Nice guys finish last belief

[dakotagirl]

This is probably the best analysis of “guys” in general I’ve ever read. It’s true women don’t want a passive & wimpy guy, they (we) want an assertive man with chutzpah. I absolutely agree with the opposite genders complimenting each other through their differences. golf clap

'Tis generally true, although personally I find it adorable when a guy enlists the help of a guy friend to get a lady’s attention. They’re so weak and helpless when it comes to relationships, and they think they can’t handle the simplest tasks. It’s cute!

 

[Havard]

Since we’re sharing pictures…

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v291/close2crazy/Funny Comments/sayanythingcom2.jpg

“Lloyd Dobler”… the perfect “nice guy”…maybe with the exception of being overly smart, (but smart enough). He had everything you said - he was taller, stronger, masculine, and could kickbox. To know him was to love him. As if the boombox held overhead wasn’t enough for you to make you fall in with him!
Peter Gabriel. sigh Best serenade ever. Hands down.

sorry, carry on…just had to throw that in…hopeless romantic that I am…this thread is so interesting.

You know what’s awesome? I have that boombox. It’s a Toshiba RT-SX1. It was my first radio/boombox I got as a kid. And I’ve kept it for over 20 years.



I’ve yet to hold it aloft for a beloved lady and play Peter Gabriel’s In Your Eyes…

yet.

 

[CountrySinger]

You know what’s awesome? I have that boombox. It’s a Toshiba RT-SX1. It was my first radio/boombox I got as a kid. And I’ve kept it for over 20 years.

http://i.ebayimg.com/02/!Bm20bVgCGk~$(KGrHqYH-CYEts)V52JLBLhJm1wLE!~~_35.JPG

I’ve yet to hold it aloft for a beloved lady and play Peter Gabriel’s In Your Eyes…

yet.

That is so sweet and sappy, I have diabetes.

Prepare for a doctor’s bill.

 

[_L]

This is probably the best analysis of “guys” in general I’ve ever read. It’s true women don’t want a passive & wimpy guy, they (we) want an assertive man with chutzpah. I absolutely agree with the opposite genders complimenting each other through their differences. golf clap

Thank ya, ive been around too many tables with men of all archetypes who vent about this sort of thing so ive had alot of time to study my own kind xD

just a golf clap? i was hoping for a toss of hats into the air often seen after a rousing speech lol but a golf clap will do fine, tiger woods certainly wont be getting that much! badum ching

'Tis generally true, although personally I find it adorable when a guy enlists the help of a guy friend to get a lady’s attention. They’re so weak and helpless when it comes to relationships, and they think they can’t handle the simplest tasks. It’s cute!

This reminds me of ralph and potsy on happy days…:juggle:

i have not had much experience with that sort of thing. typically when a guy in my group of friends gets a girlfriend he is considered anathema for leaving the group behind, i frankly dont care but alot of my other friends take serious offense if one of their friends becomes infatuated with a girl at the expense of " hanging out" lol.

That is better…

hey now! there is nothing hopelessly romantic about indiana jones! he is the model of rugged male individualism.

 

[tampagrl]

You know what’s awesome? I have that boombox. It’s a Toshiba RT-SX1. It was my first radio/boombox I got as a kid. And I’ve kept it for over 20 years.

http://i.ebayimg.com/02/!Bm20bVgCGk~$(KGrHqYH-CYEts)V52JLBLhJm1wLE!~~_35.JPG

I’ve yet to hold it aloft for a beloved lady and play Peter Gabriel’s In Your Eyes…

yet.

Ah! Love it! That’s Vintage, baby!!

…and when (see, romantic optimisim) the opportunity presents itself, do give it some serious thought…the idea is as classic as that boombox - and as CS said, “sappy”, but sappy’s good…and in this particular film, it totally worked. Lloyd got to be sappy in that scene yet strongly maintain his masculinity. At one point, he even shifts it over his head as if to say, “it’s getting heavy, but I’m still going to stand here and profess my love for you.” Oh, I have to include the trailer…I just have toooooooo…
youtube.com/watch?v=mFV7FnbhBRY

 

[chevalier]

Alright if i may divert the conversation away from rings and diamonds and other shiny objects heres my view on this nice guys finish last thing.

