No kissing in front of mother-in-law

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Sorry, but MIL is NOT a widow she is once divorced and 2 years out of a cohabiting relationship.

I would never be that way around a grieving widow that would be insensitive, I agree.
But do you have a problem with a peck between to married people especially in front on one has just paid very close attention to their lover spat? She could have just found something else to do, other people managed to mind their own business in fact no one else paid any mind. She was the only one scrutinizing our squabble. Everybody else was doing their own things helping out.
I don’t have a problem with it, but if my husband did, I’d probably give in, provided it was infrequent. It isn’t a lot to ask. Your MIL is an irritation, but handling irritations in a way that both spouses can live with is part of marriage. Usually it works better to give in a bit more than your half of the time. The math always comes out closer to right, that way, because generally speaking most of us aren’t very good at that kind of math! 😃
 
I think you are right on the mark. I know I can’t change her. And honestly, it hurts to know she has so little regard for me. And I could see her saying the get a room thing even after a peck on the lips.
One time, at a cousin"s wedding when I was dancing with my husband she shot me a mean look from the table we shared, then grabbed her sister’s hand and made her get up and slow dance with her. Of course, my husband did not see the look she shot me.
The weird part is it was the first dance we had danced the whole night not like we were at each other all night, we are generally very private and not at all mushy as a couple.

I think my husband should put her in her place from time to time, even if it has little or no effect on her behavior.
Don’t try to teach a pig to sing. You just frustrate yourself and annoy the pig. Accept your husband’s mother as she is, and your husband will prize you for it.
 
Did someone mention this one yet?

“That is why a man leaves his father and mother and clings to his wife, and the two of them become one body.” Gen. 2:24.
 
Don’t try to teach a pig to sing. You just frustrate yourself and annoy the pig. Accept your husband’s mother as she is, and your husband will prize you for it.
So I allow her to run me down to both SILs and anyone else who will listen. I allow her to trouble with my spouse believe me he owed me that kiss after his behavior. He was acting like a spoiled ten year old. He was a poor example of a helpmate that day. Allow her to gossip about people I can’t defend because I hardly know them. I’m a pretty busy person and see these people maybe once or twice a year. In fact, she is not invited around too often. So I’m guessing her gossip comes from what her daughters tell her on the phone.

And I’m wondering in this case who the pig is my MIL or my husband. 30 some years I’ve put up with his behavior, not knowing how he got to be so sarcastic, self-centered, and manipulative. Now I’m learning who he learned it from. Over the past decades I have had to teach him how treat me and others with respect, I’ve used both kind encouragement and penalties for serious bad behavior. I have had to be his therapist and grow him up a bit. In many ways he is still an adolesent. Now his mom is back playing a major role and he is slipping into old habits. Though i am having thoughts of leaving him (I’m really mad), I will stay with him but I have to say not very happily. I am seriously angry that he would act this way even though he knows how I feel about his giving me a hard time in front of his mother. It was mean what he did that day.

Also, he’s not shy about public affection, after a beer of two I have had times in the past when i had to be careful he didn’t grope me in public.(meanness in public) That’s hopefully, in the past. But an “I’m sorry” smooch was totally appropiate that day. He was just being mean in front of his mother and I don’t understand why… I’ve been stewing about this for a couple of weeks now because I thought we were past this kind of meanness.

If he wants mom around he has to treat me with respect and in a polite loving manner.
Sorry but anything less sounds like a doormat to me. I’ve tried sweet and nice, It doesn’t work with him and apparently it doesn’t work with her either.
 
So I allow her to run me down to both SILs and anyone else who will listen. I allow her to trouble with my spouse believe me he owed me that kiss after his behavior. He was acting like a spoiled ten year old. He was a poor example of a helpmate that day. Allow her to gossip about people I can’t defend because I hardly know them. I’m a pretty busy person and see these people maybe once or twice a year. In fact, she is not invited around too often. So I’m guessing her gossip comes from what her daughters tell her on the phone.

And I’m wondering in this case who the pig is my MIL or my husband. 30 some years I’ve put up with his behavior, not knowing how he got to be so sarcastic, self-centered, and manipulative. Now I’m learning who he learned it from. Over the past decades I have had to teach him how treat me and others with respect, I’ve used both kind encouragement and penalties for serious bad behavior. I have had to be his therapist and grow him up a bit. In many ways he is still an adolesent. Now his mom is back playing a major role and he is slipping into old habits. Though i am having thoughts of leaving him (I’m really mad), I will stay with him but I have to say not very happily. I am seriously angry that he would act this way even though he knows how I feel about his giving me a hard time in front of his mother. It was mean what he did that day.

