Nominal Catholics urged to quit church

[Eucharisted]

In an effort to reduce the church’s political influence, Argentine atheists and feminists are spearheading a drive to get people who were baptized Roman Catholic but disagree with the church’s politics to formally renounce their faith.

The “Not in my Name” Internet campaign, also called Collective Apostasy, encourages people who are Catholic in name only to write to the bishops where they were baptized to officially register that they have left the church.

Latin America is home to about half of the world’s Roman Catholics but many people who were baptized Catholic do not practice the religion.

Read the rest here

 

[stbruno]

It seems to me that the readings during Lent speak so eloquently to us about how we as people, not just Christians need to repent or we will be destroyed. As the old testament story of Jonah going out to warn the people of Ninevah. It must sadden others like it saddens me to see that people just aren’t heeding this time tested tradition. So for those of us faithful, we need to turn towards God and pray for our world…so that others may come to know Jesus and listen to his word.

Heavenly Father, loving and forgiving are you. Have mercy on us sinners.

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

Let us keep all of these people in prayer, especially those who may be tempted to follow such outrageous advice.

 

[Fran65]

What difference does it make to Catholics who believe themselves to be ‘right’ and who judge ‘cafeteria’ or liberal Catholics (i.e. those whose politicsand/or beliefs are not in accordance with the Church) as having left the Church in all but name anyway?According to many ‘faithful’ catholics, those who ask questions and who follow their conscience are not wanted in the church.

Pope Benedict himself has said that he would rather have a small, faithful church than a large church in which people question, dissent and put pressure on the hierarchy.

Seriously, why are you concerned?

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

What difference does it make to Catholics who believe themselves to be ‘right’ and who judge ‘cafeteria’ or liberal Catholics (i.e. those whose politicsand/or beliefs are not in accordance with the Church) as having left the Church in all but name anyway?According to many ‘faithful’ catholics, those who ask questions and who follow their conscience are not wanted in the church.

Pope Benedict himself has said that he would rather have a small, faithful church than a large church in which people question, dissent and put pressure on the hierarchy.

Seriously, why are you concerned?

If we believe that the Catholic Church alone (which we do) has the fullness of revealed truth, why would we not want all those who espouse to be Catholic be in full communion with us.?
Those who are cafeteria Catholics are just like protestants who do not believe all that the Catholic Church believes and teaches. We want them in communion with us also. We either believe the Church has the fullness of revealed truth or we don’t. I for one believe that it does as I know that I am not nearly intelligent enough to question the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

 

[tamccrackine]

While I’m appalled at the idea that a group of people would urge “nominal” Catholics to drop out totally from the Church (and that’s what I believe them to feel at times… dropped out), I don’t believe it’s right to be encouraging them ourselves to drop out.

Maybe it’s a reflection on my own sinfulness of which I sometimes have found that I question why the Church teaches certain things. The Church requires that we teach ourselves WHY she believes/teaches something. I wouldn’t want the Church to make me drop out of the Church because I was struggling with a belief of one of her tenets. I was pro-abortion for 8 years before I came back to the Church full force, but I never totally “left” the Church. I never joined or participated in another church with the full intention of joining. I always labeled myself as Catholic. And then one day, I had a change of heart.

What bugs me is my pride in the idea that I work so hard at being a faithful Catholic, true to the Magesterium, and faithful in her teachings… only for those people that have skirted on the outsides for so long all of a sudden just pop back in easily.

Many people have been both the Prodigal Son and also his brother (or maybe even his father). Lord knows I’ve been both the son and brother and I’m forever grateful that the Church never left me.

 

[Eucharisted]

What difference does it make to Catholics who believe themselves to be ‘right’ and who judge ‘cafeteria’ or liberal Catholics (i.e. those whose politicsand/or beliefs are not in accordance with the Church) as having left the Church in all but name anyway?According to many ‘faithful’ catholics, those who ask questions and who follow their conscience are not wanted in the church.

Pope Benedict himself has said that he would rather have a small, faithful church than a large church in which people question, dissent and put pressure on the hierarchy.

Seriously, why are you concerned?

Homestyle Catholics are not self-righteous, nor is the Church some kind of controlling cult. And your false witness against the Pope is uncalled for. I’d say it is you who is self-righteous and cannot handle intellectual discussions.

