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elvisman
Guest
It is the re-presentation of Christ’s sacrifice. It’s not a re-sacrifice.
Maybe if you read slower*, it would sink in . . .
- Status
Maybe if you read slower*, it would sink in . . .
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rinnie
Guest
I think I will have to stay with the words of Jesus. Jesus said this IS MY BODY which will be given up for you. And this IS MY BLOOD that will be shed for all. DO THIS in memory of me.
Now again why did Jesus say that if you do NOT eat this BREAD and DRINK this Cup there is no life in you? If like you said it is not the actual bread and blood of eternal life?
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rinnie
Guest
Oh
So you are saying that you have authority by the laying of hands the grace and Power of the Holy Spirit to teach in his name? Okay. So you are saying you have Holy Orders?
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Dokimas
Guest
So you disagree with the link I posted a quote from?
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Dokimas
Guest
Did you not read my post slow enough when you botched your understanding of it?It is the re-presentation of Christ’s sacrifice. It’s not a re-sacrifice.
Maybe if you read slower*, it would sink in . . .
Let me repost it.
Originally Posted by Dokimas
[SIGN]http://catholic-resources.org/ChurchDocs/EP1-4.htm
"Father, we celebrate the memory of Christ, your Son. We, your people and your ministers, recall his passion, his resurrection from the dead, and his ascension into glory; and from the many gifts you have given us we offer to you, God of glory and majesty, this holy and perfect sacrifice: the bread of life and the cup of eternal salvation.
**Look with favor on these offerings and accept them as once you accepted the gifts **of your servant Abel, the sacrifice of Abraham, our father in faith, and the bread and wine offered by your priest Melchizedek.
Almighty God, **we pray that your angel may take this sacrifice **to your altar in heaven. Then, as we receive from this altar the sacred body and blood of your Son, let us be filled with every grace and blessing. [Through Christ our Lord. Amen.] "[/SIGN]
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rinnie
Guest
Sorry Dokimas but Father told me it is OUR CHURCH. Because the CHurch is the Living Christ and he is our Lord and Savior.
Saul Saul why are you persecuting me? WHO ARE YOU? JESUS the one you are persecuting. Jesus CHrist is the CC and there is no salvation outside of Jesus Christ which is the CC.
Now the only way you can Possibly make this false is to PROVE that Jesus Christ is not the CC as he claims he is. ANd then you would have to call Jesus a liar.
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Dokimas
Guest
Jesus is not a liar. I just understand the verses the CC use differently.Sorry Dokimas but Father told me it is OUR CHURCH. Because the CHurch is the Living Christ and he is our Lord and Savior.
Saul Saul why are you persecuting me? WHO ARE YOU? JESUS the one you are persecuting. Jesus CHrist is the CC and there is no salvation outside of Jesus Christ which is the CC.
Now the only way you can Possibly make this false is to PROVE that Jesus Christ is not the CC as he claims he is. ANd then you would have to call Jesus a liar.
Jesus is NOT the CC, IMO.
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rinnie
Guest
Here is a quote from Saint Ignatius of Antioch
quote: Every time this mystery is celebrated the work of our redemption is carried on and we break the one bread that provides the medicine of immortality and the antidote for death, and the food that makes us live forever in Jesus Christ. unquote
What every Catholic knows is that the merit obtained for us through the death of Jesus is applied to us in the very MYSTERY that we call the PASCHAL MYSTERY—Passover from death to life.
God was reconcilling the world to HIMSELF in CHRIST. 2 cor 5:19 God triumpted over Satan and sin over the bondage of the Old law and death. Sin has reigned over us Romans 5:21 and enslaved us Romans 6:7.
But through the passion of Jesus the Father set us free and restored us to the kingdom of his beloved Son in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins Col. 1:13-14.
This is the CUP OF MY BLOOD THE BLOOD OF THE NEW AND EVERLASTING COVENANT. IT WILL BE SHED FOR YOU AND FOR ALL SO THAT SINS MAY BE FORGIVEN.
Like the passover meal this memorial sacrifice of the NEW LAW is both Sacrifice AND SACRED MEAL. Both remain inseparably a part of the mystery. The Eucharist is an unbloody re-presentation of the sacrifice on the cross and an application of its saving power. It is the outpouring of the Holy Spirit and the words of consecration he begins to be present in a sacramental form under the appearance of bread and wine. to become a spritual food of the faith.
We are made one in Christ and eachother precisely in the Eucharist.
What SS and Church teaching are describing is the central act of worship of the Church.
quote: Every time this mystery is celebrated the work of our redemption is carried on and we break the one bread that provides the medicine of immortality and the antidote for death, and the food that makes us live forever in Jesus Christ. unquote
What every Catholic knows is that the merit obtained for us through the death of Jesus is applied to us in the very MYSTERY that we call the PASCHAL MYSTERY—Passover from death to life.
