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I suspected that might have been the reason
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PRmerger
Guest
Even for stealing a pack of gum?
This is the God of mercy whom you worship? :bigyikes:
Until, in your paradigm, we sin and die without repentance, correct?
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PRmerger
Guest
You believe, once you make a confession of faith in Jesus as your personal Lord and Savior (something not found in Scripture, BTW), that your sins are purged, correct? All your sins have been washed away (i.e. purged) and God “sees” you as perfect.
Catholics believe this purging occurs, too–just at a different time.
If it doesn’t negate Christ’s atoning death to have your sins purged at the moment of your alleged “confession of faith”, then it doesn’t negate Christ’s atoning death to have your sins purged in Purgatory either.
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PRmerger
Guest
Of course they are love. If someone says “I love chocolate” you wouldn’t say, “Huh? I don’t know what you mean.”
You’re just using a limited definition of love.
Like I said, there’s multiple concepts of love–in the Scriptures as well as in life.
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PRmerger
Guest
These are all the different saving faiths and works that are required to be able to enter the kingdom of heaven.
We are saved:
By believing in Christ (Jn 3:16; Acts 16:31)
By eating His flesh and drinking His blood (John 6)
By repentance (Acts 2:38; 2 Pet 3:9)
By baptism (Jn 3:5; 1 Pet 3:21; Titus 3:5)
By the work of the Spirit (Jn 3:5; 2 Cor 3:6)
By declaring with our mouths (Lk 12:8; Rom 10:9)
By coming to a knowledge of the truth (1 Tim 2:4; Heb 10:26)
By works (Rom 2:6-7; James 2:24)
By grace (Acts 15:11; Eph 2:8)
By his blood (Rom 5:9; Heb 9:22)
By his righteousness (Rom 5:17; 2 Pet 1:1)
By his Cross (Eph 2:16; Col 2:14)
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Richard_Kastner
Guest
Your example is faulty PR. You ask if this person steals a pack of gum and is unrepentant, will this person be allowed into the kingdom of heaven. In your very restricted example, you seem to be assumning that this is the only sin that he is guilty of. I said that I cannot know this persons heart. What I meant by that is if there is one unrepented sin in a persons life there are probably more and this I cannot know. But this I do know. If this person has truely sinned, 1Jn.3:4Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law., and is unrepentant, they will not be in God’s heavenly kingdom. Repentance is a prerequisite for acceptance of the saving sacrifice of Jesus Christ and that is the ONLY way into heaven. John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
ALL of our sins have been purged on the cross. This is an immense gift that Christ offers to us, but a gift has two parts. In order for it to be a valid gift it MUST be accepted and the acceptance of this gift can only be accomplished if we repent. Do you really think that God is going to give us the gift of salvation if we are unrepentant?
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elvisman
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What does it mean to be a "true believer" in Jesus Christ?
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nickybr38
Guest
That’s a great list.
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Dokimas
Guest
Saying you understand the verse do NOT mean you do.
BTW, we were speaking of Paul’s verse you quoted, not about what Jesus was saying.
You do hold fast to what you’ve been taught.
God does us men and women but not exclusively (Saul’s conversion- maybe you missed it. I saw it when I read Acts.
)That includes not leaning on the understanding of church leaders cuz that verse is for all of us, is it not?
Oh yes, you keep calling me friend. Isn’t there a verse that says we should show ourselves friendly? You don’t show yourself friendly to some of us. Why then do you call us friends?
Pr 18:24 A man who has friends must himself be friendly, But there is a friend who sticks closer than a brother.
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Dokimas
Guest
What’s your point?
There’s not exact quote with your words. I never said there was. However, the church is ‘the called out ones’. God calls us out from the world into His Body. Those who respond to Him are part of His Body, thus His church.
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Dokimas
Guest
Paul thought that he and Barnabas should not take John Mark and Barnabus thought they should. That caused them (Paul and Barnabus) to part ways.:whacky::whacky:*But all “true believers” in Jesus the Christ believe different things! Are you saying there is more than one truth? That it doesn’t matter your truth, my truth, his truth, their truth etc etc are all the same??
Come on!
Cinette:shrug:*
There are essential beliefs that make us true believers. There are areas of misunderstandings by ALL of us which don’t matter eternally to God. Of course, this is my opinion as I read the Bible and observe God’s church. Early Jewish Christians thought the Gentile converst should be circumsized. Their belief was wrong. That wrong understanding didn’t make them non-Christian.
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Dokimas
Guest
The conversation you were having with another person was about three Bible understandings. The person said he’d ‘give you latitude’ for 2 of those subjects. You said he was changing his mind. I said not necessarily. Using ‘latitude’ as he did does NOT mean he was changing his mind.Huh?
***Don’t ***really understand your statement the way you structured your sentence. Please clarify.
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Richard_Kastner
Guest
Jn 3:16
16For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Oh, but it does PR because if the sins are not purged at the moment of our acceptance, it means that we are not justified in the eyes of God and if we are not justified in the eyes of God at the moment of our acceptance of Jesus sacrifice then it means that acceptance of Christ’s sacrifice does not save at all or in the case of the CC’s teaching a purging of sins must occur that is in addition to Christ’s sacrifice but is neccessary in order to make Christ’s sacrifice valid. This is NOT what the bible teaches.
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elvisman
Guest
The Church is the Authority of Christ on earth (Matt. 18:15-18).
The Church is the "pillar and foundation of truth" (1 Tim. 3:15).
The Church is the ONLY entity that has the guarantee of being guided by the Holy Spirit to ALL truth (John 16:12-15).
The Church is built upon Peter (Matt. 16:16-19).
The Church is the Body of Christ (1 Cor. 12:4-31).
The Church is that very same Apostolic body that has existed for 2000 years
THAT’S the Church.
If you’re not part of the Catholic Church you’r NOT part of Christ’s Church built on Peter.
You are OUTSIDE the Body of Christ and you need to come home.
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Dokimas
Guest
Can a person who gets drunk in their home without incident be charged with a crime? I don’t think so.
We agree it’s (most likely) a sin.
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elvisman
Guest
Then PLEASE list these "essential" beliefs.
Surely you have a list - right?
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Dokimas
Guest
Do you equate faith and belief always?
I agree the demons believe but they can’t have saving faith. Saving faith must have corresponding actions, as James said in his letter.
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Dokimas
Guest
Object of a true believer’s faith: Jesus, God the Son, Creator of the Universe, died for our sins, raised from the dead, lives forevermore.
Response of a true believer: follow Jesus, be as obedient as one can, grow in the grace and knowledge of Jesus.
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Dokimas
Guest
You’re the Bible scholar of this forum. Why don’t you tell us, please?
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Richard_Kastner
Guest
Gal2
16Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Jn14
6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
So are you saying that these verses are not true?
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