Non-biblical corroboration to support Exodus?

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Victor2211

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Hello friends,

For the past 2+ years, I have been doing a lot of reading to learn as much about my faith as I can. I was having a recent conversation with a non-Christian friend regarding the Old Testament. During that conversation, he told me that, other than the book of Exodus, there is no historical justification to support the fact that the Exodus (captivity, plagues, and Moses leading the Israelites out of captivity) ever occurred.

I’ve done some brief Internet research on this. I’ve read some documents that suggest there is a lack of non-biblical support; however, the explanation for this is that ancient cultures that were powerful in their day would intentionally leave their defeats out of the history books to avoid embarrassment.

I read another source that stated the Exodus did not happen. For proof, the source stated that it would be impossible due to the sheer number of people living for so many years in the desert to not leave behind a significant amount of trash, artifacts, etc. The source stated that archeologists have never located any artifacts in the Egyptian desert that would verify the story of the Exodus.

Can any of you point me in the right direction where I can learn more about this? Thanks 🙂
 
Victor2211 said:
Hello friends,

For the past 2+ years, I have been doing a lot of reading to learn as much about my faith as I can. I was having a recent conversation with a non-Christian friend regarding the Old Testament. During that conversation, he told me that, other than the book of Exodus, there is no historical justification to support the fact that the Exodus (captivity, plagues, and Moses leading the Israelites out of captivity) ever occurred.

I’ve done some brief Internet research on this. I’ve read some documents that suggest there is a lack of non-biblical support; however, the explanation for this is that ancient cultures that were powerful in their day would intentionally leave their defeats out of the history books to avoid embarrassment.

I read another source that stated the Exodus did not happen. For proof, the source stated that it would be impossible due to the sheer number of people living for so many years in the desert to not leave behind a significant amount of trash, artifacts, etc. The source stated that archeologists have never located any artifacts in the Egyptian desert that would verify the story of the Exodus.

Can any of you point me in the right direction where I can learn more about this? Thanks 🙂
Click to expand...
I’ve read that chariots from the time period of Exodus were found under the Red Sea, suggesting the parting of the Sea was true. Don’t know much about it though.
 
Check a map of that desert. Look how big it is. We know there were 60,000 men. I don’t know the hebrew grammar works, but it is possible that “men” means “people”. I know that in greek, a group of people are always masculine, or men, unless they are exclusively female. It used to be much the same in english till the femininsts went and changed everything.

But just say there were 120,000 people. Now 120k people don’t take up very much space, not compared to the whole desert. Maybe we havn’t seen because we haven’t looked in the right place.

Remember that sand is always blowing around, in the desert, and so it is probably covered up anyway.

How many archeologists would be stupid enough to try and excavate the whole siani penisula and the middle east?

There was an archeologist nammed Immanuel Velikovsky wrote several books arguing that the secular chronology was wrong. He said the bible was right. Might be worth having a read of his works.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immanuel_Velikovsky#Books_by_Velikovsky
 
History books? How many history books from that period, other than the Bible, survive? Can you name any?
 
PaulfromIowa said:
History books? How many history books from that period, other than the Bible, survive? Can you name any?
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Egyptian hieroglyphs and wall paintings date back to around the Old Testament time period. These have taught modern scientists much of their ancient culture. However, from what I’ve read so far, there is no mention in their writings of the Exodus. I proposed my initial question to see if anyone has learned of other sources that could provide more evidence for the Exodus accounts. Prior to the discussion I had with my non-Christian friend who told me there was no such evidence, I had never given this topic much thought. Now I find it quite interesting.
 
bobbyhillisabro said:
I’ve read that chariots from the time period of Exodus were found under the Red Sea, suggesting the parting of the Sea was true. Don’t know much about it though.
Click to expand...
Very interesting! I hadn’t heard that before. I will definitely look into it. Thanks for the info 🙂
 
Arthropod said:
Check a map of that desert. Look how big it is. We know there were 60,000 men. I don’t know the hebrew grammar works, but it is possible that “men” means “people”. I know that in greek, a group of people are always masculine, or men, unless they are exclusively female. It used to be much the same in english till the femininsts went and changed everything.

But just say there were 120,000 people. Now 120k people don’t take up very much space, not compared to the whole desert. Maybe we havn’t seen because we haven’t looked in the right place.

Remember that sand is always blowing around, in the desert, and so it is probably covered up anyway.

How many archeologists would be stupid enough to try and excavate the whole siani penisula and the middle east?

