North Carolina to Limit Bathroom Use by Birth Gender

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Polyamorous relationships are not promiscuous. It’s not like having sex with virtual strangers since the people in the relationship are committed to each other. To me, it seems comparable to polygyny, a very old form of relationship practiced by most of the Biblical patriarchs, some Muslims who can afford to have more than one wife, and many people in Africa. The difference is that it is much more egalitarian and less patriarchal than polygyny.
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You know we have become quite the advocates in the USA for the principle of equal rights and as we see with women… I can’t see how this promotes the concept nor encourages self respect or self esteem?
 
GaryTaylor said:
You know we have become quite the advocates in the USA for the principle of equal rights and as we see with women… I can’t see how this promotes the concept nor encourages self respect or self esteem?
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Rights does not always equal self-respect or self-esteem. It merely condones an activity that can be devoid of any sense of respect, esteem or right and wrong. Sex with anonymous partners means mutually agreed (usually) forms of sex that do not require any commitment or knowledge of the other person.

Self-respect means acknowledging forms of personal and private conduct, and public conduct. People watch other people. What we do in public reflects on us and is observed by others. Some people imitate the conduct of others.

Self-esteem is an appropriate sense of your personal sense of being. For Catholics, we gauge our personal, God-given feelings of self worth and esteem based on a properly formed conscience and a correct sense of ego. We matter because we know we matter, that God loves us, and we know if we are acting according to our proper human nature based on our circumstances. Feeling good about good grades or an achievement that was for a good end shows our self-esteem and personal confidence in action.

An inappropriate sense of self-respect and self-esteem can occur when the goal is power and control over others without an appropriate consideration of their rights.

Ed
 
Thorolfr said:
Animals and children can’t give informed consent, so that is not comparable to adults in a polyamorous relationship.
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Then you support laws requiring parental consent when a minor is seeking an abortion?
 
Rights does not always equal self-respect or self-esteem
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In this case it does, a 15 year old is still not an adult and is in the growth process of cognitive development. I highly doubt one can even make a rational choice in such a case and my points stand with self esteem and respect. Its a mental heath horror show in short, and places others in a subservient role. It further creates issues with the other women and places a male in some odd elevated position… In this case rights neglected neglects not only the 15 year olds self esteem and respect but the other women also. And to what avail.
Rights does not always equal self-respect or self-esteem. It merely condones an activity that can be devoid of any sense of respect, esteem or right and wrong. Sex with anonymous partners means mutually agreed (usually) forms of sex that do not require any commitment or knowledge of the other person.
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Thanks
 
Monkey1976 said:
Then you support laws requiring parental consent when a minor is seeking an abortion?
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Yes, I would support laws requiring parental consent for any medical procedure done by a minor within reason. I know that some religious groups do not believe in using certain medical procedures (blood transfusions, for example) and sometimes endanger the life of a child as a result.
 
GaryTaylor said:
In this case it does, a 15 year old is still not an adult and is in the growth process of cognitive development.
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for some maybe. For some maybe not.

So how about incest, you must see nothing wrong with it right? two consenting adults. Doesn’t affect you. OK right?
 
CatholicSooner said:
for some maybe. For some maybe not.

So how about incest, you must see nothing wrong with it right? two consenting adults. Doesn’t affect you. OK right?
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Some maybe what? A 15 yo as I said is in the process of cognitive development, simply put not an adult. Your second sentence has nothing to do with my conversation, don’t know what your talking about or what gave you that impression?
 
GaryTaylor said:
Some maybe what? A 15 yo as I said is in the process of cognitive development, simply put not an adult. Your second sentence has nothing to do with my conversation, don’t know what your talking about or what gave you that impression?
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Some 15 year olds could be mature and developed enough to actually give consent. Obviously there is debate about this as different states and countries have different legal age of consent

My other comment was more directed at anyone that is pro polygamy, etc
 
CatholicSooner said:
Some 15 year olds could be mature and developed enough to actually give consent. Obviously there is debate about this as different states and countries have different legal age of consent

My other comment was more directed at anyone that is pro polygamy, etc
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Well, imho it really has nothing to do with giving consent, its the ability in development to comprehend this philosophy and the consequence of consent. And as I contend you not only are trampling someones rights your inhibiting their growth in this realm. Its inhibiting independence, self reliance, self esteem, self respect. In a word its stunting a childs growth and quite possibly will enhance other behaviors. Personally I think its absurd and I highly doubt the legality has anything to do with todays understanding of behavior opposed to yesteryear.
 
The following is directed at no one in particular, but is directed to parents in general:

Our children are not birds who leave the nest at adulthood. They are our kids until the day we die.

Kids that become adults are not automatically given powers and abilities or good/common sense.

Regarding sex. They are not, never, ever to be treated as autonomous - who cares what they do? - beings.

The LIE - LIE - that is constantly being sold to parents is: "Oh, your kids will become sexually active so don’t get in the way of it. YOU CAN’T STOP THEM or say a single word to change this. - LIE -

Right now, according to the CDC, there is an STD Epidemic going on in this country. But that’s OK, because sex perverts want lots of sex partners and if children are not taught the value of sex and the value of real relationships, who pays? They do, and we do.

It’s good for business. Buy this Pill, or foam or IUD and keep having lots of sex. And when you get HIV/AIDS from your anonymous partner, take this medication. Or hepatitis or genital herpes. And keep having sex. Because having sex is better and worth the risk of becoming sterile for life or getting a life-threatening illness.

Sure, change your sexual appearance through surgery. According to the APA, it’s not a problem unless, and only, if the idea bothers you.

