Not the same God?

  • Thread starter Thread starter hellokitty
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Originally Posted by Dale_M
Both Muslims and Christians worship the same God, the God of Abraham
.
I don’t believe that for a New York minute. 😉
I don’t think Dale M is Catholic?

Muslims reject Jesus divinity nor do they worship the Word of God incarnate.

I think one would find it difficult to get a Muslim to agree that they the Muslims worship the same God as Christians and Jews, let alone the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

Because Muslims “profess” to be from Abrahams son Ishmael, does not make them possess the faith of Abraham from the circumcision covenant, which Muslims do not believe in Abrahams faith.

Muslims “profess” to be of the faith of Abraham.

Abraham only was given one son of the promise in his descendant (singular) Jesus. It was not given to Muhammed.
 
I don’t believe your analogy is comparable in any way to saying that Jesus is both God and NOT God. That is a contradiction. I agree there are many things Jesus said that are interpreted differently within Christian faith traditions. That does not, however, change who Jesus IS. All Christians affirm that Jesus is the only begotten Son of God, God of God, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, who was conceived by the Holy Spirit, suffered under Pontius Piate, died, rose, and will come again. This is affirmed universally. This gets to the question of who Jesus is, not what he said or how it’s to be seen. Muslims deny ALL of the above. So in what sense is it the “same” God?
Ok, Your right! If the Criteria for believing in the same God is restricted to Who Jesus is and not what He has done, I’ll clearify!

Let’s look at what isn’t held universally between Christians. I’ll give you one such example!

Here is a famous Evangelical preacher (Greg Laurie) talking about Jesus, would you say that he does not believe in the same God, by his statements?

“here was Jesus in that unique and never to be repeated **blending of humanity and deity in one person **.”

Talking about Jesus again Greg Laurie said “a unique unparalleled intermingling of deity and unblemished humanity in Jesus.

This would make Greg Laurie a Monophysite. The mingling/blending of the two natures into one is also known as Eutychianism.

So does Greg Laurie, not believe in the same God as other Christians?
His error after all is Christological in nature!

His own words convict him of Monophysitism which is deemed Heresy, by the only Church that has the God given right to declare heresy!

I wonder if when (God willing) Greg Laurie stands before the Judgement seat if God says " I’m Sorry Greg, you believed in Monophysitism and that is Heresy, there was no commingling of diety and Humanity, therefore you believed in a man made God and not the One True God"

I know this diverges from the main topic of “Are Allah and God the Same” , but I fell it is applicable.

Is Christology able to be proven by the bible alone?
Can you disprove Monophysitism, Ebionism, Nestorianism, Arianism, Monothelitism, Miaphysitism from the bible alone?

If Christology can not be proved by the bible alone, and the host of other Christological views can not be disproved from the bible alone, then why should any non-catholic be bound to believe the Catholic Tradition on Christology?
 
.

I don’t think Dale M is Catholic?

Muslims reject Jesus divinity nor do they worship the Word of God incarnate.

I think one would find it difficult to get a Muslim to agree that they the Muslims worship the same God as Christians and Jews, let alone the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

Because Muslims “profess” to be from Abrahams son Ishmael, does not make them possess the faith of Abraham from the circumcision covenant, which Muslims do not believe in Abrahams faith.

Muslims “profess” to be of the faith of Abraham.

Abraham only was given one son of the promise in his descendant (singular) Jesus. It was not given to Muhammed.
Why? What would be harder to get a Jew to accept Christ then a Muslim? I do not understand? Jews were given ears that do not hear, and eyes that do not see.

Muslims profess to be the faith of Abrahaam. Do not Christians PROFESS the same thing? Do not Jews PROFESS the same thing.

Do we not all PROFESS the same thing? Is this not what we are arguing about?

It seems here what people are saying because they say one thing and do another makes the God of Abraham false.

So now the RCC PROFESS the faith of Abraham, PROFESS the TRINITY, and then teach a different teaching then Abraham had revealed to him Our faith is false also?

I will NEVER get you guys on this reasoning! Neverl

A false prophet who uses the ONE TRUE GOD to lead others away from the ONE TRUE GOD will never change the truth of the ONE TRUE GOD. Not Ever!

