No need for crucifix's

[Milliardo]

So we just take your words as truth, you have no Scriptural evidence for what you have just stated. Just mere human reasoning!

I think you got it wrong–you don’t have any evidence either to back up your claim on it.

Look at the God inspired Sacred Scriptures to see the factual description of the Lord Jesus’ perfect sacrifice. Don’t look at man made images; are they true images, are they better than the perfect Word of God?

Images are needed to help us visualize. That being said, do you have pictures of Jesus’ crucifixion? Do you think we need them? Let’s go a bit further on this thought–children’s Bibles have images of Biblical scenes, and some do have some representation of Jesus’ crucifixion. Do you think that it would be helpful to have only words in children’s Bibles?

And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me . Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you. Luke 22:19-20

I do not see there any command that says we don’t need crucifixes or such; do you?

 

[paarsurrey]

So there’s no command in the Sacred Scriptures to make an image of the Lord Jesus on the cross and there’s no need to make this image because the God inspired Sacred Scriptures perfectly describe to us what terrible suffering the Lord Jesus went through to save sinners.

Hi

I agree with you. This is only superficial though done for centuries, no harm if discontinued. No one loves a sword with which his family member has been killed. Just show me a single person in the world who loves that gun with which his mother or brother has been killed. So why make crucifix’s and wear them?

I however respect your faith, and legally morally it is one’s own outlook to do whatever one wants to do. No compulsion.

Thanks

 

[Fidelis]

I agree with you. This is only superficial though done for centuries, no harm if discontinued.

It can be superficial, but it is not necessarily so. The faith of untold millions for 2000 years (including many great saints) has been strengthened and nourished by gazing prayerfully on the Cross and meditating on God’s great love for us all.

No one loves a sword with which his family member has been killed. Just show me a single person in the world who loves that gun with which his mother or brother has been killed. So why make crucifix’s and wear them?

It does seem foolish, doesn’t it? Then again, I consider myself a fool for Christ.

2 Corinthians 11:17 -
(What I am saying I say not with the Lord’s authority but as a fool, in this boastful confidence.

**1Corinthians 3:18 - **
Let no one deceive himself. If any one among you thinks that he is wise in this age, let him become a fool that he may become wise.

1 Corinthians 1:18-31 -
18 For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written, “I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and the cleverness of the clever I will thwart.” 20 Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, it pleased God through the folly of what we preach to save those who believe. 22 For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles, 24 but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men. 26 For consider your call, brethren; not many of you were wise according to worldly standards, not many were powerful, not many were of noble birth; 27 but God chose what is foolish in the world to shame the wise, God chose what is weak in the world to shame the strong, 28 God chose what is low and despised in the world, even things that are not, to bring to nothing things that are, 29 so that no human being might boast in the presence of God. 30 He is the source of your life in Christ Jesus, whom God made our wisdom, our righteousness and sanctification and redemption; 31 therefore, as it is written, “Let him who boasts, boast of the Lord.”

Wherever the symbol of the cross is set up, Christ’s victory and the devil’s subjection are signified. –St. Peter Damian

Whoever, then, attentively beholds this crucifix, and verily believes that on the cross was paid the ransom of all sinners, how may he not fully trust that if he asks mercy for his sins, they shall be forgiven him? --St. John Fisher

Where the sign of the cross is erected, the wickedness of the devil is immediately repelled.
–St. Maximus of Turin

As soon as you are tempted to impurity, endeavor to think of the Passion of the Savior of the world and make the following act: ‘My God is nailed to a cross, and shall I consent to these unlawful pleasures?’ --St. Bernard

 

[Randy_Carson]

The following is a very clear and perfect command from the Lord Jesus on how His followers should remember His perfect sacrifice;

And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me . Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you. Luke 22:19-20

Also in Matt, Mark, Luke & John there are God inspired accounts of the Lord Jesus’ death on the cross. So why did men decide to make a man made image of the Lord Jesus on the cross? Is the making of a man made image of the Lord Jesus on the cross in effect saying that the Scriptural accounts of the Lord’s death aren’t good enough and that His followers need a man made image as well. I mean how can any mere man do better than what God has done and how can the terrible suffering of the blessed Lord Jesus be recreated by a mere human artist.

So there’s no command in the Sacred Scriptures to make an image of the Lord Jesus on the cross and there’s no need to make this image because the God inspired Sacred Scriptures perfectly describe to us what terrible suffering the Lord Jesus went through to save sinners.

Asa,

If what you’re arguing is true, then why didn’t Paul preach Jesus “resurrected”? Instead, Paul wrote:

1 Corinthians 1:23
but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles,

1 Corinthians 2:2
For I resolved to know nothing while I was with you except Jesus Christ and him crucified.

Galatians 3:1
You foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified.

Yes, we know that Jesus was raised from the dead…Paul speaks clearly of this, too. But he also clearly understands that Christ crucifed is the key to our salvation.

An empty cross is stripped of its significance. A crucifix reminds us of what God did for us.

