Non-Catholics, would you feel comfortable at a CC Mass?

[bridgeforsale]

I am sure you are not lying, but you have to recognize that we as Catholics would find that as a HUGE slap in the face. You know this, or you wouldn’t post about it bragging. I was an a** to others in life once to my friend.

But church services are during normal breakfast time (and I can’t exactly go to church with a egg mcmuffin can I). A little bread and grapejuice (especially in like a Methodist church, where you get a whole chunk of bread) fills the void for 20 minutes or so

 

[Teneas]

But church services are during normal breakfast time (and I can’t exactly go to church with a egg mcmuffin can I). A little bread and grapejuice (especially in like a Methodist church, where you get a whole chunk of bread) fills the void for 20 minutes or so

Keep it coming slick. I glad you find it amusing. I will roll with it, as I have a**hole tendencies as well.

 

[bridgeforsale]

Keep it coming slick. I glad you find it amusing. I will roll with it, as I have a**hole tendencies as well.

I have an unlimited well to draw from (picking on religion is just too easy)

 

[Teneas]

But church services are during normal breakfast time (and I can’t exactly go to church with a egg mcmuffin can I). A little bread and grapejuice (especially in like a Methodist church, where you get a whole chunk of bread) fills the void for 20 minutes or so

I should add that I don’t think Methodist or another standard “Protestant” churches would have an issue with you doing what you do, as it is merely symbolic of the body and blood.

Lutherans, Orthodox, and Catholics are a different story.

Even if you are here to push buttons, at least you are here. You may learn something in the time you spend before you get bored.

 

[Anna_Scott]

But church services are during normal breakfast time (and I can’t exactly go to church with a egg mcmuffin can I). A little bread and grapejuice (especially in like a Methodist church, where you get a whole chunk of bread) fills the void for 20 minutes or so

Keep it coming slick. I glad you find it amusing. I will roll with it, as I have a**hole tendencies as well.

I should add that I don’t think Methodist or another standard “Protestant” churches would have an issue with you doing what you do, as it is merely symbolic of the body and blood.

Lutherans, Orthodox, and Catholics are a different story.

Even if you are here to push buttons, at least you are here. You may learn something in the time you spend before you get bored.

I have an unlimited well to draw from (picking on religion is just too easy)

bridgeforsale,

Be careful, while drawing water from that well. Christianity is often highly contagious.

Anna

 

[Usbek_de_Perse]

I am comfortable enough. I know the rules, so I abide by them out of respect.

But exclusion is a hard thing. I am a believer in the sacramental quality of the mass, but somehow being excluded makes it feel like this is not “real church”. The real church does not exclude. These are feelings, not statements of doctrine.

I find the reasons for exclusion to be, at minimum, weak.

 

[bridgeforsale]

I should add that I don’t think Methodist or another standard “Protestant” churches would have an issue with you doing what you do, as it is merely symbolic of the body and blood.

Lutherans, Orthodox, and Catholics are a different story.

Even if you are here to push buttons, at least you are here. You may learn something in the time you spend before you get bored.

Yeah but don’t you have to believe this stuff in order for the bread to actually turn to flesh as you’re ingesting it? I can attest to the fact that bread (including bread ingested in a Catholic Church) has never turned to flesh after I ate it

Therefore, it really shouldn’t be an insult should it? I’m not actually insulting the Eucharist since as a non-believer it can’t even be considered the Eucharist (or maybe I’m wrong on this point, if so I guess I’ll have to avoid eating it the next time someone brings me into a CC).

 

[bridgeforsale]

bridgeforsale,

Be careful, while drawing water from that well. Christianity is often highly contagious.

Anna

I was raised one, I know. But skepticism is also highly contagious

 

[Teneas]

Yeah but don’t you have to believe this stuff in order for the bread to actually turn to flesh as you’re ingesting it? I can attest to the fact that bread (including bread ingested in a Catholic Church) has never turned to flesh after I ate it

Therefore, it really shouldn’t be an insult should it? I’m not actually insulting the Eucharist since as a non-believer it can’t even be considered the Eucharist (or maybe I’m wrong on this point, if so I guess I’ll have to avoid eating the thing the next time someone drags me into a CC).