Also, he’s not shy about public affection, after a beer of two I have had times in the past when i had to be careful he didn’t grope me in public.(meanness in public) That’s hopefully, in the past. But an “I’m sorry” smooch was totally appropiate that day. He was just being mean in front of his mother and I don’t understand why… I’ve been stewing about this for a couple of weeks now because I thought we were past this kind of meanness.

If he wants mom around he has to treat me with respect and in a polite loving manner.
Sorry but anything less sounds like a doormat to me. I’ve tried sweet and nice, It doesn’t work with him and apparently it doesn’t work with her either.
I was referring to your mother as the animal not likely to join the opera no matter who her instructor, but I’m beginning to wonder if anyone in this picture is interested in singing lessons.

You are doing what my husband calls “gunny sacking”. That is when something bothers you, but it isn’t big enough that even some real blowing it all out of proportion will make much of it, so out comes the gunny sack of other slights, something to dump on the original complaint so as to give it some weight. That, my dear, is not a fair (or realistic) way to make a complaint. You have to decide which you want: do you want a solution, or do you want a win? There are many times in marriage when you cannot have both. If you keep the complaints small, you can keep the solutions reachable, and a peaceful life is attainable. Make the complaints big, and the response will be defensiveness, more unrelated counter-complaining from the other direction, and withdrawal. Is that what you want?

You said: “I allow her to trouble with my spouse believe me he owed me that kiss after his behavior. He was acting like a spoiled ten year old. He was a poor example of a helpmate that day.” You’re ready to demand a kiss that he “owes” you? How many “example of helpmate” points do you think come with that? And why does he owe you that in front of his mother, and not at a time where he is more comfortable? Could it be, perhaps, that what you want more than his affection or a real relationship-repair moment is a chance to “show” her? Could it be perhaps, that you are not looking for a solution, let alone the usual ritual that signifies real reconciliation, but rather looking for a “win”? If I may be so blunt, this is more ten-year-old goal-setting than the goal setting that is appropriate for a Christian woman whose first goal is to please God and win souls for Heaven. Let us keep our eye on the ball, here.

You have a lot of stored-up resentments. This matter you brought to us is not the primary problem, but a precipitating event. It is going to eat you up and push you into all sorts of attitudes and behaviors that are neither going to feel good nor do good. If something neither feels good nor does good, why do it?

Talk to your husband and work out a way for him to signal the content of that kiss in a way that will be your secret from his mother. I think you’ll both get a kick out of that. That’s the goal.

As for the contents of your gunnysack, the goal is to take care of things as they come up, to either get some amends made or else let go of the damage, and forgive. That, however, requires doing the homework of going through the gunnysack and cleaning it out. I suggest you find a professional counselor with whom you can speak your mind bluntly without doing any permanent damage to anyone who actually knows you, and who can speak bluntly with you while you work it out without any loss of family or friends if you decide to kill the messenger (so to speak) and walk out a few times before getting through it. I don’t want you to think I believe you’re an awful person. You’re not. You’re just suffering the consequences of having problems that you didn’t take care of as they come up, and difficult problems to endure at that. Get some help; I think you can get on your feet and find a strategy for solving these issues as they come up. That will feel much better and give you better and fairer results, and that is worth the time and effort it takes.
 
I was referring to your mother as the animal not likely to join the opera no matter who her instructor, but I’m beginning to wonder if anyone in this picture is interested in singing lessons.

You are doing what my husband calls “gunny sacking”. That is when something bothers you, but it isn’t big enough that even some real blowing it all out of proportion will make much of it, so out comes the gunny sack of other slights, something to dump on the original complaint so as to give it some weight. That, my dear, is not a fair (or realistic) way to make a complaint. You have to decide which you want: do you want a solution, or do you want a win? There are many times in marriage when you cannot have both. If you keep the complaints small, you can keep the solutions reachable, and a peaceful life is attainable. Make the complaints big, and the response will be defensiveness, more unrelated counter-complaining from the other direction, and withdrawal. Is that what you want?