In my opinion there are four kinds of men:

The jerk with the alpha male complex

the hopeless romantic

the dude

and

the man

I’m sorry but I’m all four or at least the first three. Your theory is hereby debunked!

many of the “nice guys” fall into the hopeless romantic category and really aren’t the most assertive and manly individuals sometimes acting like a doormat, and usually that is a turn off for women.

True, but women of the current generations have some trouble telling a gentleman from a doormat or telling someone who cares (and thus doesn’t hold grudges, doesn’t mind helping, accommodating etc. without requesting the same in return) from someone who’s desperate or doesn’t have a spine, not to mention telling a jerk from a man. No wonder they end up unhappy, as much as it breaks my heart to see it happen.

imo, men and women were meant to compliment each other. where the man has a weakness the woman has a strength and where the woman has a weakness the man has a strength. Everybody’s different so i would assume each person looks for the person that compliments them. not that people dont look for people that have similar interests, thats not the sort of thing im talking about here; im talking about the things that our in our natures/personalities.

Ideally that should win over the cookie-cutter factors, but that’s not always the case.

 

[chevalier]

hey now! there is nothing hopelessly romantic about indiana jones! he is the model of rugged male individualism.

Yeah, he was my idol. When I was in late teens, I wore khakis and a leather hat. And I aced the exam for archaelogy (ours is one of the best in the world). If you ask “why did you become a lawyer then?”, it’s a question I ask myself daily.

Teehee…so funny!

I am the master of cheese! izza:

 

[kelleyclip]

Thank ya, ive been around too many tables with men of all archetypes who vent about this sort of thing so ive had alot of time to study my own kind xD

just a golf clap? i was hoping for a toss of hats into the air often seen after a rousing speech lol but a golf clap will do fine, tiger woods certainly wont be getting that much! badum ching

I’ve had guys as friends, but anything more is not on my list of expertees. Of all the things in life, dating is the only thing that truly stumps me. I feel so lost…

i have not had much experience with that sort of thing. typically when a guy in my group of friends gets a girlfriend he is considered anathema for leaving the group behind, i frankly dont care but alot of my other friends take serious offense if one of their friends becomes infatuated with a girl at the expense of " hanging out" lol.

I don’t understand why the group gets mad for a buddy with a girlfriend. It doesn’t make a whole lot of sense, but whatever.

hey now! there is nothing hopelessly romantic about indiana jones! he is the model of rugged male individualism.

I LOVE INDY! classic Indy anyways.

 

[_L]

I don’t understand why the group gets mad for a buddy with a girlfriend. It doesn’t make a whole lot of sense, but whatever.

its pretty stupid, my friends are just being babies about it lol were sitting at a table and theyll just moan about it, i just shrug my shoulders

i think its the whole… “he cant be your friend, cuz hes my friend!!!” syndrome.

I LOVE INDY! classic Indy anyways.

the fedora needs to make a comeback me thinks. same with leather bomber jackets.

Yeah, he was my idol. When I was in late teens, I wore khakis and a leather hat. And I aced the exam for archaelogy (ours is one of the best in the world). If you ask “why did you become a lawyer then?”, it’s a question I ask myself daily.

dude a lawyer over archaeologist!? so your tool is the law, not the whip, and you fight other lawyers instead of nazis hmmm i think i have a dreamers view of archaeology.

 

[chevalier]

dude a lawyer over archaeologist!?

Yeah. Looks like a silly choice, dunnit?

Right now, I’m registering a translation firm, which is yet another field.

so your tool is the law, not the whip, and you fight other lawyers instead of nazis hmmm i think i have a dreamers view of archaeology.

Hey, I like that view! Especially the bolded part.

I’ve got my share of archive digging too (that’s supposedly how most archaeological discoveries are made).

 

[JohnMPhilomena]

You ladies are sure entertaining!

Here’s what you should be looking for:

Find a man who is willing to swim through shark infested waters to bring you a glass of lemonade. - Dr. Laura

Find someone who is kind and upstanding. Don’t get someone that you think you can “fix” later.

