New Australian Law Requires Priests to Break Seal of Confession to Report Admissions of Child Abuse

[Alex337]

Alex337:

I think you may have missed the part where I said intentions to harm others, or themself, in the future it what should be reported. If people refuse to go too confession because they know a priest will alert authorities to them planning to murder, rape or torture someone in the future then they aren’t exactly penitent.

People who are PLANNING to murder, rape, torture, etc typically don’t go to confession anyway.

And the FEW instances it happens is the price we must pay so sinners feel safe going to a priest to tell him things they’ve told no one else.

Why would knowing that a priest will tell the authorities if you are planning to commit murder, rape or torture stop people confessing their past sins? That, to me, seems like people being afraid of going to the doctor when they have a cold because some people get amputations. The two cases aren’t related at all.

 

[phil19034]

Cool. I think the best way for a person to heal and avoid hell is to not murder, rape or torture. Or kill themself for that matter. So if a person tells a priest that they plan to do the following then alerting the authorities and stopping them assists in this.

Remember I’m speaking about future crimes, not past ones.

You are acting as if criminals routinely go into the confessional and confess crimes they are going to confess.

I would wager this doesn’t happen, unless someone is trying to torment a priest.

The Church as been doing this for 2000 years. I think they have the current laws due to just wisdom.

God Bless

 

[phil19034]

Why would knowing that a priest will tell the authorities if you are planning to commit murder, rape or torture stop people confessing their past sins? That, to me, seems like people being afraid of going to the doctor when they have a cold because some people get amputations. The two cases aren’t related at all.

Why would someone confess that they are planning to sin in the future anyway?

People who go to confession are normally trying their best to STOP committing mortal sins.

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

I think that’s a bit of a false example given I am also against the death penalty. I suppose I’m just against murder? So in the instance you suggest I’d suggest avoiding murder.

EDIT: In this case it would be avoiding someone else needing to commit murder by executing you.

How about if we replace death penalty with a five year prison sentence. Main point I want to demonstrate is how one can be contrite to God without necessarily facing the civil penalties.

Good point. I suppose then to me it would also come down to the victim. If you made peace with your mother, with the assistance of an unbiased party, and they forgive you as well then I wouldn’t see a reason to go to the authority. If on the other hand you went to a priest and said you planned on shouting at your mother, something which can be incredibly terrible (shouting is really quite scary at times), I would support the priest alerting the authori6ty; I see this as akin to anyone warning the police about domestic violence.

But in cases where the victim is dead you can’t really get their forgiveness. And I also think a child is not able to consent to forgiving crimes against them in an applicable manner.

I hope that makes sense?

 

[OsculeturMeOsculo]

Marxists? I really don’t know what that implies.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

Based on your posts, I believe that you’re hoping for some kind of resolution between Church and State. You’ve consistently stated that Mandatory reporting won’t affect the Seal of Confession. However, That’s not what Bishop Prowse thinks:

Firstly,

I am in a ground zero Parish and Diocese. It’s due to the horrendous child abuse here Clergy are locked up in our local prison, a Royal Commission happened, and these outcomes are now on the table. And a Cardinal is now on trial. I see all sides of this. Survivors, those struggling to survive, families of those who didn’t survive, Clergy attempting to put congregations back together. Congregations dealing with being practising Catholics throughout this never ending , it seems, situation we find ourselves in.

There must be accountability in every sector of every organisation, secular or religious. And protocol and practice in place to prevent this happening ever again. And to give the survivors what they need to continue surviving.

Secondly
Mandatory reporting should be universal, across the board.
I have never said mandatory reporting won’t affect the seal of confession. Perhaps you are confusing something I said.

Perhaps quote what I said. So it can be cleared up

 

[Roseeurekacross]

Well it’s the position here, as stated by our Archbishop. And he should know. Are you confusing a perpetrator actually confessing his or her crime, and that of a child telling a Priest what happened to them?

 

[Roseeurekacross]

A child telling a Priest they have been abused is not breaking a seal of confession because that child is not confessing any sin or crime . And an ArchBishop won’t be making a statement like that in public, if it were incorrect. And especially when the Magisterium is looking over his shoulder on this issue in this country.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

We just had an Archbishop successfully prosecuted for not reporting child abuse. He has a two year jail term now.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

At the end of the day, the Magisterium will be the final decision maker in how the Church proceeds with this.
Not laity, not Priests. We are all called to obedience and submission to its authority.

 

[neophyte]

I don’t think a person is much of a vehicle of grace if they let people be murdered, raped or tortured.