It’s an insult to the faith, the Church that we believe Christ left us with. To take the Eucharist in the Catholic Church is to profess one’s complete communion with the Church and faith.

It is body and blood even if you do not believe it to be. It becomes this during the Mass. Doesn’t matter if you believe it or not, it is what it becomes. Just because you don’t feel the flesh as you would an arm of a friend, doesn’t mean it’s not possible to actually be flesh.

From the Catechism of the Catholic Church, in other words, what we believe about it being Christ’s body.

1373 “Christ Jesus, who died, yes, who was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who indeed intercedes for us,” is present in many ways to his Church:197 in his word, in his Church’s prayer, "where two or three are gathered in my name,"199 in the poor, the sick, and the imprisoned,199 in the sacraments of which he is the author, in the sacrifice of the Mass, and in the person of the minister. But "he is present . . . most especially in the Eucharistic species."200

1374 The mode of Christ’s presence under the Eucharistic species is unique. It raises the Eucharist above all the sacraments as "the perfection of the spiritual life and the end to which all the sacraments tend."201 In the most blessed sacrament of the Eucharist "the body and blood, together with the soul and divinity, of our Lord Jesus Christ and, therefore, the whole Christ is truly, really, and substantially contained."202 "This presence is called ‘real’ - by which is not intended to exclude the other types of presence as if they could not be ‘real’ too, but because it is presence in the fullest sense: that is to say, it is a substantial presence by which Christ, God and man, makes himself wholly and entirely present."203

1375 It is by the conversion of the bread and wine into Christ’s body and blood that Christ becomes present in this sacrament. The Church Fathers strongly affirmed the faith of the Church in the efficacy of the Word of Christ and of the action of the Holy Spirit to bring about this conversion. Thus St. John Chrysostom declares:

It is not man that causes the things offered to become the Body and Blood of Christ, but he who was crucified for us, Christ himself. The priest, in the role of Christ, pronounces these words, but their power and grace are God's. This is my body, he says. This word transforms the things offered.204

And St. Ambrose says about this conversion:
Be convinced that this is not what nature has formed, but what the blessing has consecrated. The power of the blessing prevails over that of nature, because by the blessing nature itself is changed. . . . Could not Christ's word, which can make from nothing what did not exist, change existing things into what they were not before? It is no less a feat to give things their original nature than to change their nature.205

 

[Teneas]

I have an unlimited well to draw from (picking on religion is just too easy)

I would ask you this then. If picking a religion is an easy choice, why have you not found one that catered to your beliefs then?

 

[Anna_Scott]

I have an unlimited well to draw from (picking on religion is just too easy)

bridgeforsale,

Be careful, while drawing water from that well. Christianity is often highly contagious.

Anna

I was raised one, I know. But skepticism is also highly contagious

Though both could be considered “contagious,” an uncured case of skepticism can lead to death. Christianity brings life.

 

[Teneas]

I am comfortable enough. I know the rules, so I abide by them out of respect.

But exclusion is a hard thing. I am a believer in the sacramental quality of the mass, but somehow being excluded makes it feel like this is not “real church”. The real church does not exclude. These are feelings, not statements of doctrine.

I find the reasons for exclusion to be, at minimum, weak.

I will agree with you on the fact that exclusion can alienate others. But the Mass is intended for all, just that the Eucharist is to be guarded, and treasured.

There are many many others out there that will take the Eucharist for a Black Mass, and other things unholy.

Taking the Eucharist is proclaiming your belief of it’s completeness that is the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ. Claiming your belief in the truth behind the Church that protects and holds it. Yes there are others that think they have it as well.

I wish I could think of something other than it is merely a person’s own disbelief that alienates them in a Mass. Sure, there are things that can confuse and make someone uncomfortable in a Mass, specially if they have never been accustomed to our ways. I will give you that, however, I think the Christ’s own teachings were very very uncomfortable at the time to those that listened.

An “Eye for an Eye” no longer applied, instead it was “Give them your other cheek”

Truth isn’t easy to embrace, but takes digging. Until you understand it, you alienate yourselves, instead of taking your place as one of the ones that are learning. We are all learning.

 

[Anna_Scott]

Teneas,

I might need to borrow that 2 X 4, today. I just haven’t decided whether to use it on myself or someone else. I’ll just have to see how the day goes.

