New priest - - I fear he might be liberal

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FatHead said:
dont the “just reasons” only apply to concelebrants?
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No, it applies to celebrants and concelebrants.

It’s more of a ‘common sense’ rule. I’ve had military chaplains say Mass off of the back of a Humvee, they often did not wear the chausble.

There was another time when a visiting priest (who was came in to ‘cover’ for our pastor, as he was ill) was a Fillipino who was rather short in stature. He found the parish vestements did not fit him.

etc…
 
As other posters have pointed out, wearing the chasuble is not optional. When celebrating the holy sacrifice of the mass, the priest presides “in the person of Christ”…the liturgy is not his private affair - he is offering the eternal sacrifice of the Lord Himself, with the Lord, in the name of the Lord, and for the Lord, and must act accordingly. The vestments proper to mass symbolize the unique role the priest plays in offering the holy sacrifice. God has asked his priests to wear special vestments when offering ritual sacrifices and leading divine worship since the Old Testament. The Church and the sacraments are an extension of the Incarnation - the invisible God became visible - outward signs do matter. God made us body and spirit for a reason and we must worship in both body and spirit.

Redemptonis Sacramentum:
123.] “The vestment proper to the Priest celebrant at Mass, and in other sacred actions directly connected with Mass unless otherwise indicated, is the chasuble, worn over the alb and stole.”[213] Likewise the Priest, in putting on the chasuble according to the rubrics, is not to omit the stole. All Ordinaries should be vigilant in order that all usage to the contrary be eradicated.
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[124.] A faculty is given in the Roman Missal for the Priest concelebrants at Mass other than the principal concelebrant (who should always put on a chasuble of the prescribed colour), for a just reason such as a large number of concelebrants or a lack of vestments, to omit “the chasuble, using the stole over the alb”.[214] Where a need of this kind can be foreseen, however, provision should be made for it insofar as possible. Out of necessity the concelebrants other than the principal celebrant may even put on white chasubles. For the rest, the norms of the liturgical books are to be observed.
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DarrenOglesby said:
Is there 2 priest’s at the same mass? It may just be that one priest is concelebrating, which not wearing the chasuable would be the norm.
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actually no, even if there is a concelebrant, the concelebrant should still be wearing a chusable if at all possible. not wearing one is in no way the norm

if you are going to make statments like this, please back them up with church documents (unless you cant, like in this case)
 
Brendan said:
No, it applies to celebrants and concelebrants.

It’s more of a ‘common sense’ rule. I’ve had military chaplains say Mass off of the back of a Humvee, they often did not wear the chausble.

There was another time when a visiting priest (who was came in to ‘cover’ for our pastor, as he was ill) was a Fillipino who was rather short in stature. He found the parish vestements did not fit him.

etc…
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well yes, the common sense rule is obvious, but I was reffering to the fact that the rules are a little looser on concelebrantrs.
 
Sorry about that, that is just what I was taught at a monastery learning how to be a Sacristan. We were instructed to lay out 1 chasuable with a matching stole, and just a stole for concelebrating priest’s. At my parish we have a retired priest that is a member of our parish, and when he rarely concelebrates, he wears an alb and stole. And the sacristy is filled with chasuables. Though most are from the late 60’s-70’s.
 
FatHead said:
actually no, even if there is a concelebrant, the concelebrant should still be wearing a chusable if at all possible. not wearing one is in no way the norm

if you are going to make statments like this, please back them up with church documents (unless you cant, like in this case)
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At the very orthodox Benedictine abbey where I attend Mass, only the celebrant wears the chasuble, the concelebrants wear their stoles. Same at the two Benedictine monasteries (both orthodox and one of them did their entire liturgies in Latin) in France I visited. I have never in fact seen a Mass where both concelebrant and celebrant both wore a chasuble. Perhaps you should back your statement with documents.
 
CatholicLife said:
The poncho like thing is called a chasubel.
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Was it hot? what was the reason not to dress as he should?

Well here’s the thing, if it is hot and it would be more comfortable to have less on, there are rules. The Priest must always put on the Chasuble, he may leave off the alb, the white long garment under the Chasuble. He must also wear the stole.

Of course this isn’t getting into emergency situations, War.
 