You said: “I allow her to trouble with my spouse believe me he owed me that kiss after his behavior. He was acting like a spoiled ten year old. He was a poor example of a helpmate that day.” You’re ready to demand a kiss that he “owes” you? How many “example of helpmate” points do you think come with that? And why does he owe you that in front of his mother, and not at a time where he is more comfortable? Could it be, perhaps, that what you want more than his affection or a real relationship-repair moment is a chance to “show” her? Could it be perhaps, that you are not looking for a solution, let alone the usual ritual that signifies real reconciliation, but rather looking for a “win”? If I may be so blunt, this is more ten-year-old goal-setting than the goal setting that is appropriate for a Christian woman whose first goal is to please God and win souls for Heaven. Let us keep our eye on the ball, here.

You have a lot of stored-up resentments. This matter you brought to us is not the primary problem, but a precipitating event. It is going to eat you up and push you into all sorts of attitudes and behaviors that are neither going to feel good nor do good. If something neither feels good nor does good, why do it?

Talk to your husband and work out a way for him to signal the content of that kiss in a way that will be your secret from his mother. I think you’ll both get a kick out of that. That’s the goal.

As for the contents of your gunnysack, the goal is to take care of things as they come up, to either get some amends made or else let go of the damage, and forgive. That, however, requires doing the homework of going through the gunnysack and cleaning it out. I suggest you find a professional counselor with whom you can speak your mind bluntly without doing any permanent damage to anyone who actually knows you, and who can speak bluntly with you while you work it out without any loss of family or friends if you decide to kill the messenger (so to speak) and walk out a few times before getting through it. I don’t want you to think I believe you’re an awful person. You’re not. You’re just suffering the consequences of having problems that you didn’t take care of as they come up, and difficult problems to endure at that. Get some help; I think you can get on your feet and find a strategy for solving these issues as they come up. That will feel much better and give you better and fairer results, and that is worth the time and effort it takes.
Wow, I hope the OP realizes how lucky she is to have a psychiatrist on staff at CAF.
 
I would pick your battles. Meanwhile, hopefully MIL won’t turn into a huge pain in your marriage. It does sound like he has some Mommy issues.

My advise is to give it time, you are newly married. Take the reins of power subtly and gradually. In 20 years you will be queen bee if you play your cards right.
 
Wow, I hope the OP realizes how lucky she is to have a psychiatrist on staff at CAF.
What part of that did you disagree with, that she shouldn’t dump a whole lot of other stuff on her husband because his kisses do not come upon command or that she’d be wise to unload her understandable frustrations in a place where she can really say what she feels and figure out how she can deal with it in a manner likely to have positive results without having it come back to bite her for the rest of her natural life that she perhaps worded a few things in a way that she would later say she didn’t mean while she was venting? (Could it just possibly be that I know whereof I speak by learning the hard way? :rolleyes:)

She’s got a lot to vent, and if she didn’t this kiss thing would not be a big deal. It is a big deal, though, and it isn’t my place to tell her that it is not. I can tell her that going after this the way she’s going at it is not going to lead where she wants to go, and it doesn’t take an MD or a psychology degree to see that.
 
I’m going to be more blunt in hopes t spurs you to think about this more deeply. Please don’t take offense to it, I’m sure your husband is a good guy. BUT…

He’s a momma’s boy. Can’t set up a tent without whining and needing reassuring? Won’t kiss his WIFE in front of mom??

He has serious attachment issues to her. He needs therapy. And both of you need marriage counseling. Seriously. And they’re two different things.

Your marriage will suffer now and in the future if you let this go and “pick your battles.” That term is another way of saying “ignore it and hope for the best.” It doesn’t have to be a fight. But it NEEDS to be addressed. This isn’t a quirk.
 
What part of that did you disagree with, that she shouldn’t dump a whole lot of other stuff on her husband because his kisses do not come upon command or that she’d be wise to unload her understandable frustrations in a place where she can really say what she feels and figure out how she can deal with it in a manner likely to have positive results without having it come back to bite her for the rest of her natural life that she perhaps worded a few things in a way that she would later say she didn’t mean while she was venting? (Could it just possibly be that I know whereof I speak by learning the hard way? :rolleyes:)

She’s got a lot to vent, and if she didn’t this kiss thing would not be a big deal. It is a big deal, though, and it isn’t my place to tell her that it is not. I can tell her that going after this the way she’s going at it is not going to lead where she wants to go, and it doesn’t take an MD or a psychology degree to see that.
You do have good points to ponder. I felt your post was judgmental; I apologize if I misread your intent.
 
I’m going to be more blunt in hopes t spurs you to think about this more deeply. Please don’t take offense to it, I’m sure your husband is a good guy. BUT…

He’s a momma’s boy. Can’t set up a tent without whining and needing reassuring? Won’t kiss his WIFE in front of mom??