Good luck and happy hunting!
John Marie Philomena

 

[chevalier]

John, at the risk of appearing counter-cultural and offending some sensibilities, (while fully realising you were joking,) I have to say that expecting strikingly extraordinary treatment without giving a good cause for it is unattractive. Being a gentleman, you may see a young woman holding hands in her pockets and chewing gum while talking back to you in monosyllables of carelessly lousy language, behaving like she’s the best thing to happen to you and you should be the dood to swim those waters with that glass of lemonade on your head. And be happy about it. Or a more adult businesswoman pulling the same lousy treatment with more adult requisites, it’s basically the same thing anyway and it’s not about the toys, it’s about expecting someone to do his all for you while not giving basic courtesy…

Let me tell you a story.

Once upon a time, in Silesia, which was then a disputed breakaway province of the Polish kingdom ruled by a castaway branch of the dynasty, there was a princess who would make knights circle her father’s castle on horseback so they could marry her. And was the rock steep! Everybody broke his neck until a Polish knight came. He did the round but didn’t say much to the princess afterward and rode away. End of story except the princess threw herself down the rock (which I don’t recommend).

Schiller later wrote The Glove basing on some similar legend (I’m pretty sure there were many).

These days, sadly, men and women generally don’t try to be ladies and gentlemen. I’m all in favour of women expecting (and valuing!) better treatment from men, but with the same must go some incentive, i.e. class treatment of men themselves (yup) and respecting themselves and demanding of themselves (class act). Saying this may place me at odds with traditional etiquette, perceivedly, but I’m saying this precisely for the sake of good old times, more as a man of letters than just as a man.

 

[Norseman82]

Any woman who demands that a guy swim through shark-infested waters just to get a glass of lemonade a is a “princess” and Trouble with a capital ‘T’.

 

[LilyElain]

Any woman who demands that a guy swim through shark-infested waters just to get a glass of lemonade a is a “princess” and Trouble with a capital ‘T’.

OH goodness…not the “princess” thing again…
…are you baiting me on purpose!?

 

[CountrySinger]

If some guy isz going to risk his life, it better be for a really good drink, like a lemon drop. Just kidding.

 

[Rascalking]

If some guy isz going to risk his life, it better be for a really good drink, like a lemon drop. Just kidding.

You know what I’d risk my life for? A Camel cigarette and a belt of scotch. Oops! Sorry. My 1920’s dime paperback detective personality was coming out…

 

[chevalier]

Any woman who demands that a guy swim through shark-infested waters just to get a glass of lemonade a is a “princess” and Trouble with a capital ‘T’.

I have no problem with princess (in fact, I like it), but I have a problem with Trouble.

 

[The_Bucket]

These days, sadly, men and women generally don’t try to be ladies and gentlemen. I’m all in favour of women expecting (and valuing!) better treatment from men, but with the same must go some incentive, i.e. class treatment of men themselves (yup) and respecting themselves and demanding of themselves (class act). Saying this may place me at odds with traditional etiquette, perceivedly, but I’m saying this precisely for the sake of good old times, more as a man of letters than just as a man.

You’re absolutely right. These days being a gentleman can be seen a sign of weakness, or worse, as some kind of affront to women. It’s ridiculous; I once got lectured by a girl in college when I held the door open for her. She said something crazy about how I was implying she was too weak to get the door herself. I just smiled, winked, tipped my hat (I liked to wear Stetsons a lot back then) and said “ok miss, but go on ahead now, I ain’t moving until you do.” She huffed and puffed through the door and I chuckled towards the other folks around. It was one of the most insane interactions I’ve had in my life.

And it’s a huge shame that so many guys who have more “alpha” tendencies that make them attractive to women, don’t see that they can’t also be gentlemen at the same time. I I suppose it’s because in this secular culture, being a gentleman doesn’t “get them anywhere,” if you know what I mean.