 

[Eucharisted]

Let us keep all of these people in prayer, especially those who may be tempted to follow such outrageous advice.

I agree

 

[Fran65]

Thank you for your reply Eucharisted.

1. I did not call anyone self righteous. Believing oneself to be right is not the same thing as being self righteous. You clearly meant the term self righteous in a pejorative sense, I meant it in the descriptive sense. I invite you to clarify the difference for yourself with any online dictionary.
2. As for ‘false witness’; in one sense, you are right to point out the mistake in my post. Pope Benedict has predicted a smaller, more faithful church. The fact however that the Vatican are not looking for ways to keep liberal or dissenting Catholics in the Church indicates to me that they are not interested in anything than ‘my way or the highway’. That can be read as either an observation or a criticism. You chose the latter.
3. As for the ‘can’t handle intellectual discussion’ jibe. That was rude, insulting and uncalled for. I do not need to defend myself to you or anyone else here.

 

[Corki]

Thank you for your reply Eucharisted.

1. As for ‘false witness’; in one sense, you are right to point out the mistake in my post. Pope Benedict has predicted a smaller, more faithful church. **The fact however that the Vatican are not looking for ways to keep liberal or dissenting Catholics in the Church **indicates to me that they are not interested in anything than ‘my way or the highway’. That can be read as either an observation or a criticism. You chose the latter.

Fran,

I don’t know what it’s like in the UK, but your observation, bolded above, is not true based on the actions of the Church in the US. Many Bishops have bent over backwards to keep outspoken dissidents in the Church here. Public acts of dissent are not met with censure or excommunication but with discourse and private counseling. I don’t know if you follow US politics but during the last election cycle a Catholic congresswoman went on national TV and not only publically dissented from Church teaching, but misrepresented it. She wasn’t thrown out of the Church. Her misinformation was corrected in a pastoral way. Some would say the Church was not tough enough on her but I don’t think anyone would say that no effort was made to keep her in the Church.

According to many ‘faithful’ catholics, those who ask questions and who follow their conscience are not wanted in the church.

But asking questions and following a properly formed conscience are marks of a faithful Catholic.

I do think that there is an artificial link in your statement between “liberal” and “dissenting.” Dissent, especially public dissent, is always going to be sinful behaviour if it involves doctrine or the legitimate authority of the Church in areas of faith and morals. But dissent is not limited to liberals nor are all liberal Catholics also public dissenters. Many honestly question and prod the Church to explore and stretch. There are legitimate ways to “put pressure on the hierarchy.” Such has always been the history of the Church.

 

[killyclogher]

“The fact however that the Vatican are not looking for ways to keep liberal or dissenting Catholics in the Church indicates to me that they are not interested in anything than ‘my way or the highway’.”

I’m not sure what you mean here. What kind of dissents?

 

[Fran65]

Dissension means to express opposition thorugh action or words.There are dissenting ordained Catholics as well as dissenting laity.

For example, some Priests in the confessional may counsel an individual to take communion when divorced, or when using contraception. Many laity dissent through their use of contraception, their non attendance at Mass every sunday and by not seeking confession. Some also advocate women priests. Some of those will have been misinformed, some of those will have actively decided to follow their own conscience and not Church teachings. The issues where dissension occurs are many and the response is a simple one - that we all rely on the grace of God and none know who is saved and who damned. However, the Church teaches that by dissenting, an individual is putting their soul at risk.

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

If we believe that the Catholic Church alone (which we do) has the fullness of revealed truth, why would we not want all those who espouse to be Catholic be in full communion with us.?
Those who are cafeteria Catholics are just like protestants who do not believe all that the Catholic Church believes and teaches. We want them in communion with us also. We either believe the Church has the fullness of revealed truth or we don’t. I for one believe that it does as I know that I am not nearly intelligent enough to question the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

I agree with you, Deacon. And I am full of joyful anticipation of the reunion I know will come between my truly Christian Protestant brothers and sisters and the fullness of the Roman Catholic Church.

Gotta go listen to Fr. Corapi. God bless.

 

[Contarini]

1. As for ‘false witness’; in one sense, you are right to point out the mistake in my post. Pope Benedict has predicted a smaller, more faithful church. The fact however that the Vatican are not looking for ways to keep liberal or dissenting Catholics in the Church

Sure they are. That’s why Pope Benedict engages in eloquent, thoughtful expositions of the Catholic Faith at every opportunity. He just isn’t interested in the kind of compromise that liberal/secular people are looking for.