He has serious attachment issues to her. He needs therapy. And both of you need marriage counseling. Seriously. And they’re two different things.

Your marriage will suffer now and in the future if you let this go and “pick your battles.” That term is another way of saying “ignore it and hope for the best.” It doesn’t have to be a fight. But it NEEDS to be addressed. This isn’t a quirk.
 
It does sound like hubby is used to domineering women. So, OP will likely end up wearing the trousers in this marriage. She just needs to be mindful of how she takes over and steers hubby away from Mommy Dearest.

If she goes to battle right now, she may cause a terrible rift between her and MIL.
 
She isn’t widowed, she’s divorced and she’s had several boyfriends since then.

But regardless of her own relationship situation there should never be a reason why he can’t give his wife a peck. And if that peck makes his mom uncomfortable that’s her problem. Her feelings should not damper normal and polite affection between spouses.
I believe there is no reason to conclude that the MIL is “uncomfortable” at seeing a Peck on cheek. It is only her son who supposes this. What mother would not be delighted to see her son happy and and appreciated by his wife, unless what she rally feels is not discomfort, but some kind of resentment. Maybe she’d rather see others have a failed marriage because apparently that was her lot?
 
DH and I are like this around our families- I’ve never seen my parents kiss aside from new year, or his parents at all. We don’t either; it’s just how our families are.

Have you sat down and talked about this with him?
 
“What mother would not be delighted to see her son happy and and appreciated by his wife?”

This one.

There’s a lot of good advice upthread. I think at least one person missed out on the fact that these are not newlyweds–they are, if I’m not mistaken 30 years married, which is why MIL has married grandchildren. This is 30 years of hard feelings.

One thing I have to add is that I’ve noticed over the years that a lot of adult children seem to regress into whiny teenagers around their parents. A lot of adult children are much more competent when their parents are not around. If the OP’s husband is one of those guys, I would suggest pointing it out to him (when MIL isn’t around, of course).

I think it’s finally time to stop the bickering, rather than treating it as a matter of course. It’s childish and undignified.
 
I’m going to be more blunt in hopes t spurs you to think about this more deeply. Please don’t take offense to it, I’m sure your husband is a good guy. BUT…

He’s a momma’s boy. Can’t set up a tent without whining and needing reassuring? Won’t kiss his WIFE in front of mom??

He has serious attachment issues to her. He needs therapy. And both of you need marriage counseling. Seriously. And they’re two different things.

Your marriage will suffer now and in the future if you let this go and “pick your battles.” That term is another way of saying “ignore it and hope for the best.” It doesn’t have to be a fight. But it NEEDS to be addressed. This isn’t a quirk.
I wouldn’t draw too many conclusions from someone venting about the straw that broke the camel’s back. These things have a way of growing into an entity of their own, and it happens in perfectly typical people. I don’t know if it happens in perfect people, because I’ve never met one. As one psychologist I know once quipped, “The definition of a dysfunctional family is this: A dysfunctional family is any family with more than one person in it.”

One kiss is not a big deal, but when one kiss becomes a big deal, then it is a big deal. If it isn’t an emotionally-viable option to just let it go and take MIL as she is, then IMHO isn’t a bad idea to get some help in scoping the terrain in front of you. Working it out within the family is a minefield of loyalties.

It could be a big deal for a lot of reasons. It isn’t necessarily that she or her MIL are domineering or that her husband is dominated. Still, my experience is that it is much easier to talk this all out in a place where nothing you ever say is ever going to get back to the people who have you in a long-term dither. Short-term dithers, you work out on your own. Long-term dithers, well, a lot of times when you get some help in figuring out “What in blazes is up with that?” you pick up some strategies that help you no matter what the deal is. Even if hubby is a mama’s boy and his mama is a dragon lady, well, just walking in the middle of her lair and saying so probably is not the best strategy. OK, if not, what is? It depends on your dragon.

Another (and to my mind, a huge) advantage of seeing a professional is that you don’t lose a friend or a family member when the relationship goes sour. You find another counselor. If they tell you more truth than what you are ready to hear, well, at least you don’t lose a friend if you ignore what you need to hear. The truth simmers inside you until you’re ready to accept it, and the counselor sleeps just fine at night. If they are out in left field with their advice, you can say so, walk out, and you haven’t lost a friend, let alone the best friend that you married. If you tell them what seems to be the truth today, you can grow and come to see that the truth is bigger or different than your original little view, and your narrow view isn’t out there in a chorus of “yeah, but we remember what you said” and hurt feelings. So it isn’t that counselors are all Solomon. It’s that they have some training in helping people to sort through problems and a professional mandate that demands that they keep what you say private. That is worth a lot, even from a very fallible fellow human being who may not have any more personal wisdom than you do!! (Which may be why even counselors go to counselors, just as physicians do not act as their own physicians and lawyers don’t act as their own lawyers.)
 
