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Deacon_Ed_B
Guest
I like ;this response.
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Stjudeprayforus
Guest
Argentine atheists and feminists are spearheading a drive to get people who were baptized Roman Catholic but disagree with the church’s politics to formally renounce their faith.
If the follow the advice of Athiests… then… Uh… bye-bye
If the follow the advice of Athiests… then… Uh… bye-bye
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zietgeist2002
Guest
Pope Benedict may indend find a small, failthful church but not because the Faithful have lost thier faith in God but rather the Faithful have lost their faith in the modern catholic Church. Sex scandals continue to rock the Church and Pope Benedicts hands are as involved in the cover up as any. The clergy view the Faithful as those who turned a blind eye as they have in covering up the scandal.
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unafraid
Guest
That is an oxymoron. Leaving one’s faith makes one faithless…not faithful. However, we are discussing radical atheists, feminists and homosexuals opposing the Roman Catholic Church with the sort of gusto usually reserved for political uprisings. The rage with which they operate speaks to the source and inspiration behind their dark designs. Still, it is better to have a clear foe, one in absolute juxtuposition to our Faith, than to face an insidious, shadowy nemesis, such as the one which spawned the incomprehensible origins of the sex scandal crisis. These people are loud, often profane, and are always egocentric, in that they seem to crave a platform as countercultural oddities, which makes them very evident and easy to identify as declared enemies of the Church. The dark side of life is seductive to some, but when held next to the light of truth, love and goodness, it always reveals an horrific profile. I worry more about the enemy I cannot see than the one standing right before me. These people are doomed to failure because it is a bankrupt nature which opposes God and his eminent goodness. I pity them.
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wisdomseeker
Guest
you are right. before, many just left the Church. today, they are staying in to fight the Church from the inside.
actually these atheists may be doing something good for the Church.
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KC91
Guest
Catholicism is still the state religion in Argentina. The government should take action as soon as possible to ban such atheist poaching activities.
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OriginalJS
Guest
The issue is not whether the Church has the fullness of revealed truth or whether to question the guidance of the Holy Spirit. The fact is that the hierarchy has, clear down to many priests, lost its way. Pedophile priests and the bishops who not only protected them but moved them to new locations where they could offend again and again simply cannot be true representatives of the fullness of revealed truth. There is logic and reason in avoiding such bad people.
Can’t the Holy Spirit guide people directly?
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OriginalJS
Guest
It is so easy to fall into the role of the brother who remained behind! But remember, you have had the Church the whole time (“Everything I have is yours.”) While those who “pop back in” haven’t. This divine wisdom in Jesus’ parable is still hard for many of us to accept in our hearts, just like the wisdom in the parable of the workers in the vineyard. God Bless.
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Hopemercy
Guest
Interesting thread…
Someone spoke re conscience. The Holy Father, as Ratzinger, wrote a beautiful piece on conscience. Stating very clearly that if there be conflict between individual conscience and the Church, then individual conscience must be first and foremost. Of course, he went on to say that he hoped that the Church would inform conscience. But…
The idea in the news article has been refined here in Ireland; see the site
countmeout.ie/
And, remember that Ireland is 95 % baptised Catholic, but with fewer and fewer at mass etc as the scandals and cover ups gather momentum daily now.
Just this week, the Primate, Cardinal Brady, was exposed as having taken part in covering up abuse.
The best site to follow the abuse here is
clericalwhispers.blogspot.com/
The Primate then used St Patrick;s day mass much as a political arena.
Now the Bishop of Derry has been exposed as having done much the same as recently as 2,000
Already 4 bishops have resigned and more will follow now.
We as good faithful Catholics are allowed to miss mass with good reason. More and more now simply cannot attend when we still do not have clergy we can trust to be pure.
So many abused and now the Primate is involved… and now the Holy Father?
And we are reminded of the words spoken before Sodom and Gomorrah fell. “Is there one holy man left?”
It seems that the only true holy ones are those who feel they simply cannot attend mass when there is no holiness there.
Who love Jesus and the Church so much that they cannot endure this travesti.
Someone spoke re conscience. The Holy Father, as Ratzinger, wrote a beautiful piece on conscience. Stating very clearly that if there be conflict between individual conscience and the Church, then individual conscience must be first and foremost. Of course, he went on to say that he hoped that the Church would inform conscience. But…
The idea in the news article has been refined here in Ireland; see the site
countmeout.ie/
And, remember that Ireland is 95 % baptised Catholic, but with fewer and fewer at mass etc as the scandals and cover ups gather momentum daily now.
Just this week, the Primate, Cardinal Brady, was exposed as having taken part in covering up abuse.
The best site to follow the abuse here is
clericalwhispers.blogspot.com/
The Primate then used St Patrick;s day mass much as a political arena.
Now the Bishop of Derry has been exposed as having done much the same as recently as 2,000
Already 4 bishops have resigned and more will follow now.