Anna

 

[Teneas]

Teneas,

I might need to borrow that 2 X 4, today. I just haven’t decided whether to use it on myself or someone else. I’ll just have to see how the day goes.

Anna

LOL fair enough, you can have it for a bit. I would like it back later on though, as my wife uses it to beat me sometimes.

hands over the 2x4 to Anna

 

[Anna_Scott]

LOL fair enough, you can have it for a bit. I would like it back later on though, as my wife uses it to beat me sometimes.

hands over the 2x4 to Anna

lol. I might have to side with your wife. Women do tend to stick together, as I’m sure you’ve learned. Tell her I won’t keep the 2 x 4 too long, just in case she needs it later on.

Anna

 

[jgajmom]

Personally, I am scared to death to go to mass. I just found out though that a long time friend (who also grew up in the c of C) has been thinking about the Catholic church too. Maybe if we go together, we won’t feel so alone.

 

[4Squarebaby]

Yeah but don’t you have to believe this stuff in order for the bread to actually turn to flesh as you’re ingesting it? I can attest to the fact that bread (including bread ingested in a Catholic Church) has never turned to flesh after I ate it

Therefore, it really shouldn’t be an insult should it? I’m not actually insulting the Eucharist since as a non-believer it can’t even be considered the Eucharist (or maybe I’m wrong on this point, if so I guess I’ll have to avoid eating it the next time someone brings me into a CC).

The insult is in your tone, it is textbook definition of a troll.

My pastor relays a similar story, but his personal experience was as a 4 year old boy who ate the “crackers and juice” as one long time member here says. And his father on the fly had to change the service and announce that the next week would be communion service. But he was talking of the actions of a child, who was hungry not of the make believe imagination of a troll who says he stepped forward and received a token amount of the elements during communion because he was hungry

 

[Anna_Scott]

Personally, I am scared to death to go to mass. I just found out though that a long time friend (who also grew up in the c of C) has been thinking about the Catholic church too. Maybe if we go together, we won’t feel so alone.

jgajmom,

Welcome to the forums! So, glad you are here.

Going with a friend sounds like a good idea.

I am questioning things, too. There are many wonderful Catholics, here, who will answer questions.

Anna

 

[Usbek_de_Perse]

I will agree with you on the fact that exclusion can alienate others. But the Mass is intended for all, just that the Eucharist is to be guarded, and treasured.

There are many many others out there that will take the Eucharist for a Black Mass, and other things unholy.

Taking the Eucharist is proclaiming your belief of it’s completeness that is the Body and Blood of Jesus Christ. Claiming your belief in the truth behind the Church that protects and holds it. Yes there are others that think they have it as well.

I wish I could think of something other than it is merely a person’s own disbelief that alienates them in a Mass. Sure, there are things that can confuse and make someone uncomfortable in a Mass, specially if they have never been accustomed to our ways. I will give you that, however, I think the Christ’s own teachings were very very uncomfortable at the time to those that listened.

An “Eye for an Eye” no longer applied, instead it was “Give them your other cheek”

Truth isn’t easy to embrace, but takes digging. Until you understand it, you alienate yourselves, instead of taking your place as one of the ones that are learning. We are all learning.

All baptized Christians are welcome in the Episcopal Church. This is a matter of ecclesiology, and I do understand. The RC considers itself the sole repository of the authority of the apostles given them by Jesus Christ. The Orthodox Churches believe more or less the same thing about themselves. The Episcopal Church and many others believe that they are part of the one holy, catholic, and apostolic church, without claiming exclusivity. This directly affects a church’s attitude toward communion.

I have taken communion in a RC church with the priest’s full knowledge that I was an Anglican. I have also gone to confession in a RC church, again with full disclosure, and absolution was granted.

 

[kalt]

I am comfortable enough. I know the rules, so I abide by them out of respect.

But exclusion is a hard thing. I am a believer in the sacramental quality of the mass, but somehow being excluded makes it feel like this is not “real church”. The real church does not exclude. These are feelings, not statements of doctrine.

I find the reasons for exclusion to be, at minimum, weak.

You may join in the Eucharist in the CC at any time you choose. Sometimes it’s hard to take that leap of faith and to believe–really beleive–but the door is always open.