My son-atheist, denied holy spirit

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Vulneris said:
Not a good thing if he just renounced God. It was a joke, though, a frayed, nerve-wrought joke.
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Thought it probably was a joke - but as we can’t see each other’s expressions we can’t be sure.
 
Vulneris said:
Please help me! I don’t know what to do. I’ve been a Catholic my entire life and so has my wife. We have a 17 year old son, Jeremy, who has recently denounced our faith. I understand that teenagers are rebellious, but then he denied the holy spirit.

The blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven. Matthew 12:31

He that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation. Mark 3:29

My wife and I have prayed for him every night; his faith is always in our prayers. He even refuses to go to church now. I just don’t know what to do. I’ve sat down and talked to him, but he refuses to listen. He just doesn’t seem to be aware that his soul is endanger, and his entire life after this life in the mix.

He just sits there and calls out the “contradictions” of the Bible, and telling me there is no God. Jeremy told me he got all this from this website. evilbible.com/ Written by some blasphemous woman.

Please, please help me. I am at a loss at what to do.
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This is indeed very trying. When loved ones turn against our faith, close relationships become horribly strained and often changed forever. Right now, I’m the only religious person in what remains of my extended family, and part of my nuclear family. As soon as my son went to college, he became an ardent atheist and left-winger, which I understand is somewhat normal in America. Still, it makes communicating with him now very difficult. My brother and sister are lost causes. My brother actually hates Christianity, due to the nefarious influence of his non-believing wife.
 
Vulneris said:
Hmm, thank you. Done a bit for putting my mind at ease. There’s a few he keeps coming to me with.
  1. Why would God allow all this evil to be in the world? If He’s made the world, and evil is in it, doesn’t that make God evil?
  2. How can a perfect being feel human emotions, jealous God, vengeful God, how can he be so petty?
  3. How can a perfect being create imperfect things?
  4. I forgot to mention, he’s also a big follower of Zeitgeist. youtube.com/watch?v=CNkthC-yWYU&feature=related is the first part of it.
  5. And here’s the last one which I find most troubling. After
    Telling me that God is evil, for what He’s done, that he would follow Satan before the Lord.

    I have taken him to mass, but he just sits in a sulk while we’re there.
edit: I’ve got to admit, that Zeitgeist movie raises some dangerous points.
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This Zeitgeist movie (question 4) has almost as much historical basis as the Snow White tale, so it represents no threat to the catholic faith. Just asking for some actual proof to those who advocade for the movie is the enough to mute them, unless they try to appeal to even more fallacies… I have found a thread that deals with the problems in the movie: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=275894

Questions 1 and 5 deals with the famous problem of evil. There are some very good points that were raised about it in this thread, but I would like to suggest some articles that further deal with the problem:
Regards,
Tiago
 
Just a thought about evil - stop looking at evil as a an action of God but look at it as an absence of an action from God. After all don’t we see the most of evil in places where God has been renounced. Also be very careful of the youth group. Make sure it is well monitored. There have been many people from Pagan groups trolling those groups just as we get trolls on this site - especially if they are already upset with their parents for making them go.
 
Vulneris said:
Thank you, I will try that. I think I’ll try and get him involved in a youth group at our church. I think if he’s around kids his age who are faithful, he’ll feel compelled to join in. Not just out of peer pressure, but they might convince him it’s not just a bunch of old farts running the show, but intelligent young men and women are apart of this great Faith, too.
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That is absolutely what I figured, that my daughter would be influenced by the many children that come to Mass, who are believers. Perhaps that’s all he needs to see, and if not, give him time. He will understand and learn to love the Holy Spirit, as my daughter did. I can sincerely promise you that. I give my most sincere condolences to you and your family, my friend.
 
Regarding the movie Zeitgeist… It presents as facts things that are either 1) completely made up, or 2) severely distorted (e.g. making a connection where there is none).

Here is a wonderful YouTube video that explains many of the problems with Zeitgeist. I recommend watching it and having your son do the same. If he will not, ask him why not. After all, isn’t he interested in truth? Or is he interested only in what he wants to believe?

youtube.com/watch?v=juKFSlQWojs
 
Vulneris said:
Please help me! I don’t know what to do. I’ve been a Catholic my entire life and so has my wife. We have a 17 year old son, Jeremy, who has recently denounced our faith. I understand that teenagers are rebellious, but then he denied the holy spirit.

The blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven. Matthew 12:31

He that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation. Mark 3:29

My wife and I have prayed for him every night; his faith is always in our prayers. He even refuses to go to church now. I just don’t know what to do. I’ve sat down and talked to him, but he refuses to listen. He just doesn’t seem to be aware that his soul is endanger, and his entire life after this life in the mix.

