North Carolina to Limit Bathroom Use by Birth Gender

[zz912]

Well, that opens up the question of church and state. A lot of southerners used their religious beliefs to discriminate against blacks. The Catholic Church has the right to say it should be this and we won’t allow it in the Church, but I don’t understand why that must apply to all society.

Society is harmed when it pretends that homosexuals can marry. Marriage becomes nothing more than a sexual contract for a temporary time period. Marriage is actually a lifelong union of a man and woman to raise and protect the next generation of society. Same-sex couples cannot generate children so pretending they can marry harms society because it loses the understanding of what marriage is.

To me, the transgender bathroom issue is a subset of the larger issue; where do legal protections end for those that people seem to genuinely believe were ‘born that way’. I was surprised by the vitriol that I received when I suggested that homosexuality is caused by bad parenting because I do believe there is an environmental impact and anecdotal that this evidence is, almost every gay person I know has a really messed up relationship with one or both of their parents.

I think there is something to this, as it cannot be coincidence that there are so few homosexuals with good relationships with both parents. Another poster mentioned in response that it might be that fathers/parents reject the homosexual child, which causes the bad relationship. But that’s just not plausible, because while some parents would reject/shun their child, many would not.

Of course it is not applicable to all, there are exceptions, but they are a very small minority.

I would figure that most people here would believe that the cause of homosexuality was either environmental or a choice because, if you believe someone is ‘born that way’, it becomes really hard to justify stripping their legal protections away (such as North Carolina wants to do with the transgender bathroom issue).

I don’t see why it would make it hard to justify. People are born with bad tempers, but we still expect them not to act out on their temper. And we punish them when they do act out on it. We all have some disorders in our fallen nature that make us more tempted by some sin. That doesn’t give license to sin.

 

[estesbob]

.

I don’t see why it would make it hard to justify. People are born with bad tempers, but we still expect them not to act out on their temper. And we punish them when they do act out on it. We all have some disorders in our fallen nature that make us more tempted by some sin. That doesn’t give license to sin.

I am a recovering alcoholic. I don’t spend much time trying to determine why I am an alcoholic as it is totally irrelevant- I just know that I can’t drink or bad things will happen . If I do start drinking again I seriously doubt I’m going to find any judge that will dismiss drunk Driving charges against me if my defense is “I was born that way”

 

[Crossbones]

I would counter that most homosexuals you know have messed up relationships with their parents b/c they are homosexual…not the other way around.

If there are still people out there that don’t believe the majority of homosexuals are born that way, I’m not sure what to tell you.

And the North Carolina bill does not strip anyones rights away. You don’t have a right to use whatever bathroom you want. That isn’t a right.

That’s an interesting take (messed up relationships because of homosexuality not causing homosexuality), but I believe there are a great many people (including me) that homosexuality has a psychologist component and some blame bad parenting. Here’s a link josephnicolosi.com/excerpt-from-a-parents-guide/ about how to make sure your kid isn’t a homosexual. And then there’s the therapy that corrects homosexuals.

Of course the North Carolina bill strips rights away by putting transsexual people into situations where they might end up in a violent confrontation.

 

[meltzerboy]

That’s an interesting take (messed up relationships because of homosexuality not causing homosexuality), but I believe there are a great many people (including me) that homosexuality has a psychologist component and some blame bad parenting. Here’s a link josephnicolosi.com/excerpt-from-a-parents-guide/ about how to make sure your kid isn’t a homosexual. And then there’s the therapy that corrects homosexuals.

Of course the North Carolina bill strips rights away by putting transsexual people into situations where they might end up in a violent confrontation.

Nicolosi: isn’t he that right-wing agenda doctor who advocates reparative therapy for gay people?

 

[Crossbones]

Society is harmed when it pretends that homosexuals can marry. Marriage becomes nothing more than a sexual contract for a temporary time period. Marriage is actually a lifelong union of a man and woman to raise and protect the next generation of society. Same-sex couples cannot generate children so pretending they can marry harms society because it loses the understanding of what marriage is.

I am not aware of any evidence that society is harmed by homosexual unions. I personally think that the high divorce rate of heterosexuals is a real cause of harm to society. I think that your view of society being harmed is a personal belief that cannot be backed up by evidence, but I welcome you to provide it.