OraLabora said:
At the very orthodox Benedictine abbey where I attend Mass, only the celebrant wears the chasuble, the concelebrants wear their stoles. Same at the two Benedictine monasteries (both orthodox and one of them did their entire liturgies in Latin) in France I visited. I have never in fact seen a Mass where both concelebrant and celebrant both wore a chasuble. Perhaps you should back your statement with documents.
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Sometimes parishes or religious communities do not have enough chasubles to go around for any or all of the concelebrants.
Regarding the main celebrant- We once had a visiting priest, a retired prison chaplain, in our parish for a week. I had thought that he was a diocesan priest but wasn’t sure because at every Mass including Sunday Mass he wore a hooded off white alb like the Benedictans wear and a homemade stole that someone made for him. Our parish has plenty of nice chasubles that he could have worn. When our pastor returned, I asked him if our visiting priest was in a religious order. He said no, he was a diocesan priest. My pastor said that he didn’t know why our visiting priest was wearing a hooded alb and that he was supposed to wear the chasuble “and he knows it.” I got the impression that the priests of the diocese has been told that they were supposed to wear the chasuble (I’m sure there are some exceptions as previously mentioned.)
 
Nope, it hasn’t been any hotter than usual (in reply to question about whether the priest ditched the chasuble because of the weather).

I went to Mass this evening and in one of the Eucharistic prayers - - the one where priests name the Pope, our Bishop and all the priests, religious (I can’t remember the actual wording), my new priest added something like “and all those who lead your faith traditions”. I’m guessing that’s not in the actual book??? Sigh.
 
FatHead said:
never forget:
“liberal Catholics are the worst enemies of the Church.”
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familyof4 said:
Pope Pius IX made the statement about liberals. faithfulvoice.com/vanguard.htm
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Thankyou, familyof4, for the link, but it doesn’t substantiate the quote, which appears to be bogus.

Your linked document has this…
catholiccitizens.org/content/img/f16966/pius9.bmp Pope Pius IX
In the middle of the 19th century, Pope Pius IX publicly stated: “Liberal Catholics are the worst enemies of the Church.”
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The link is not to a primary source but to a picture of Pius IX!

Through google I found quite a few citations of these words but no references to a primary source.

There is a good discussion of the authenticity of this “quotation” (ie. “liberal catholics are…”) at catholicforum.fisheaters.com/index.php?topic=3314040.0. The forum appears to be “Traditional”, with the posters looking for ammunition against “liberals”. Although they find several quotes by Pius IX against “Liberal Catholics” (note the upper case) they can’t find that particular quote. If it were legitimate then I expect they would have found it and published it with glee! One post says the quote is from John Vennari (but again, there is no primary source).
familyof4 said:
It might be a good idea to define exactly what Pius mean by a liberal. I should also note that this quote comes up quite a bit when people want to complain about Vatican II.
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Well said! The meanings of “liberalism” and “liberal” have varied considerably in different times and different places, and the Church’s response has also varied. Attempting to associate today’s “liberalism” (small “l”) with the 19’th century European “Liberalism” (capital “L”), as condemned by the Popes, is misleading.

The following quote by Pope Benedict XVI on “liberalism” is informal, but it does seem to be legitimate:

With an exceptional knowledge of the foundations, and with convincing logic, you analyse the essence of liberalism from its principles, showing that rooted in the heart of liberalism is the Christian image of God.
 
NewEnglandPries said:
Not always true.
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The* concelebrants* put* on*… the* sacred* vestments* they* customarily* wear* when* celebrating* Mass*
individually.

However,should ajustcausearise*(e.g.,amoreconsiderable
numberofconcelebrantsoralackofvestments),concelebrantsotherthan*
the* principal* celebrant* may* omit* the* chasuble* and* simply* wear* the* stole*
overthealb.
 
FatHead said:
The* concelebrants* put* on*… the* sacred* vestments* they* customarily* wear* when* celebrating* Mass*
individually.

However,should ajustcausearise*(e.g.,amoreconsiderable
numberofconcelebrantsoralackofvestments),concelebrantsotherthan*
the* principal* celebrant* may* omit* the* chasuble* and* simply* wear* the* stole*
overthealb.
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  • ?🤷? *
 
FatHead said:
The* concelebrants* put* on*… the* sacred* vestments* they* customarily* wear* when* celebrating* Mass*
individually.

However,should ajustcausearise*(e.g.,amoreconsiderable
numberofconcelebrantsoralackofvestments),concelebrantsotherthan*
the* principal* celebrant* may* omit* the* chasuble* and* simply* wear* the* stole*
overthealb.
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Someone said that his computer does weird things when he copies and pastes and if this is the case here then the post should have been in quotes and the source noted. Otherwise, it comes across in a not so nice way.
 
zab said:
Someone said that his computer does weird things when he copies and pastes and if this is the case here then the post should have been in quotes and the source noted. Otherwise, it comes across in a not so nice way.
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its from the girm
 
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