And because the Muslims are not given the truth because of no fault of their own it make the God they pray to false?:confused:

Again Maybe you can answer what I asked over and over and never got a answer.

There are Protestants who REUSE Christ in the Eucharist? WHY? Because they do not have the fulllness of the truth.

Is the CHRIST the Eucharist false because of the truth they either were not given. or refuse to accept false.

Convince me of that, And you got me.🤷
 
But Mickey where does what YOU believe have anything to do with this?
There are millions more who believe this way. Here is but one example:

…the same God who reveals Himself by nature also reveals Himself supernaturally. Among other things, He revealed that the Divine Essence is in three consubstantial Persons. So, supposing we insert this false note in our definition of God: “God is not a Trinity.” Do we have the True God?
I think not.
Brother André Marie (Catholic Monk)
 
There are millions more who believe this way. Here is but one example:

…the same God who reveals Himself by nature also reveals Himself supernaturally. Among other things, He revealed that the Divine Essence is in three consubstantial Persons. So, supposing we insert this false note in our definition of God: “God is not a Trinity.” Do we have the True God?
I think not.
Brother André Marie (Catholic Monk)
Amen!

The JWs get it wrong when they deny the Trinity.

But when they say that the Sacred Scriptures are the Word of God, we give them a 👍
 
Thank you; I believe the CCC addresses Muslims distinct from the religion of Islam.

Islam originally defined means “surrender” to God. This battle cry Muhommed made to the Arab tribes who believed in multiplicity of spirits were forced to convert to one God or die.

Islam removed the Arab tribes false (innumerable) spirit gods into believing in only one God.

**Muslim is a person **who follows Islam which is a “surrendering to God” in practice.

Muhammed did well in removing false idol worship from the Arabs in surrendering to one God.

Muhammed’s Koran corrects the Tora by replacing Abrahams son Isaac to be sacrificed with Ishmael among many other corrections of the old testament introduced by Muhammed Koran.

How did the first writers of the old testament God get it wrong and Muhammed thousands of years later get it right? Was the first God not God? Or is Muhammed God greater than the old testament God who got it wrong?

Muhammed started out good by “converting” Arabs from their error. But then Muhammed introduced his “governing” of people and conquering, Islam now becomes an Imperial religion. A diabolical combination of secular power mixed with his new founded religion, which is a repeat of many fallen historical powerful empires which eventually met their demise, biblically speaking those who follow this path will continue to achieve greatness and ultimately fall.

I find the Kaba very interesting in Islam, the large black holy stone which symbols the presence of the divine. Some have traced this black stone originally to be a meteorite the size of a bowling ball. I have yet to see the significance of how God revealed himself or is present at this black stone?

The disposition of the Muslims to our creator is to be acknowledged. Although this is revealed in an outer expression, only God knows and judges the inner heart of man. Which I think the CCC is addressing the disposition of the Muslim towards God our creator.

Islam on the other hand denies or rejects the revelation of God from the trinity. Catholicism and Islam reveal two different revelations of God. From these revelations reveal distinct belief’s in God. Catholicism reveals to be son’s of God, Islam reveals to be slaves of God. Catholics rightly call God “Abba, Father”, Muslims relate to the creator as “Allah”.

Catholics and Muslims and all of humanity express their faith in our Creator together from our humanity in one way or another, the CCC reveals this to be a positive. The CCC encourages this as a way to ecumenical dialogue and friendship, which is needed. Our differing revelations of God should not be a means of destroying one another, but allow us to communicate.

Catholicism loves her enemies, Islam hates it’s enemies. In here reveals ones service to God.

Catholicism and Islam have differing views of the revelation of God. Because these views contradict one another, from their own revelations when compared side by side, reveals that one God does not exist or one God is a deciever.

The point I make is that the CCC is addressing the humanity and disposition of the Muslim not the ideologies of Islam’s diety. Our ideologies of God differ with Islam. Our humanity together recognize one God to be our creator.
It’s all a spectrum of truth, Gabriel. Some have the fullness of Truth, some have partial truth, and some have shadows and images of the God who remains unknown but is near.