I think there is something to this, as it cannot be coincidence that there are so few homosexuals with good relationships with both parents. Another poster mentioned in response that it might be that fathers/parents reject the homosexual child, which causes the bad relationship. But that’s just not plausible, because while some parents would reject/shun their child, many would not.

Of course it is not applicable to all, there are exceptions, but they are a very small minority.

There could be other things that happen that create a psychological component beyond bad parenting. Perhaps abuse. I’m sure it’s very complex, but I don’t think it’s all being ‘born that way’.

I don’t see why it would make it hard to justify. People are born with bad tempers, but we still expect them not to act out on their temper. And we punish them when they do act out on it. We all have some disorders in our fallen nature that make us more tempted by some sin. That doesn’t give license to sin.

Again, I think that there are psychological components to things like bad tempers as well. It’s not a ‘born that way’ issue. Furthermore, a bad temper uncontrolled can have detrimental affects on other people. I haven’t seen evidence that homosexual unions cause problems in other people.

 

[Crossbones]

Nicolosi: isn’t he that right-wing agenda doctor who advocates reparative therapy for gay people?

Probably. My point isn’t that I agree or disagree with him, but there are a great deal of people that do not believe that homosexuality is a result of being born that way. I do think there is a psychological component though.

 

[CatholicSooner]

That’s an interesting take (messed up relationships because of homosexuality not causing homosexuality), but I believe there are a great many people (including me) that homosexuality has a psychologist component and some blame bad parenting. Here’s a link josephnicolosi.com/excerpt-from-a-parents-guide/ about how to make sure your kid isn’t a homosexual. And then there’s the therapy that corrects homosexuals.

Of course the North Carolina bill strips rights away by putting transsexual people into situations where they might end up in a violent confrontation.

Sorry but i’m not going to waste my time reading that link. From your description it sounds very disgusting.

And what you described in your second paragraph isn’t a right

 

[Crossbones]

Sorry but i’m not going to waste my time reading that link. From your description it sounds very disgusting.

And what you described in your second paragraph isn’t a right

Some might find it disgusting, but it confirms that a great deal of people think that homosexuality is a choice and that people aren’t ‘born that way’. And the second paragraph is correct.

 

[Memaw]

Uh, violate women’s right to privacy for starters.

Seems the only time they “care” about “women’s rights” is for abortion!. They don’t seem to give a hoot about the rights of little girls or babies as well as all women. God Bless, Memaw

 

[Thorolfr]

I am a recovering alcoholic. I don’t spend much time trying to determine why I am an alcoholic as it is totally irrelevant- I just know that I can’t drink or bad things will happen . If I do start drinking again I seriously doubt I’m going to find any judge that will dismiss drunk Driving charges against me if my defense is “I was born that way”

An alcoholic who drinks might get drunk driving charges. I’m not aware of any bad things that happen to gay people who aren’t celibate, especially if they practice safe-sex or are monogamous and avoid sexually transmitted diseases. But those precautions are the same ones required of straight couples who want to avoid STDs.

 

[Crossbones]

I am a recovering alcoholic. I don’t spend much time trying to determine why I am an alcoholic as it is totally irrelevant- I just know that I can’t drink or bad things will happen . If I do start drinking again I seriously doubt I’m going to find any judge that will dismiss drunk Driving charges against me if my defense is “I was born that way”

I don’t think this is equivalent. Drunk driving is actually measurably harmful for society. And, while some may show a tendency to be prone to addiction, I don’t think any alcoholic can really say they were ‘born that way.’

 

[FollowChrist34]

Back to bathrooms. My problem is much more with locker rooms, dressing rooms, than with private stall bathrooms. I feel there is an invasion of privacy by allowing males into female locker rooms or vice versa. It makes many people feel intimidated and uncomfortable, not just the transgender individual. Many of these women are afraid to say anything because of social pressure to conform to political correctness. (My guess is a fair number of men feel the same way. There is a sort of undermining of natural masculinity in our culture - a forced feminization) I also question if we are even effectively accommodating the transgender individual in this situation. We are creating an awkward, intimidating atmosphere for everyone. (I am experiencing this personally; I am not speculating.) Why do we slight the rights of the majority to privacy and relative security for the sake of the few - who, frankly, are often every bit as uncomfortable.