And court orders to let boys who think they are girls to use the girls’ restroom? That is the definition of insanity. Anyone who believes a kid, who has no concept of adult sexuality or is mentally or emotionally prepared to deal with it, is not being helped by reinforcing a phase or delusion.

Reality is reality. Don’t mess with it because total strangers insist “We will mold reality to what we want and like and force you, by court order if necessary, to agree with it.”

It is not good for kids, parents or society as a whole to swallow this/accept this or be neutral about it. Much less support it.

Ed
 
Exactly, its not easy and anyone who has children will tell you. Its a fine line of challenging the kids thinking and being supportive at the same time while keeping the adult/teen relationship in perspective. Its very easy to be friends and lose the adult/teen relationship and in essence a negative contract develops, to enable behavior here would likely result in that pattern. This is exactly what happens with sex. You accept it and you have a negative contract then. Its very difficult to change your position and doesn’t work well.

Teens think in relative terms and we see some of it here, they may not accept a fact as the truth. You know how they want to argue about everything, what is happening they are developing and may consider your thinking relative at some point. As we see just from this conversation social situations can have different interpretations depending on one’s point of view, and its important to be direct, clear and firm in your own in regards to the teens.

But with the situations described its basic exploitation. You have a small window of time with children and have to think of it in terms of making the best of those moments.
 
edwest2 said:
The following is directed at no one in particular, but is directed to parents in general:

Our children are not birds who leave the nest at adulthood. They are our kids until the day we die.

Kids that become adults are not automatically given powers and abilities or good/common sense.

Regarding sex. They are not, never, ever to be treated as autonomous - who cares what they do? - beings.

The LIE - LIE - that is constantly being sold to parents is: "Oh, your kids will become sexually active so don’t get in the way of it. YOU CAN’T STOP THEM or say a single word to change this. - LIE -

Right now, according to the CDC, there is an STD Epidemic going on in this country. But that’s OK, because sex perverts want lots of sex partners and if children are not taught the value of sex and the value of real relationships, who pays? They do, and we do.

It’s good for business. Buy this Pill, or foam or IUD and keep having lots of sex. And when you get HIV/AIDS from your anonymous partner, take this medication. Or hepatitis or genital herpes. And keep having sex. Because having sex is better and worth the risk of becoming sterile for life or getting a life-threatening illness.

Sure, change your sexual appearance through surgery. According to the APA, it’s not a problem unless, and only, if the idea bothers you.

And court orders to let boys who think they are girls to use the girls’ restroom? That is the definition of insanity. Anyone who believes a kid, who has no concept of adult sexuality or is mentally or emotionally prepared to deal with it, is not being helped by reinforcing a phase or delusion.

Reality is reality. Don’t mess with it because total strangers insist “We will mold reality to what we want and like and force you, by court order if necessary, to agree with it.”

It is not good for kids, parents or society as a whole to swallow this/accept this or be neutral about it. Much less support it.

Ed
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good post
 
Anybody see the reports that Caitlyn Jenner is having regrets and may detransition?

shocker
 
Thorolfr said:
Polyamorous relationships are not promiscuous. It’s not like having sex with virtual strangers since the people in the relationship are committed to each other. To me, it seems comparable to polygyny, a very old form of relationship practiced by most of the Biblical patriarchs, some Muslims who can afford to have more than one wife, and many people in Africa. The difference is that it is much more egalitarian and less patriarchal than polygyny.
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I didn’t say polyamorous relationships were promiscuous. But I wouldn’t doubt if practitioners of such relationships are or have been.

Polygamy is not the ideal but I think in ancient societies it provided a certain justice for women. The modern welfare state has eliminated the need for any justice provided by polygamy. Ancient polygamy provided care for women and their children, which are a natural consequence of sex that is avoided in modern times.
 
Maximilan_Kolbe said:
Since the rules of what is okay are a bit ad hoc, who said informed consent is relevant?

I.e., what about folks who believe informed consent is not required or matters at all?
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Excellent point.

Who says that consent is required for sex?
 
From yesterday’s Guardian:
If you search out North Carolina’s conservative heart, you might find it here: in Fayetteville at the Maxway, a discount shop.
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Fayetteville is home to the sprawling Fort Bragg army base and consistently votes Republican. Maxway is owned by Art Pope, a conservative philanthropist who is arguably the most influential figure in state politics.
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So, has the ongoing agony over bathrooms thrown the customers and employees of Maxway into confusion?
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“Oh, goodness. Well, we do have two bathrooms,” said Camelia Taylor, the store manager. “But one is marked for either men or women. The other is for employees, but we pretty much let anyone use it.”
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That’s a typical response among North Carolinians. Life among the sinks and stalls of the state has carried on unchanged, in actual practice. Transgender people aren’t attacking children. Citizens aren’t rising up with torches and pitchforks.
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Theory is another matter, though. Politicians in the Old North State are describing to their constituents a theory of bathroom chaos that seems entirely uncoupled from both the practice and the attitudes of most people.
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theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/14/north-carolina-bathroom-bill-hb2-transgender-rights
 
clem456 said:
Yes, sensible people find ways to use the bathroom. 🤷
Does this amaze you?

But, the real problem is the deceit being forced on people.
We have the federal government forcing a people to acknowledge something that has no more validity than my religious tagline.
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Is issue is far more school locker and shower facilities than it is public restrooms. Take note that the current regime’s dictate was to schools, not the local supermarket ( though one can be sure that’s coming because progressivism does not tolerate dissent.)

Jon
 
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