Hope this helps. :tiphat:

 

[cecilia97]

Hi

I agree with you. This is only superficial though done for centuries, no harm if discontinued. No one loves a sword with which his family member has been killed. Just show me a single person in the world who loves that gun with which his mother or brother has been killed. So why make crucifix’s and wear them?

No comparison. The sword or gun used to kill a loved one wasn’t the instrument that also brought great joy to the world.

 

[Ceil-1]

Asa,

You are obviously only interested in rationalizing your “ding” against the Church. If you were truly interested in the meaning of the Crucifix, you would at the very least reflect on what is being said. You have no intention of changing your mind, because it is already what you want to believe.

You are merely trying to “taunt” us. This is a sinful act.

That “story” was related by a woman who grew up to be a nun and is much holier than you or I will ever be. Her conversion was a miracle of grace ushered in through the witness of others.
Plus, she’s a heck of a lot smarter, too.

The wearing of the crucifix is our witnessto the sacrifice of Christ. You don’t like it, because you don’t like the Church. Enough of your excuses.

 

[revelations]

Ceil sounds good to me, i think you wrapped it up nicely.

Do you think we should make everyone do a test before they join, that goes something along these lines:

1. Are you baptised in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit?
2. Do you accept Jesus Christ as your personal Lord and savior?

If you answered yes to the above questions, then you are saved! And so are we! We’re all on the same team! Congratulations!

Asa, who do you think is the one who wants to see all the followers of Jesus bickering between them about crucifixes and statues of all things? Do you think it comes from God, or does it come from Satan?

You will know the tree by the fruit it bears!

-revelations

 

[Asa]

So after all these posts the following statement is 100% true!

“So there’s no command in the Sacred Scriptures to make an image of the Lord Jesus on the cross and there’s no need to make this image because the God inspired Sacred Scriptures perfectly describe to us what terrible suffering the Lord Jesus went through on the cross to save sinners.”

For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Heb 4:12

 

[tee_eff_em]

Welcome back, Asa, Do you suppose you might address some of the questions others have posted regarding your position?

So after all these posts the following statement is 100% true!

“So there’s no command in the Sacred Scriptures to make an image of the Lord Jesus on the cross and there’s no need to make this image because

the God inspired Sacred Scriptures perfectly describe to us what terrible suffering the Lord Jesus went through on the cross to save sinners.

”

I cannot assent the highlighted portion of your assertion.

tee

 

[LilyM]

So after all these posts the following statement is 100% true!

“So there’s no command in the Sacred Scriptures to make an image of the Lord Jesus on the cross and there’s no need to make this image because the God inspired Sacred Scriptures perfectly describe to us what terrible suffering the Lord Jesus went through on the cross to save sinners.”

For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Heb 4:12

And that’s why Passion of the Christ made such huge box-office … because everyone saw it, yawned and said ‘read the book already’ :nope:

We’re visual creatures, God knows this which is why He commanded the decoration of the meeting tent and Temple in the OT. I have no doubt the priests would’ve bowed and prostrated before the Ark of the Covenant, a visible reminder of His covenant with them. Were they worshipping the gold box, its contents or the cherubim carved upon it by so doing? Not a bit.

Same in NT times - we shouldn’t need to be told to decorate our Churches nor to use images to remind us of Christ’s suffering and death. The Cross is the sign of HIS covenant with us, and it behooves us to remind ourselves of it.

 

[bill210]

The crucifix is the greatest sign of love the world has known.

 

[Asa]

And that’s why Passion of the Christ made such huge box-office … because everyone saw it, yawned and said ‘read the book already’ :nope:

We are very visual creatures - no amount of writing compares to a visual image.

Gods perfect inspired Sacred Scriptures = feeble man made visual images

 

[LilyM]

Gods perfect inspired Sacred Scriptures = feeble man made visual images

And yet we equally forget what He has done for us no matter which we use :nope: The failing is neither in the scriptures nor the images (which I’m not comparing to each other by the way - they’re complementary, not equivalent) but in ourselves.

There is need and room for both Sacred Scripture and holy images (remember for most of human history the vast majority of people couldn’t read anyway - what on earth were THEY supposed to use, hmmm?)

 

[homewardbound]

Gods perfect inspired Sacred Scriptures = feeble man made visual images

I’m still waiting for proof that these man made images are harmful and sinful. I mean, reminding people of Christ’s sacrifice and love for us…how awful!

Plus, many non-Catholics have images of Jesus in their homes as reminders. So, the argument against the crucifix is silly.

 

[Asa]

I’m still waiting for proof that these man made images are harmful and sinful. I mean, reminding people of Christ’s sacrifice and love for us…how awful!

I’m still waiting for a sensible answer as to why anyone would want to look at a false man made image of the Lord Jesus to remember His perfect sacrifice when God has given us His perfect inspired description of the Lord Jesus’ perfect sacrifice on the cross.

