You see your again asking a Roman question in a Byzantine setting
. Fasting is not a law or an obligation. Pick a church and do your best to follow the discipline of that church, mixing and matching really doesn’t work.Sorry, I was asking about fulfilling Mass obligations. If there is Divine Liturgy on Christmas Eve, would it fulfill my Mass Obligation for Christmas being Roman Catholic? Because it was stated that the DL on Christmas Eve is not the DL for Christmas Day itself. But for Roman Catholics, Mass in the evening of the 24th is the Mass for the 25th. Should I be asking this in the L&S forum? But I think most Roman Catholics may not understand why the Divine Liturgy on the 24th does not fulfill obligations for the 25th, that is why I ask it here.You see your again asking a Roman question in a Byzantine setting
Constantine I don’t mean to be a pain, really I don’t…but I must say all of these obligation type questions have no place in Eastern thought. Even the fact that the Eastern churches in communion with Rome have now legislated these things is a HUGE Latinization.
Don’t you think its good such questions are asked? I bet there are many Roman Catholics out there with the same questions in my head right now. The more we learn, the more we appreciateConstantine I don’t mean to be a pain, really I don’t…but I must say all of these obligation type questions have no place in Eastern thought. Even the fact that the Eastern churches in communion with Rome have now legislated these things is a HUGE Latinization.
The fact that you keep asking legalistic type questions whether it refers to fasting, attending Divine Liturgy, Original sin or purgatory really shows you need some guidance from a spiritual father. Please feel free to IM me and I can help point you in the right direction.
I know there are people here who will disagree with me (Vico for1), but according to many Latin rite bishops, if you are regularly attending a Byzantine church you should follow the discipline of that church. Even if you are connonicly Latin. That means if you regularly attend the Ukranian church, you should follow the feasting and fasting of the Ukranian church. Once again please consult with a spiritual father as these decisions are best made with someone who can guide you in what is best for your soul.Don’t you think its good such questions are asked? I bet there are many Roman Catholics out there with the same questions in my head right now. The more we learn, the more we appreciate
And of course I have to ask the question in such a way since its the way I was taught to think. The more the likes of you clear it up, the more I understand how the “Eastern mind” works.
Also, being canonically Roman means I still have to fulfill my obligations to the Roman Church the way I am taught how to. That is why I have to ask the question even though I will be attending Divine Liturgy instead of a Roman Mass.
Our subdeacon will set me up with one. I await that. But what I believe is that canonical enrollment also bonds you to the disciplines of that Church. Otherwise, some people would just jump Rites for convenience I would think. Or otherwise, what is the purpose for requesting Canonical transfer?
I had exactly the same thought when reading your post, ConstantineTG.
Believe me it’s not that I don’t appreciate your struggle but continuing to try to fit the square peg of the Latin Church into the round hole of the ECCs will continue to be frustrating.I thought you told us you were going to Midnight Mass on the 24th followed by a feast with your family, now you’re going to DL on the 24th. It’s more than I can follow.
Of course, the best way of learning is living the life of one. Like language, you can learn as much as you like in school but unless you actually converse in said language, you won’t develop that mastery. Or some people get good without education, but just living in a country where that languae is predominantly used. When I lived in Hong Kong for 3 months, I picked up a few useful phrases and learned to count from 0-9, its very useful when ordering for fastfood
Wait, this hasn’t happened yetIt’s great you are now connected with a spiritual father who can help you begin to untangle some of this.
Thats how we traditionally want to do it as a family and as a culture. Even the times that we do not go to Mass on the Eve of Christmas and go instead on the day itself, we have the meal. Someone brought up Divine Liturgy during Christmas Eve being a separate Liturgy than the DL for Christmas Day itself. It just got me curious how it affect one who is canonically a Roman Catholic. But who knows, maybe I’ll be an Eastern Catholic this weekend, the Bishop is in town and I might get to meet him and I might ask himI thought you told us you were going to Midnight Mass on the 24th followed by a feast with your family, now you’re going to DL on the 24th. It’s more than I can follow.
My guess is that it will be. Although the fact that Eastern Catholics consider the Eve Divine Liturgy separate from the Divine Liturgy of the day itself, I don’t know how it affects someone who belongs to another sui juris. I suspect that if I attend any Catholic Rite Liturgy after sundown on the 24th (which is like 3pm up here in Canada at that time of year) then as a Roman Catholic I will fulfill my obligation. I just want to make sure that while I transition I do not turn my back on my obligations to the Roman Church while I’m still canoncially enrolled with it.If you’re interested in the “obligation” of the Latin Church then yes, ask on the L&S section. If you’re interested in the EC perspective then take it to your spiritual father. In my opinion only he can properly help you sort out all the tangled threads you’ve got going.
Please know I’m wishing you the very best in all this.
The reason one is encouraged to live the life of the church you are considering joining is so that you know what your getting into. All the Roman Catholic Bishops I have discussed this with have concurred that they have no problem with people who are interested in one of the Eastern churches to fully participate in that church. If you really consider it one who is looking at living as an Eastern catholic will more then “fulfill” all the “obligations” of a Roman Catholic and then some.
One thing I believe is that it depends which Canons apply to you. Honestly, even in everyday life I’m a very law abiding man. I don’t want to realize something in the future that I broke laws today, I will feel really bad about it. I’m not saying I never break laws, but as much as possible I want to do things the right way. And since this is concerning the faith, the more I would want to do it the right way.The reason one is encouraged to live the life of the church you are considering joining is so that you know what your getting into. All the Roman Catholic Bishops I have discussed this with have concurred that they have no problem with people who are interested in one of the Eastern churches to fully participate in that church. If you really consider it one who is looking at living as an Eastern catholic will more then “fulfill” all the “obligations” of a Roman Catholic and then some.
Well, you probably didn’t have to live life as a lukewarm Catholic ever. I must admit I wasn’t always so into the faith and do see Sunday as an obligation that is its something I had to do whether I like it or not. I’m glad that is not the case today, but I know many are still in that kind of mentality.Even having lived as a Latin for over 30 years and gone through 12 years of catholic school I still can’t get my head around the idea of church as obligation. I just don’t get it.
Let me ask a simple question. Do you think God prefers it if you go to church on Sunday because you love Him or because someone told you that you had to?
The answer may not be so simple. Some people can claim love of God without the need for showing up for worship. There’s a lot of them out there today. I mean, right or wrong thats what they believe.
Depends. If you’ve been practicing in the Byzantine Rite, even as a mere frequent visitor, you’d know it is not a Nativity liturgy, and thus isn’t going to fulfill your Christmas obligation.
Well, I’ve only started going to Divine Liturgy in the UGCC parish since October. So I don’t know if I can be qualified as one who regularly attends at this point. I’m familiar with this particular Canon Law, but the fact that the Christmas Eve Liturgy is not the Nativity Liturgy is what confuses me.
Why not go to both Liturgies?
Regardless of what I end up doing I just want to know the answer to the question
Both Christmas Eve and Christmas Day are holy days under the Byzantine tradition. Separate holy days.
If you decide to follow the calendar of an Eastern Church then you should seek advice from someone in that Church because I believe it’s already been said, it varies. If one’s spiritual father suggests it then fasting may include that food should not be eaten between meals, and meals themselves should be moderate in quantity. It is often customary to eat only one meal a day. Issues of kind and amount of food is only a small part of the focus of a fasting period. It is properly part of a context of larger preparation under the direction of a spiritual father of one’s own patrimony.
I’d rather use the term, inquisitiveScrupulosity is not a useful part of preparing for the Nativity of our Lord me thinks.