If my husband thought that I owed him a kiss because of my behavior, I wouldn’t want to kiss him, until he changed his attitude. 🤷
 
I’m going to be more blunt in hopes t spurs you to think about this more deeply. Please don’t take offense to it, I’m sure your husband is a good guy. BUT…

He’s a momma’s boy. Can’t set up a tent without whining and needing reassuring? Won’t kiss his WIFE in front of mom??

He has serious attachment issues to her. He needs therapy. And both of you need marriage counseling. Seriously. And they’re two different things.

Your marriage will suffer now and in the future if you let this go and “pick your battles.” That term is another way of saying “ignore it and hope for the best.” It doesn’t have to be a fight. But it NEEDS to be addressed. This isn’t a quirk.
Thank you. I agree and my pattern is to get hurt, try to talk to him,he trys to avoid, I push, he starts blame me, I get more hurt and mad, I realize I’m not reaching him and then sweep it under the rug. He successfully avoids any conflict resolution. Any making up is entirely up to me.

Also, I wish posters would get off the PDA. thing. That is not the problem. He is not shy. I am. The problem was that he used that moment to be cold and mean and wanted to do it in front of his mother. Something I have asked him repeatedly not to do. This is a very long standing sensitive issue in our marriage. I’m no angel either and I know his sore spots and weaknesses but I know not to say or do certain things around my parents or to him in public.

I dread when I have to ask him to do something and people are around to witness the drama. but his mother is the one person I have a real problem with when it comes to this. Our usual routine is this- usually a debate about everything- he usually resists-. I usually press, it gets done, we make up, nothing mushy, a peck, sometimes a handshake or a pat on the back depending on how hard the task was. This time I told him good job, leaned in for a peck and he backed off. I did let it go, bad sportsmanship on his part. In the mean time, MIL is watch intently. I notice this too. I think this is to show her that he is really not that happy with me. A once again to reinforce her picture that he married an awful person and has an awful marriage. I realize this is an overreaction. So latter I ask him what was that?, Now *my problem is that his answer did *reinforce my suspicions that the reason was to appease his mother.
He didn’t want to make her feel left out because she doesn’t have anyone?

Maybe I should let her sleep between us at night. would that make her feel better?

Sorry, I’m beginning to rant.
 
If my husband thought that I owed him a kiss because of my behavior, I wouldn’t want to kiss him, until he changed his attitude. 🤷
I’m not sure it’s a matter of being owed a kiss necessarily. I think it’s more an issue of wanting to make it clear to others that you are a happy and affectionate couple.

My husband and I have a rule that we have never broken: we do not fight in front of others, at all, period. But of course sometimes people get stressed out and sometimes we do sound snippy towards one another. After that happens we both make sure that as soon as we calm down we are back to holding hands and pecking, because we really wouldn’t want to give the impression that we are anything less than happy together.

I assume that’s all the OP wants. Just a way to signal to others that no, this is not the default state of your marriage. That’s pretty normal.
 
I’m not sure it’s a matter of being owed a kiss necessarily. I think it’s more an issue of wanting to make it clear to others that you are a happy and affectionate couple.
That is what I thought too.
My husband and I have a rule that we have never broken: we do not fight in front of others, at all, period. But of course sometimes people get stressed out and sometimes we do sound snippy towards one another. After that happens we both make sure that as soon as we calm down we are back to holding hands and pecking, because we really wouldn’t want to give the impression that we are anything less than happy together.
Sometimes it is a hard rule, but we have it too. We also don’t talk about arguments or disagreements with outsiders either. In fact, I won’t listen to wives talk negatively about their husbands. (Unless of course, the wife is being abused and needs help getting away.)

Of course our son sees us argue or disagree with each other. Otherwise he wouldn’t ever learn how to argue or disagree with someone you love. But we also make sure he sees up “make up.” Or see how we can still kiss each other or be civil even when we disagree with each other.
I assume that’s all the OP wants. Just a way to signal to others that no, this is not the default state of your marriage. That’s pretty normal.
I think it is very normal. 👍

All of that said, my husband and I don’t really argue. We tend to be on the same page. Our disagreements tend to be about the other doing too much. 😊
 
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