No churches named after Calvin or Zwingli

[hn160]

I’m sorry but this issue has been argued over and over again on this sight and for the last 500 years. I know I’m not smart enough to resolve the issue. All I can say is we have different understandings of Jesus words in John 6.

That is because you Catholics want to use aristotelian logic in trying to explain the how and why of the Lord’s Supper.

 

[JonNC]

I’m sorry but this issue has been argued over and over again on this sight and for the last 500 years. I know I’m not smart enough to resolve the issue. All I can say is we have different understandings of Jesus words in John 6.

While hn160 is right, that the difference between our communions’ views on the real presence has to do with the metaphysics of Transubstantiation, the underlying doctrine of the real presence is the essentially the same. Both of our communions believe, teach, and confess, that the bread IS the body of Christ, the wine IS His blood, as He tells us in His own words. Melanchthon in the Apology of the Augsburg Confession cites Vulgarius, who says the “bread is not a mere figure, but is truly changed into flesh.” This is the truth of the Sacrament of the Altar.
Luther commented once that, and I paraphrase, we receive His true and substantial body and blood. God does with the bread and wine as He wills.

Jon

 

[gcnuss]

I’m sorry but this issue has been argued over and over again on this sight and for the last 500 years. I know I’m not smart enough to resolve the issue. All I can say is we have different understandings of Jesus words in John 6.

There is not a word of this that Lutherans deny – from John 6:

35Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. Whoever comes to me will never be hungry, and whoever believes in me will never be thirsty. 36But I said to you that you have seen me and yet do not believe. 37Everything that the Father gives me will come to me, and anyone who comes to me I will never drive away; 38for I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will, but the will of him who sent me. 39And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. 40This is indeed the will of my Father, that all who see the Son and believe in him may have eternal life; and I will raise them up on the last day.”
41Then the Jews began to complain about him because he said, “I am the bread that came down from heaven.” 42They were saying, “Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How can he now say, ‘I have come down from heaven’?” 43Jesus answered them, “Do not complain among yourselves. 44No one can come to me unless drawn by the Father who sent me; and I will raise that person up on the last day. 45It is written in the prophets, ‘And they shall all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to me. 46Not that anyone has seen the Father except the one who is from God; he has seen the Father. 47Very truly, I tell you, whoever believes has eternal life. 48I am the bread of life. 49Your ancestors ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died. 50This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that one may eat of it and not die. 51I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats of this bread will live forever; and the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.”

52The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” 53So Jesus said to them, “Very truly, I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. 54Those who eat my flesh and drink my blood have eternal life, and I will raise them up on the last day; 55for my flesh is true food and my blood is true drink. 56Those who eat my flesh and drink my blood abide in me, and I in them. 57Just as the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever eats me will live because of me. 58This is the bread that came down from heaven, not like that which your ancestors ate, and they died. But the one who eats this bread will live forever.” 59He said these things while he was teaching in the synagogue at Capernaum.

We believe Jesus’ command that we are to eat his flesh and drink his blood and that we do so in the celebration of the Eucharist. I don’t understand where you get the idea that we do not understand John 6 in that manner.