Don’t confuse Pope Benedict with his would-be supporters on this forum, by the way.

Edwin

 

[Mark77]

I drifted away from the Church for many years, although I never formally denounced Her.

It was not until I had thrown away the perfect gift that Jesus gave us, His One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church, that I finally realized what I was missing.

I was exposed, for the first time, to non-Catholics, both Protestant Christians and non-Christians, primarily Muslims. Their zeal for God and Jesus was inspiring, but their false claims against the Catholic Church troubled me.

Initially, some of their claims seemed reasonable. “I don’t need to confess my sins to a Priest, he’s just a man, why not go directly to God?” "Why do they worship Mary?..etc., etc…

Because of the witness of strong, well informed Catholics and their ministries, like the Priest, Father Derrick Lappe, who came to prison to bring us the Sacred Mass and the Holy Eucharist and brave volunteers like Greta, Melissa and others who brought me apologetics materials like St. Augustine’s Confessions and the Catechism to answer the many questions I had.

Most of all, I missed Jesus in the Holy Eucharist, Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity!

Radio programs like CA Live, and now that I have the internet, CA and numerous other resources have all helped answer my questions and doubts and allowed me to return Home (I especially like the “Journey Home” program with Marcus Grodi as it focused on numerous Protestant, non-Protestant, agnostic and atheist converts).

We are all on the Journey Home to the fullness of Jesus’ Truth, some of us just get more lost along the way.

Pray for all of us who have not fully committed to Jesus.

As Jesus taught us, God the Father is always waiting for us to return. “So he set off and went to his father. But while he was still far off, his father saw him and was filled with compassion; he ran and put his arms around him and kissed him.” Lk 15:20.

We are all the ‘prodigal son’ at one point or another, having squandered the gift of Love Jesus gives us.

We must not accept the lies, or dilute the Truth, but we must always witness with love and forgiving compassion as Jesus taught us.

Sancta Maria, Mater Dei, Ora Pro Nobis Peccatoribus!

Mark

 

[Jesus_N_Cherie]

“The fact however that the Vatican are not looking for ways to keep liberal or dissenting Catholics in the Church indicates to me that they are not interested in anything than ‘my way or the highway’.”

How would you have the Vatican try to keep liberal or dissenting Catholics in the Church? The only thing that these people want is their own way…which just so happens to be acceptance of that which Christ has shown to be intrinsically evil. The Church cannot bend on these things…and to attempt to placate those who want evil to be accepted as good is evil in and of itself.

NO, the Church’s responsibility is to spread the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and to pray for and urge conversion to the TRUTH of JESUS CHRIST, Who is THE Way, THE Truth, and THE Life. He is not a way, truth and life. The word THE is key here.

 

[manualman]

This is NOT actually necessarily a bad thing. These leftist activists are, in actuality, calling people to be intellectualy honest. They are making the argument:
“Hey, If you don’t believe what this Church teaches, then why are you wasting your time claiming membership?”

That’s a GOOD question!

Jesus himself said that what he detest the most is lukewarmness. If the people want to try out stone cold, let them give it a shot. IMO, that will lead many of them to a new appreciation of the HEAT in catholic teaching.

IMO, the atheists have more to fear from nominal catholics taking a last hard look at the faith of their fathers than we do.

 

[7_Sorrows]

sadly, there will probably be some nominal Catholics that will take this advice.

these types of activists are very dangerous in my opinion.

especially younger people who have not had a chance to really develop a deep faith.

 

[Beachcomber]

That’s terrible advice. What about those saints that had wandered from the church and after years and many prayers of loved ones, finally returned? We would be without St Augustine, for example.

 

[Migueliones]

I don’t really see the problem here, it doesn’t sound like they’re targeting ‘cafeteria Catholics’ (who wouldn’t be wanting to leave the Church anyway, would they? That wouldn’t make sense!) but people who have already left the Catholic Church and who don’t want to be included in Church statistics.

"The church counts all those who’ve been baptized as Catholic and lobbies for legislation based on that number, so we’re trying to convey the importance of people expressing that they no longer belong to the church."

Sounds fair enough doesn’t it?

Indeed, this thread has reminded me I need to write a letter to the local bishop and the bishop of the diocese where I was baptised to do the same thing.