I mean why look at a feeble false man made image(there’s so many different ones!?!) when you have the perfect image of the Lord Jesus’ perfect sacrifice on the cross in the perfect God inspired Sacred Scriptures?

 

[homewardbound]

I’m still waiting for a sensible answer as to why anyone would want to look at a false man made image of the Lord Jesus to remember His perfect sacrifice when God has given us His perfect inspired description of the Lord Jesus’ perfect sacrifice on the cross.

I mean why look at a feeble false man made image(there’s so many different ones!?!) when you have the perfect image of the Lord Jesus’ perfect sacrifice on the cross in the perfect God inspired Sacred Scriptures?

Jesus died on the cross, the images are of him on the cross…how is that false?

Must be nice for you to always constantly have a Bible open in front of you. But most people have lives and cannot spend their time in front of the Bible 24/7.

Why people like the images have been answered throughout this entire thread. It is a wonderful reminder of his sacrifice for us! Now give me proof that its wrong, besides the fact that you personally do not like it.

 

[Odell]

The Bible itself as Gods inspired Word is all we need to know about the Lord Jesus perfect sacrifice. This is a fact and this is my evidence.

Now where’s the clear biblical evidence for making an image of the Lord Jesus on the cross? No fanciful interpretations please!

**SHOW US **where’s the clear biblical evidence for making a empty cross to represent the resurection.

Why do you think it is ok to have a cross when **THE BIBLE **tells me of the perfect resurection of our Lord Jesus Christ. No fanciful opinion please!

Again show me where the bible says make a cross

YOU CANT

You must have a problem with the passion of Christ to my friend because **THE BIBLE **does not say make a movie of the passion.

SHOW ME a verse that says this is wrong

YOU CANT

bible christian my butt

 

[LilyM]

I’m still waiting for a sensible answer as to why anyone would want to look at a false man made image of the Lord Jesus to remember His perfect sacrifice when God has given us His perfect inspired description of the Lord Jesus’ perfect sacrifice on the cross.

I mean why look at a feeble false man made image(there’s so many different ones!?!) when you have the perfect image of the Lord Jesus’ perfect sacrifice on the cross in the perfect God inspired Sacred Scriptures?

So is it the KJV Bible alone that is a ‘perfect’ description? Or the RSV? The Jerusalem Bible? The Amplified Bible perhaps? How about The Message Bible or the Good News Translation? They’re as different from each other as night and day. And pray tell, is it Matthew’s description that is perfect, or Mark’s, Luke’s or John’s? They each leave out sayings and events from the others. They are so different from each other clearly only one of them can possibly be perfect.

Or is it only the original Greek and Aramaic that is the ‘perfect’ description then??? We don’t HAVE the original manuscripts of those - so God’s ‘perfect’ word is lost to us forever if that is the case.

And what about the poor people who didn’t HAVE Bibles to read - the first disciples of those first decades after His death??? THEY couldn’t read the Gospels, which hadn’t even been written yet!

These translations of the Bible are all man-made images of the original writings - of varying degrees of accuracy and usefulness at that. And the original writings in themselves are but images of the reality of what happened as well.

Jesus came as flesh and blood, a real person. People saw Him as well as hearing Him. Why not image Him and remember Him in a way that allows us to at least try to see Him as well as hearing Him?

 

[tee_eff_em]

I wonder if I have been spending too much time attending to the false man made words of Asa…?

tee

 

[Asa]

So is it the KJV Bible alone that is a ‘perfect’ description? Or the RSV? The Jerusalem Bible? The Amplified Bible perhaps? How about The Message Bible or the Good News Translation? They’re as different from each other as night and day. And pray tell, is it Matthew’s description that is perfect, or Mark’s, Luke’s or John’s? They each leave out sayings and events from the others. They are so different from each other clearly only one of them can possibly be perfect.

Or is it only the original Greek and Aramaic that is the ‘perfect’ description then??? We don’t HAVE the original manuscripts of those - so God’s ‘perfect’ word is lost to us forever if that is the case.

And what about the poor people who didn’t HAVE Bibles to read - the first disciples of those first decades after His death??? THEY couldn’t read the Gospels, which hadn’t even been written yet!

These translations of the Bible are all man-made images of the original writings - of varying degrees of accuracy and usefulness at that. And the original writings in themselves are but images of the reality of what happened as well.

Jesus came as flesh and blood, a real person. People saw Him as well as hearing Him. Why not image Him and remember Him in a way that allows us to at least try to see Him as well as hearing Him?

Your response is a classic example of someone who in seeking to uphold a man made idea attacks the blessed Sacred Scriptures.

Can the Almighty Awesome God not keep His Word pure and true in the 21st century? Is His inspired descriptions of the Lord Jesus’ perfect sacrifice in His perfect Word not true?

Have you no God given discernment/wisdom in knowing what Bible translations are accurate? Also please post your evidence of where in the KJV you can find errors regarding the God inspired descriptions of the Lord Jesus’ perfect sacrifice on the cross.