God was reconcilling the world to HIMSELF in CHRIST. 2 cor 5:19 God triumpted over Satan and sin over the bondage of the Old law and death. Sin has reigned over us Romans 5:21 and enslaved us Romans 6:7.
But through the passion of Jesus the Father set us free and restored us to the kingdom of his beloved Son in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins Col. 1:13-14.
This is the CUP OF MY BLOOD THE BLOOD OF THE NEW AND EVERLASTING COVENANT. IT WILL BE SHED FOR YOU AND FOR ALL SO THAT SINS MAY BE FORGIVEN.
Like the passover meal this memorial sacrifice of the NEW LAW is both Sacrifice AND SACRED MEAL. Both remain inseparably a part of the mystery. The Eucharist is an unbloody re-presentation of the sacrifice on the cross and an application of its saving power. It is the outpouring of the Holy Spirit and the words of consecration he begins to be present in a sacramental form under the appearance of bread and wine. to become a spritual food of the faith.
We are made one in Christ and eachother precisely in the Eucharist.
What SS and Church teaching are describing is the central act of worship of the Church.
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rinnie
Guest
I gave you the scripture. Please go back and read it. Who do you claim Saul was persecuting? Was it not the Church. Did Jesus not say it is Me, Jesus who you are persecuting? Those are the words of Jesus are they not?
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elvisman
Guest
You’re STILL not getting it.**
Let’s approach it differently.
Tell me - which part do you have a problem with and I’ll explain it to you . . .
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rinnie
Guest
Oh Okay Thankx!
Okay Thankx!
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Dokimas
Guest
I have no problem with it. It speaks for itself and it contradicts you. I don’t have a problem with it but I disagree with it. However, I don’t go to mass so it’s no big deal.
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Dokimas
Guest
Thanks for sharing your understanding.
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elvisman
Guest
Like I said - which part do you have a problem with?
Which part do you disagree with?
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elvisman
Guest
No.
I agree that you have no idea what it means.
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Dokimas
Guest
You mean the quote doesn’t mean what it says?
BTW, why do you ‘color’ specific words in your posts?
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Vico
Guest
Dokimas, way back in post #103 you posted part of the Eucharistic Prayer I from the Mass, the third paragraph below. But note what the sacrifice is, offering of the gifts that we have received: the bread of life and the cup of eternal salvation. (As Jesus said, “do this in memory of me”. Luke 22:19) It is a sacrifice of praise, spiritual sacrifice, a pure and holy sacrafice. See CCC 1330 vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p2s2c1a3.htm
"Father, we celebrate the memory of Christ, your Son. We, your people and your ministers, recall his passion, his resurrection from the dead, and his ascension into glory; and from the many gifts you have given us we offer to you, God of glory and majesty, this holy and perfect sacrifice: the bread of life and the cup of eternal salvation.
Look with favor on these offerings and accept them as once you accepted the gifts of your servant Abel, the sacrifice of Abraham, our father in faith, and the bread and wine offered by your priest Melchizedek.
Almighty God, we pray that your angel may take this sacrifice to your altar in heaven. Then, as we receive from this altar the sacred body and blood of your Son, let us be filled with every grace and blessing. [Through Christ our Lord. Amen.] "
"Father, we celebrate the memory of Christ, your Son. We, your people and your ministers, recall his passion, his resurrection from the dead, and his ascension into glory; and from the many gifts you have given us we offer to you, God of glory and majesty, this holy and perfect sacrifice: the bread of life and the cup of eternal salvation.
Look with favor on these offerings and accept them as once you accepted the gifts of your servant Abel, the sacrifice of Abraham, our father in faith, and the bread and wine offered by your priest Melchizedek.
Almighty God, we pray that your angel may take this sacrifice to your altar in heaven. Then, as we receive from this altar the sacred body and blood of your Son, let us be filled with every grace and blessing. [Through Christ our Lord. Amen.] "
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elvisman
Guest
Not at all.
I said that YOU don’t know what it means.
Again witht the colors, Doki?
Stick to the topic.
I’ll ask you again:
Which part do you have a problem with?
Which part do you disagree with?
This is a pattern with you, Doki. Every time you’re losing the debate - you try to derail the thread.
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First_Thought
Guest
Here’s another perspective on Christ:
“Christ has been much misinterpreted by the world. Even the most elementary principles of his teachings have been desecrated, and their esoteric depths have been forgotten. They have been crucified at the hands of dogma, prejudice, and cramped understanding. Genocidal wars have been fought, people have been burned as witches and heretics, on the presumed authority of man-made doctrines of Christianity. How to salvage the immortal teachings from the hands of ignorance? We must know Jesus as an Oriental Christ, a supreme yogi who manifested full mastery of the universal science of God-union, and thus could speak and act as a savior with the voice and authority of God.” - Paramahansa Yogananda
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elvisman
Guest
Well - you were right - that’s definitely another perspective. The WRONG perspective.
Yogi, indeed . . .
- Status