There was an archeologist nammed Immanuel Velikovsky wrote several books arguing that the secular chronology was wrong. He said the bible was right. Might be worth having a read of his works.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immanuel_Velikovsky#Books_by_Velikovsky
Click to expand...
You make some very good points. You actually reminded me of something else I had read relating to the fact that archeologists who were looking into the Exodus accounts had actually considered the wrong time period when they did their digging - and that explains why they didn’t find anything.
 
Ask your friend if he can supply any non-Roman corroboration that a man named Nero was Emperor of the Roman Empire for fourteen years.

Have you heard of the Emperor Nero? You probably have. I think pretty much everyone has heard of Nero. What historic records could your friend produce about Nero?

Your friend could readily supply three historians (all of whom were Roman - by which I mean they actually lived in the city of Rome). Two of them wrote a century after Nero’s death, and the other one 150 years later.

Nero was Emperor of the greatest empire of antiquity for fourteen years. How many firsthand historical documents (Roman or otherwise) describe his reign? Answer: zero.

How many secondhand historical documents (Roman or otherwise) describe his reign? Answer: zero.

Thirdhand? Fourthhand? Fifthhand? Zero. Nada. Zip.

Ancient Romans were far better record keepers than the even-more-ancient Egyptians. Why should we expect to find Egyptian records of escaped slaves, when we cannot even find Roman records (or even non-Roman records) of the flippin’ Emperor of the Roman Empire?
 
They also found pieces of bronze chariots

youtube.com/watch?v=n-8e8PGvhgg

Exodus 14:5-7 describes Pharaoh sending chariots to chase the slaves who ran away
  • Bones of horses, human beings and chariots have been found in the sea at Nuiweba
arkdiscovery.com/red_sea_crossing.htm
  • Evidence of an eruption from a volcano from Aegean island of Thera has been discovered
‘‘This time difference is rather striking, as it could fit the desert period of 40 years separating the Exodus from the destruction of Jericho, mentioned in ancient Hebrew texts,’’ the archeologists write. Bruins is a professor at the Ben-Gurion University of the Negev in Israel. Van der Plicht is at the University of Groningen in the Netherlands.
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thefreelibrary.com/EVIDENCE+BACKS+BIBLE’S+JERICHO+BATTLE+STORY,+ARCHEOLOGISTS+SAY.-a083956818
  • In 1966, Manfred Bietak, Austrian archaeologist, discovered and excavated ruins at Avaris, which was the capital of Egypt under Hykoses and the modern name for this city is Tell el-Dab’a. Bietak discovered methods of burial differing from Egyptians and the walls of buildings, floor plans etc were like those built by Hebrews in Israel
  • Roman historian Tacitus, who was an anti semite, says in his book ‘Histories’ (5.3), that ‘most writers agree’ regarding a ‘plague’ in ancient Egypt and Tactius says that the cause was ‘a race hateful to the gods,’ which was ‘removed to foreign lands.’ Tacitus says, ‘So the Hebrews were searched out and gathered together’ and names ‘Moses.’ Read the full text:
penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Tacitus/Histories/5A*.html
  • Sinatic inscriptions in Wadee El-Mukattab, Sinai record some of the events of the Exodus from a non Hebrew source: bibleprobe.com/exodus.htm
  • There is a book called, Israel in Egypt: The Evidence for the Authenticity of the Exodus Tradition by James K. Hoffmeier, professor of Bible studies and archeology, and he looks at the evidence for the Exodus and he argues that it supports the Biblical record
Here is a lecture he gave:

The Exodus from Egypt, a Lecture with Dr. James Hoffmeier
  • King of Egypt Merneptah says on the Merneptah stele: Plundered is the Canaan with every evil; Carried off is Ashkelon; seized upon is Gezer; Yanoam is made as that which does not exist; Israel is laid waste, his seed is not…
  • That is evidence of Israel having been in Egypt in an hieroglyphic inscription that has been dated to nearly 200 years prior to the Merneptah stele:
biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/ancient-cultures/ancient-israel/does-the-merneptah-stele-contain-the-first-mention-of-israel
 
  • Evidence for post Exodus Israelite sites have been discovered:
haaretz.com/news/have-the-first-israelite-sites-built-after-exodus-been-found-1.273654

Sinatic inscriptions in Wadee El-Mukattab, Sinai record some of the events of the Exodus from a non Hebrew source:

bibleprobe.com/exodus.htm
  • Discovery channel documentary, ‘Who was Moses?’ looks at the archaeological evidence is presented for Israel having been in Egypt:
Part 1