Do you really think that to allow a poor sinner to be healed by God is to let him commit murder or rape? That’s a really bizarre thing to say. But if you really think that, then it seems that the real problem is that you must also think that God can’t be a source of grace because he allows such things.

I wonder: have you turned yourself over to the authorities for everything you’ve done in violation of the law?

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

I don’t think a person is much of a vehicle of grace if they let people be murdered, raped or tortured.

Do you really think that to allow a poor sinner to be healed by God is to let him commit murder or rape? That’s a really bizarre thing to say. But if you really think that, then it seems that the real problem is that you must also think that God can’t be a source of grace because he allows such things.

I wonder: have you turned yourself over to the authorities for everything you’ve done in violation of the law?

Perhaps I wasn’t clear, though I’ve said it a few times, I think a priest should alert the authorities if a person is going to harm themself or others. If a priest would allow a person to carry on with their stated intent then that is letting them do so and I do not think they are a vehicle of grace.

Every crime that I am aware of, yes. It likely helps that I don’t drive so I don’t have any pesky instances of speeding to worry about.

 

[neophyte]

If a priest would allow a person to carry on with their stated intent then that is letting them do so and I do not think they are a vehicle of grace

It appears that you don’t understand what happens in the confessional. The penitent confesses sins done in the past with contrition and a firm intent to not commit them again.

As you’ve been told several times, people who have no contrition for their past sins, particularly sins of the gravity of murder and rape, and who intend to keep doing them don’t go to confession.

 

[Alex337]

Alex337:

If a priest would allow a person to carry on with their stated intent then that is letting them do so and I do not think they are a vehicle of grace

It appears that you don’t understand what happens in the confessional. The penitent confesses sins done in the past with contrition and a firm intent to not commit them again.

As you’ve been told several times, people who have no contrition for their past sins, particularly sins of the gravity of murder and rape, and who intend to keep doing them don’t go to confession.

Hey friend, there’s no need to assume ignorance. I’ve been to confession plenty of times. And part of confession with at least one of the priests I speak to has included thoughts on how to avoid future sin.

And as I have explained before; cool, if people won’t say such things then nothing will change so there’s no need to worry. If, on the other hand, they do then the priest will be able to do something about it. Much like how people may go to a psychiatrist and admit that they plan to harm themself or others in the future. I hope this helps to clarify.

 

[Prodigal_Son]

As you’ve been told several times, people who have no contrition for their past sins, particularly sins of the gravity of murder and rape, and who intend to keep doing them don’t go to confession.

This is actually not true. An unrepentant person is always free to go to confession, and is always covered under the seal. They are not, however, absolved.

And yes, such people DO go to confession, I’m sure. Maybe not commonly, but they do. Back when confession was more prominent in the Church, they likely went more often.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Maybe is English your second language?

This question asks, how can it be good for a man to do the very best thing on earth and commit a sin that removes him from friendship with God?

We can never do evil (revealing a sin in confession) so that good may come of it. That is our Catholic Faith. That is truth.

 

[Alex337]

Maybe is English your second language?

This question asks, how can it be good for a man to do the very best thing on earth and commit a sin that removes him from friendship with God?

We can never do evil (revealing a sin in confession) so that good may come of it. That is our Catholic Faith. That is truth.

Now friend, you seem to be getting a touch snarky. No need for that.

If a person would be willing to risk hell to save a child then I have every respect for them in the world. And you seem not to have noticed the many, many times where I explained that I think a priest should alert authorities to a person’s intent to commit a crime; not to past crimes.

 

[TheLittleLady]

For the fortieth million time, a priest can NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER require a penitent to reveal their sins to any other human being drawing breath on the earth.

Sorry for the frustration, but, this is taught to every little child before they make their first Confession. Every Catholic learned this right along with learning the Eucharist is the Body of Christ. It is taught to little kids or those in the first stages of conversion. It is a basic Catholic thing.

We who teach continue to remind children, then teens, then adults of this over and over again.

It is kind of stunning how this oft repeated truth appears to be so grossly ignored.

 

[Alex337]

For the fortieth million time, a priest can NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER require a penitent to reveal their sins to any other human being drawing breath on the earth.

Sorry for the frustration, but, this is taught to every little child before they make their first Confession. Every Catholic learned this right along with learning the Eucharist is the Body of Christ. It is taught to little kids or those in the first stages of conversion. It is a basic Catholic thing.

We who teach continue to remind children, then teens, then adults of this over and over again.

It is kind of stunning how this oft repeated truth appears to be so grossly ignored.

Yes, and for the forty first time; I think that is wrong.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Which he will serve with dignity and grace, bearing witness to the Priesthood and to the Catholic Faith. I would imagine in the future priests may face martyrdom, and they will do it.