The sexual revolution really screwed things up. It not only cheapened sex tremendously, it also ruined the very basic relationship between men and women. Hey I’m all for women doing most jobs men do and all of that, but in the end, men want to dominate and women want to be dominated. Of course, today that just means cads find ways to exude confidence boldness and dominating traits and use that to immoral ends because all of the “good guys” are too beta to catch a woman’s eye. I wish we could “go back” to the days where men did indeed have the role to which they are naturally accustomed, as the dominant force and women were submissive… and yet many people understood that the second half of that was that the men also loved their wives as Christ loves the Church.

 

[chevalier]

You’re absolutely right. These days being a gentleman can be seen a sign of weakness, or worse, as some kind of affront to women. It’s ridiculous; I once got lectured by a girl in college when I held the door open for her. She said something crazy about how I was implying she was too weak to get the door herself. I just smiled, winked, tipped my hat (I liked to wear Stetsons a lot back then) and said “ok miss, but go on ahead now, I ain’t moving until you do.” She huffed and puffed through the door and I chuckled towards the other folks around. It was one of the most insane interactions I’ve had in my life.

I would hate to offend anybody, but at least in the secular world it seems that when you’re hot for a woman, it’s fine and great but when you allow yourself to fall in love, then is when you are a perv. (Somewhat like the loser who got attached in a friends-with-benefits relationship, except less gravity.)

And it’s a huge shame that so many guys who have more “alpha” tendencies that make them attractive to women, don’t see that they can’t also be gentlemen at the same time. I I suppose it’s because in this secular culture, being a gentleman doesn’t “get them anywhere,” if you know what I mean.

I very intimately know what you mean. By the way, being a gentleman and being alpha at the same time doesn’t do it either.

The sexual revolution really screwed things up. It not only cheapened sex tremendously, it also ruined the very basic relationship between men and women.

I agree.

Hey I’m all for women doing most jobs men do and all of that, but in the end, men want to dominate and women want to be dominated. Of course, today that just means cads find ways to exude confidence boldness and dominating traits and use that to immoral ends because all of the “good guys” are too beta to catch a woman’s eye. I wish we could “go back” to the days where men did indeed have the role to which they are naturally accustomed, as the dominant force and women were submissive… and yet many people understood that the second half of that was that the men also loved their wives as Christ loves the Church.

I know an alpha guy with looks like there’s no tomorrow and a radio speaker’s voice, who easily wins any elections by female vote and produces the wave effect by turning heads, same stuff in business deals. He’s still single because he gets friended every time. He’s just not the type to mess with women’s heads or impose his yoke on them even though he can very well play hardball in business settings.

Beta seems to include when you’e polite, kind, dependable, keep the time limits and other arrangements, smile and tell her it’s no problem when she’s late or forgets and interpret everything in her favour. Conversely, if you offer less class treatment, less class act, don’t care so much for her and she has to fight for your attention, then it doesn’t matter what kind of specimen you are, you get it then. Somehow, a gentleman is not for them. Not like they don’t admire him, he’s just not for them.

Curiously, real beta types do get women too.

 

[Jay82]

I very intimately know what you mean. By the way, being a gentleman and being alpha at the same time doesn’t do it either.

Agreed.

Beta seems to include when you’e polite, kind, dependable, keep the time limits and other arrangements, smile and tell her it’s no problem when she’s late or forgets and interpret everything in her favour. Conversely, if you offer less class treatment, less class act, don’t care so much for her and she has to fight for your attention, then it doesn’t matter what kind of specimen you are, you get it then. Somehow, a gentleman is not for them. Not like they don’t admire him, he’s just not for them.

Curiously, real beta types do get women too.

I partially agree with this… I fall into the ‘alpha’ category and girls pretty much have to try for my attention/time because I am highly involved in a number of different things and have a lot of friends that I plan to spend time with throughout the week. It definitely sparks their interest in me in the beginnning. However, once they do get to spend some more time with me they find out how polite, kind, dependable, etc I am, they kind of lose any romantic interest they had and just want to be my friend. It happens a lot.

An interesting side note… I recently had a close female friend tell me that I have a lot of very attractive female friends (single, in a relationship, or married) which she found a bit intimidating when she first met me (and she is very good looking too). That didn’t really occur to me as ever being an issue, but I suppose it could make some girls insecure.