Part 2

Part 3

Part 4
  • Leiden Papyrus 348, an Egyptian document, says, 'distribute grain rations to the soldiers and to the ‘Apiru who transport stones to the great pylon of Rameses.’ Scholars have mixed views on whether ‘Apriu’ can refer to Hebrews, some thing it can, some think it can not. Exodus 1:11 says Hebrews, ‘built supply cities, Pithom and Rameses, for Pharaoh’ so the Leiden Papyrus 348 would fit with Exodus 1:11
    [*]18th dynasty painted inscriptions in Egyptian tombs show slaves making bricks etc. Professor Hoffmeier says in an article, ‘It is worth noting, that the practice of using forced labor for building projects is only documented for the period 1450 to 1200, the very time most biblical historians place the Israelites in Egypt’
    [*]The linked article in the prior paragraph says of this circumstantial evidence

  • In a surviving Egyptian document called Leiden Papyrus 348, orders are given to “distribute grain rations to the soldiers and to the 'Apiru who transport stones to the great pylon of Rameses.” This brings to mind Exodus 1:11, which says the Hebrews “built supply cities, Pithom and Rameses, for Pharaoh.” While hotly debated, 'Apiru is believed by some scholars to refer to the Hebrews, the 'Ibri. If a future discovery of an inscription could link this word to the Hebrews, this document would prove to be our first direct extrabiblical reference to the children of Israel in slavery in Egypt.
    [*]Recent discoveries of military outposts on a road leading from Egypt into Canaan, built by Pharaoh Seti I and earlier kings in the thirteenth century B.C., shed new light on why a northern route for the Exodus would have meant war for the Israelites. Exodus 13:17 states: "When Pharaoh let the people go, God did not lead them by way of the land of the Philistines, although that was nearer; for God thought, ‘If the people face war, they may change their minds and return to Egypt.’ " Instead, the Bible explains, “God led the people by the roundabout way of the wilderness.”
    [*]While it is virtually impossible 3,000 years later to retrace the footsteps of a people who escaped over a sand-swept wilderness, an Egyptian letter (Anastasi III) from guards at a “border crossing” between Egypt and the Sinai helps explain Moses’ insistent cry, “Let my people go!” The text indicates that in the thirteenth century the Egyptians maintained a tight border control, allowing no one to pass without a permit. The letter describes two slaves who—in a striking parallel to the Israelite escape—flee from the city of Rameses at night, are pursued by soldiers, but disappear into the Sinai wilderness. “When my letter reaches you,” writes the official to the border guard, “write to me about all that has happened to [them]. Who found their tracks? Which watch found their tracks? Write to me about all that has happened to them and how many people you send out after them.” Another inscription from the same cache of documents (Anastasi VI) records that an entire tribe gained permission to enter Egypt from Edom in search of food.
    [*]If it seems incredible to believe that 600,000 men plus women and children could have survived as a people in the Sinai wilderness for 40 years, we may be misinterpreting the number, says Hoffmeier. Hebrew University professor Abraham Malamat, for one, points out that the Bible often refers to 600 and its multiples, as well as 1,000 and its multiples, typologically in order to convey the idea of a large military unit. “The issue of Exodus 12:37 is an interpretive one,” says Hoffmeier. “The Hebrew word eleph can be translated ‘thousand,’ but it is also rendered in the Bible as ‘clans’ and ‘military units.’ When I look at the question as an Egyptologist, I know that there are thought to have been 20,000 in the entire Egyptian army at the height of Egypt’s empire. And at the battle of Ai in Joshua 7, there was a severe military setback when 36 troops were killed. If you have an army of 600,000, that’s not a big setback.” In other words, the head count may have been far fewer than suggested by a literal reading of Exodus 12:37.
    [*]While conservative scholars debate an “early” and “late” date for the Exodus (fifteenth century or thirteenth century B.C.), all but the most skeptical scholars agree that the Israelites were in Canaan by the year 1208 B.C. This date was set a century ago with the discovery of the Merneptah Stele. This seven-foot high, black granite stone contains a victory hymn of Pharaoh Merneptah, which proclaims, “The Canaan is plundered with every hardship. / Ashkelon is taken, Gezer is captured, / [and] Yano’am reduced to nothing. / Israel is laid waste, his seed is no more.”
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ctlibrary.com/ct/1998/september7/8ta044.html
 
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