The more significant issue is the danger this presents, not from transgender persons but from sexual predators. By normalizing the concept that men can enter women’s restrooms, we encourage unstable or violent predatory behavior - filming of women, potential stalkers, etc. We greatly increase the possibility of assault or rape of women and children. By way of analogy, if everyone carries a weapon, does this increase the chance of a violent incident involving guns, or does it not have any effect at all? Let’s be consistent here. We are talking about very private areas where people are vulnerable, cannot get to an exit quickly, and pretty unguarded - taking care of very personal business.

BTW, the Target petition is just short of 900,000. Will it hit a million? It just might.

 

[CatholicSooner]

I don’t think this is equivalent. Drunk driving is actually measurably harmful for society. And, while some may show a tendency to be prone to addiction, I don’t think any alcoholic can really say they were ‘born that way.’

I’m pretty sure you could show how same sex marriages are a harm to society. If everyone was a homosexual, the human race would die out.

And it has been proven that alcoholism is a genetic trait

 

[tomarin]

Some might find it disgusting, but it confirms that a great deal of people think that homosexuality is a choice and that people aren’t ‘born that way’. And the second paragraph is correct.

I would have to say that based on my conversations with homosexuals it isn’t a choice. They just don’t get aroused by people of the opposite sex.

 

[Sarcelle]

So is having red hair or blue eyes also sacred?

Being human and being made in the image of God is sacred. Race is incidental.

 

[Crossbones]

I’m pretty sure you could show how same sex marriages are a harm to society. If everyone was a homosexual, the human race would die out.

And it has been proven that alcoholism is a genetic trait

The Church would call on them to be celibate, so the result would be the same.

 

[irishpatrick]

And Target stock went up today. Other companies boycotted by AFA include Microsoft, Pepsi, Time Warner, Disney… In other words, these boycotts rarely have a real impact.

The difference with this boycott is that people are truly outraged and they do have viable choices outside of Target. There are almost 900,000 signatures on the boycott pledge…I am sure it will break 1,000,000 within a few days. Try to imagine how many more millions are represented by those who did take the pledge–it is well known that those taking action are only a small fraction of those who feel the same way.

I will be quite surprised if this does not impact Target’s bottom line–of course, I also will not be surprised if that is never reported.

 

[FollowChrist34]

The difference with this boycott is that people are truly outraged and they do have viable choices outside of Target. There are almost 900,000 signatures on the boycott pledge…I am sure it will break 1,000,000 within a few days. Try to imagine how many more millions are represented by those who did take the pledge–it is well known that those taking action are only a small fraction of those who feel the same way.

I will be quite surprised if this does not impact Target’s bottom line–of course, I also will not be surprised if that is never reported.

I signed it - but I don’t go to Target, so no skin off my nose. I do think a lot of these people will continue to shop there. Of course some won’t. But, again, and I am just repeating this comment because I think it is so important for dealing with these conflicts in society - I think it is better to approach management calmly, civilly and explain your concerns as a customer. It is so much easier just to sign an anonymous petition than to go face to face with the local store manager (who very likely probably agrees with you). If a million customers did this, Target would…change its policy. I guarantee it.

We cannot constantly be at war against each other in society. It hurts us all. There is a good argument against cross bathroom use. Let’s act like civil human beings about it.

 

[Thorolfr]

I signed it - but I don’t go to Target, so no skin off my nose.

Probably a lot of people who are signing this petition don’t shop at Target. Target probably knows who its shoppers are and that their new bathroom policies won’t have much impact on their bottom line.

 

[FollowChrist34]

Probably a lot of people who are signing this petition don’t shop at Target. Target probably knows who its shoppers are and that their new bathroom policies won’t have much impact on their bottom line.

I thought Target was about middle class families, that sort of thing, rural areas. Why do you suppose this policy would not upset them? I think it makes much more sense that it would, just going by demographics. And I do think a million signatures is a statement, whether it is Target, Alaska Airlines or whatever. It’s anger, legitimate anger.