.

So, please, be careful not to put too high an expectation on what other people or any external factor can do to help you, whether if it’s a Retrouvaille program, various books or any kind of counseling. You risk being disappointed again if things won’t be as great as you hope or getting tired again, all of a sudden, by your own high hopes. Be relaxed, stop feeling guilty and don’t try too hard, or wait for some special moment.
Your husband may be even more inhibited than you, but I can’t believe that he doesn’t feel any desire - so he simply needs to feel assured that you won’t reject him if he want to initiate or learn something; then all you have to do is to help him a little. And then, if none of you is afraid of a new failure, you both can do anything you want. There’s no need to think about anything else. That’s how intimacy starts - being relaxed and not expecting the best thing in the world from the beginning. Laugh together, discover yourselves together, allow yourselves to fail together - but don’t avoid each other and don’t be afraid of each other.

If you feel discouraged, or if you find that you regret your “uncommitted” past and feel like leaving the marriage again, please don’t feel guilty and don’t despair. Allow yourself some more months. You and your husband are both healthy, with a normal sex drive, you obviously you love each other, so your marriage should work (believe me, this “I love him as a brother/friend” is not that definitive as you may think).
However, if things don’t turn out the way you hope, please be aware that you are not condemned to spend 70 years in a sexless marriage, and what “jkiernan56” says may be a solution. You are too young to accept a sexless life, don’t seem the kind of person that can be happy with such a marriage and therefore sooner or later you may end up either falling for another guy or wanting to leave your husband when it’s already too late (when you’ll be already a mother). Again, I say this only to relieve your fear of being trapped for life in a wrong marriage and your potential guilt of wanting a really fulfilled marriage - I don’t say that the worst will actually happen. As I said, I think things should work. It’s between you and your husband - feel free and relaxed and don’t be afraid of anything.

I wish you all the best. God bless you both!