He just sits there and calls out the “contradictions” of the Bible, and telling me there is no God. Jeremy told me he got all this from this website. evilbible.com/ Written by some blasphemous woman.

Please, please help me. I am at a loss at what to do.
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I went through a very dark period of atheism, myself. I was pretty vile about it at times. I think much of it stemmed from the anger and loneliness that atheism leaves a person with.

I think there is a very potent meme out there that religion=stupidity or ignorance on the part of the believer.

This simply isn’t the truth. It is, in reality, a very ignorant thought in and of itself.

Isaac Newton was a deeply Christian individual.

John Polkinghorne–though actually an Anglican Priest–started out his life as a physicist. He has some interesting books out there. I recently read Quarks, Chaos and Christianity. He makes some good points and refutes atheism.

The Language of God is another good read by the Christian man, and scientist who headed the Human Genome Project: Francis S. Collins.

There are plenty of others out there. Pray for him and love him. Hopefully, someday, he will see the truth for himself. Only time can tell. We give our kids everything that we can and then they have to make their own choices with regard to life and a relationship with God.
 
First you must consider how to approach your kid, approach him with understanding and love and care because he probably wont be responsive to someone who doesnt get where he is coming from, he might be intelligent so this may be hard but tell him that he doesn;t have to be an atheist to be intellligent and vice versa christianity can be proven theologically wjere alot of his problems may arise he has this concept that god has to be representative of his creation in himself, but God exists and is pure love which he built us and everything his creation out of , the principle of love which is the principle of christianity arises from free will. God created the heavens and the earth with the intention of pure love, this earth was created out of love, but Mans sin created the negative forces that we see and resulted in his perfect creation to change course because of FREE WILL, LOVE cannot exist without Free WIll and humans have their own free will to be MORE TOwards LOVE (GOD) Or move toward their more instinctuual tendencies which is not Love
NO matter what way you look at it Since God has to exists other wise there wouldn’t be these LAWS OF LOVE AND FREE WILL
Love is the universal medicine, when your sick you need love, where do you turn to your mother, your father or anyone you feel comfortable loving. Love is not something we can fully explain it is beyond our comprehension. God is Love, Scientists will try to explain love but will fail, it is instinctual but at the same complex,
humans have an innate ability to love something we are blessed with , no other animal can love the way we do. none can make the decision of free will to love anything greater than them. We need Christ To learn how to Love, because Love is the universal antithesis to Pain ( Suffering) once you open your mind to the divine you can Love like Christ , and be like him
Yes you can Love Humans and explain it thatway , but even humans are like snowflakes that dissolve in the night, To open your mind to GOD and explore the possibility that he exists is all he can ask of you, if you open your mind up to the possibility of Christ it is Better than nothing,

GOD HAS TO EXISTS THe BIG BANG THEory arose out of two Scientists hearing a buzzing noise by accident in their labs, this in combination with two other scientists who were trying tofind what the other scientists found came up with the big bang theory
in other words it wasn’t a 100% scientifically sound theory and even if the big Bang Theory where true the Univerese whould Have needed preconditioned Laws in order for the explosion to work out, or what was there would have had to exist eternally , and there can be no concept of eternity unless the universe is eternity itsealf, but we know that cant exist because eternity is a concept

And everyother god is a concept the only present god Was Jesus
Because he is the only god Who has The HOly SPirit which people can actually feel
 
boilerup said:
Regarding the movie Zeitgeist… It presents as facts things that are either 1) completely made up, or 2) severely distorted (e.g. making a connection where there is none).

Here is a wonderful YouTube video that explains many of the problems with Zeitgeist. I recommend watching it and having your son do the same. If he will not, ask him why not. After all, isn’t he interested in truth? Or is he interested only in what he wants to believe?

youtube.com/watch?v=juKFSlQWojs
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Zeitgeist :rolleyes: even honest atheists should be embarrassed by that one.

Anyone who mentions it to me instantly illustrates a) they’re young and have little real knowledge of history and other world religions b) they are old and aren’t the most “intellectually gifted” shall we say…
 
How about you stop being a ****** and let him have his ‘free will’?
 
maybe, you should let him have his ‘free will’ it says in the bible, dick.
 
Verbum_Caro said:
Vulnerius,

Vulnerius, I will answer some of your responses and the atheist representative here. lol. I promise to always be respectful.

It must be a difficult time for your family. I am assuming that his objections lead him to conclude that there is no God, is that true?

But take heart! First of all, I think you ought to acknowledge (to yourself, at least, not necessarily to your son) that it seems that what motivates him is desire for Truth. That is a good sign. He seems to want to reject religion and God because they seem untrue. That desire for Truth comes from God, whether he recognizes it or not. And it shows integrity. <no basis for that assertion. First you must prove god.