We as good faithful Catholics are allowed to miss mass with good reason. More and more now simply cannot attend when we still do not have clergy we can trust to be pure.
So many abused and now the Primate is involved… and now the Holy Father?
And we are reminded of the words spoken before Sodom and Gomorrah fell. “Is there one holy man left?”
It seems that the only true holy ones are those who feel they simply cannot attend mass when there is no holiness there.
Who love Jesus and the Church so much that they cannot endure this travesti.
K
kenofken
Guest
I did register my formal defection last year, as a matter of conscience but also intellectual honesty. I see it as an act of mutual respect between myself and the church. For too long, the church, and to some extent, it’s nominal members, have been playing a juvenile game. The church claims it has 1.3 billion worldwide members or some grossly inflated number like that based on the notion that you are Catholic forever just by having some water splashed on you. On the other hand, they’ve really been racheting up orthodoxy in the last decade or so, insisting that you’re only a “real” Catholic if you buy into 100% of what they say. Well that number is probably 200 million, give or take.
So the heirarchy likes all those CINOs because it swells the bishops political clout. The cardinals are used to getting deferential treatment from politicians in big city regions and Washington because they claim to speak for millions of people who don’t share their views or even practice the faith. It’s time for the games to end. If you’re a committed Catholic, great. Stand up and be counted. If you haven’t gone to church since your family made you in junior high and you no longer practice and think it’s all bunk, make a proper and clean break. Don’t be a “nominal” Catholic who feeds the Church’s bogus membership rolls, and dont’ insult the faith of those who still practice. To learn how to do so, check out www.countmeout.ie.
So the heirarchy likes all those CINOs because it swells the bishops political clout. The cardinals are used to getting deferential treatment from politicians in big city regions and Washington because they claim to speak for millions of people who don’t share their views or even practice the faith. It’s time for the games to end. If you’re a committed Catholic, great. Stand up and be counted. If you haven’t gone to church since your family made you in junior high and you no longer practice and think it’s all bunk, make a proper and clean break. Don’t be a “nominal” Catholic who feeds the Church’s bogus membership rolls, and dont’ insult the faith of those who still practice. To learn how to do so, check out www.countmeout.ie.
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Deacon_Ed_B
Guest
I am continually amazed at the number who bring up the pedophile scandal. When compared to protestant churches, the number of Catholic clergy involved is less than 2 %. In so far as just letting individuals follow what the Holy Spirit tells them, which of the more than 20,000 protestand denominations will you pick to follow. What many believe, who are protestant, is that truth is relative. It is not. It is one, singular, and immutable. If it was true, 2000 years ageo, it is true today. If Protestantism is correct, tell me please, which ddemonination would you follow and why. I follow the Church established by Jesus. Even out of the 12 apostles, one betrayed Jesus and one denied him. Will you condemn Jesus for this.
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kenofken
Guest
You’re right. It’s time people stop carping about the abuse scandal. I mean, we’ve all had our little indiscretions - smoking a joint in college, shoplifting a video game. How different is criminal sexual assault of a minor, criminal conspiracy and racketeering, really? Maybe Christ did reserve his only violent words for child predators and urged their summary execution, but he probably just had a bad day at the office then and what gives him the right to second guess the bishops anyway?
Dude, seriously, in one paragraph you advocate the total abandonment of moral reason in defense of your church, then assure us that that institution is the only repository of moral truth in existence. I’d get sent down for an MRI if I bought that.
It’s even more absurd to base arguments on what rate of child rape is “normal.” We don’t know what percentage of priests really abuse because the overwhelming majority got away with it until quite recently. Many have or will die with their crimes remaining secrets. Of course abuse is not unique to Catholic churches or religious entities in general, but what does it mean to say the RCC is on par with other institutions in that regard? Is a 2% buggery rate “good enough”? If the rate in secular schools is 4%, does that mean the church is doing twice as well? Whatever minority of priests did abuse, each one created dozens, sometimes hundreds of victims over a career.
What has people outraged isn’t the fact that abusers found their way into the church 2, or 3, or whatever percent of the total. It’s the fact that bishops actively enabled their crimes and failed to protect children 100 PERCENT of the time for 60+ years, and continue to drag their feet every inch of the way. Are you learning nothing at all from Ireland? In the span of a couple years, they went from the most Catholic country on Earth to one that is almost as anti-Catholic as Reformation England. Rome’s house is quite literally burning down, and the Vatican and its apologists are saying, “maybe we should look into buying a smoke detector, but it’s nothing to get upset about.”
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Janet1983
Guest
I did that around the end of last year and got the confirmation of my formal defection in February… Yes, I agree that it is more honest to either practice the faith or leave.
On the other hand this is a very radical step. Not everybody who does not practice or agree with all doctrines is actually willing to leave the Church. There is always a chance for them to come back when they are just inactive. After a formal defection, especially for reasons of conscience (or heresy) this might be more complicated.
Most people are not willing to take a step that radical.
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whatevergirl
Guest
Agree.
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