Its much better to be a philosophical atheist, who objects to religion on the basis of truth, than to be a practical atheist, who acknowledges God, but lives as if He doesn’t exist.
What is this? What is a philosophical atheist compared to a practical atheist. An atheist is someone with a lack of belief. Your practical atheist scenario is untrue and does nothing but set up a strawman for you to knock down later.

So now you have to build on his integrity and his desire for Truth. I’ll offer a few ideas in response to your above list.

This might be an easy one. Ask your son to imagine for a moment that there is a God. Would your son still reject Him? Most likely he will answer yes, because of the reasons listed above (i.e. God does “unfair” things). But God doesn’t stop your son from rejecting Him, does He? But surely rejecting God is not something God wants, so why doesn’t He stop your son?

Because your son has freedom.

I think your son might see where this is going by this point. What if your son didn’t reject God, but instead wanted to steal a car? Same thing, right? God would let him. Now escalate it – some people want to do worse things. Many people want to do bad things. Most people end up doing wrong things. And even when people aren’t doing evil, bad, or wrong things, we are all doing our own thing – and that generates conflict, pain, sorrow, winners. . . and losers. . . and keeps ER doctors in business.
You are absolutely correct except for one little detail. The Judeo-Christian god has set up the senario. So yes you have free will, but is free will in a controlled environment really free will?

Why not? The limitation on being is that something can’t make something else greater in perfection than itself. But something can make things that are *less *perfect than itself. We make things all the time that are less perfect than ourselves. Our creations can never rise to the level of perfection that we have – life, intellect, willpower, creativity, etc.
Your conflating two points. A perfect being cannot create an imperfect being. Anything else is illogical. Everything a perfect being does is perfect. We are imperfect so the things we create are imperfect. See how that works?

VC
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These are very basic questions that have easy answers. At the end of the day, is your son still your son? Does he not have a right to choose his own destiny? You want to be upset? Be upset with your particular deity. He makes the rules right?

Instead of trying to brow beat you son with religion, have you actually just tried talking to him and letting him know that you love him and respect him no matter what?
 
First, i want to say that i will be praying a lot for your son as well. Prayer work. Saint Monica’s prayer weren’t in vain and finally her son finally got and even was proclaim a saint.

Is your son going to a public school? Sadly, many teachers don’t believe in the existence of God and they pass on their believe on children.

Keep on praying and especially the Rosary. Mother Mary won’t let her child being lost either.

Don’t give up hope, pray and fast!
 
You have had many good answers here about how to refute your son’s arguments about contradictions in scripture. We have raised three sons to adulthood, and two are still faithful Catholics. The other is still a work in progress! Your son may be exerting his independence in the way that he knows will affect you the most. Fine. If your son cannot behave respectfully at Mass, no eye rolling, slouching, loud sighs etc., tell him that he does not have to go. However, tell him that he will not be spending Sunday morning in bed while the rest od the family is at church. Check with local nursing homes, homeless shelters, hospitals etc. in your area for volunteer opportunities. I am sure that they must need help on Sunday morning. If that doesn’t work, maybe he can cut the grass of an elderly neighbor. Tell him that atheists say that they don’t need God to behave in a moral manner. He is going to prove this to you by engaging in some kind of community service on Sunday morning. If he doesn’t like that idea, he can attend church with the family. I cannot take credit for this idea. It came from another CAF poster a while ago, and I have never forgotten it. The prayers of all mothers of teenaged boys, past and present, are with you.
 
Marysann said:
You have had many good answers here about how to refute your son’s arguments about contradictions in scripture. We have raised three sons to adulthood, and two are still faithful Catholics. The other is still a work in progress! Your son may be exerting his independence in the way that he knows will affect you the most. Fine. If your son cannot behave respectfully at Mass, no eye rolling, slouching, loud sighs etc., tell him that he does not have to go. However, tell him that he will not be spending Sunday morning in bed while the rest od the family is at church. Check with local nursing homes, homeless shelters, hospitals etc. in your area for volunteer opportunities. I am sure that they must need help on Sunday morning. If that doesn’t work, maybe he can cut the grass of an elderly neighbor. Tell him that atheists say that they don’t need God to behave in a moral manner. He is going to prove this to you by engaging in some kind of community service on Sunday morning. If he doesn’t like that idea, he can attend church with the family. I cannot take credit for this idea. It came from another CAF poster a while ago, and I have never forgotten it. The prayers of all mothers of teenaged boys, past and present, are with you.
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All that is great, but I have one question. Do you live the Xian live 100%? Do you follow and do everything you “should”? I only ask because your last comment was very sarcastic. “Tell him that atheists say that they don’t need god to behave in a moral manner.”

So does this mean that all Xians behave in a moral manner? How about letting your children choose for themselves? This thing about brow beating your child to your beliefs is kind of archaic don’t you think?
 
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