Picture a numberline. Catholicism is on the far right. Satan is on the far left. (Heh. Don’t read any political statements into that. :D). Non-Catholic religions are on the right. Atheism is on the left. Muslims are a bit closer to the right, followed by Judaism.

It’s all a spectrum.
 
2John 1:9
Whosoever revolteth, and continueth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God.
 
rinnie;8917791][But the point of the matter does not change. The point is as you stated the faith in our creator, The one and only true God.
What does the One and Only Creator have to do with the differnt views of the One and Only creator the ONE GOD?
Everything; it starts and ends with Jesus.

All I am addressing is the CCC does not state that Catholicism and Islam are the same God.

The CCC addresses that Muslims believe in one creator God, who profess to have the faith of Abraham because Abraham believed in One creator God. Together with us, for we are all created by One True God.

The CCC does not go into defining the ideologies of Islam’s God is believing in the same God as Catholic Christians.

The CCC teaches all humanity along with us seek out our creator in the one God. It does not go into each of those Middle Eastern Islam definition of God nor the Asian religions definition of God as being the same God as the Catholic Church.

Posters possess the freedom to ecumencially dialogue the revelations of each ones religion beginning with what we have in common first One creator God of the humanity and all of creation, One God who judges in the end.

Anything subject matter over and beyond other than what the CCC teaches leaves it up to the faithful to dialogue and pursue ecumenical efforts to peacefully resolve and or conclude each ones position of God.

Peace be with you
[/quote]
 
Again what does this have to do with Muslims having a false God? The statement is made that muslims because they cannot see God in the Trinity have a false God.

And it was also made of the Jews.

I don’t think anyone would every disagree that the devil believes in God. For goodness sake who would know more.

The devil himself was a fallen angel.
Well I was going somewhere else with that scripture; but sense you bring up again.

If the devils believe in the one true God, but reject the salvation plan of God through Jesus Christ for our humanity.

Islam also believes in the one true God, the same as the demons do, who reject the salvation plan of God through Jesus Christ for our humanity.

Are you making the claim that the CCC teaches that the same God Islam teaches is the same God of the Catholic Church, from the revelations each one recieved?

Can you show me where the CCC teaches this? The CCC addresses Muslims profess the faith of Abraham (in one God), it does not define what this faith is, other than faith in one God. The CCC does not address Islam revelations of God to be the same God Catholics believe in.

It would appear that the CCC is silent on Islam teachings of God. But reveals the faith of the Muslim in the one creator God from the same faith Abraham had in one God.

When Muslims profess to have faith in one God, just as Abraham believed in one God. We journey along this road with the Muslims and end with them in the final judgement of one God. Everything in between Islam reveals of their God is not mentioned in the CCC only the profession of Muslims faith of Abraham in one God.
 
Indeed. However, it is possible for the Christian understanding of God to be accurate while the Muslim understanding of God is imperfect and contains errors.

Both Muslims and Christians worship the same God, the God of Abraham. However, the Muslim understanding is flawed.
Sorry, could not find a better source…but this is for starters…answering-islam.org/Shamoun/god.htm

The Holy Bible teaches that God cannot be tempted by evil and neither tempts anyone with evil; evil being understood as referring to immorality and sin. James 1:13 (c.f. Psalm 5:4-5; Habakkuk 1:13)

Yet, the Quran teaches that Allah is the author of evil:

Verily, the hypocrites seek to deceive Allah, but it is He Who deceives them. And when they stand up for As-Salat (the prayer), they stand with laziness and to be seen of men, and they do not remember Allah but little. S. 4:142 Hilali-Khan
And (the unbelievers) schemed and planned, and Allah schemed also, and the best of schemers is Allah. S. 3:54

Are they then secure from Allah’s scheme (makra Allahi)? None deemeth himself secure from Allah’s scheme (makra Allahi) save folk that perish. S. 7:99 Pickthall

Remember how the unbelievers schemed against thee, to keep thee in bonds, or to slay thee, or get thee out (of thy home). They scheme and plot, but the best of schemers is Allah. S. 8:30

And when We make people taste of mercy after an affliction touches them, lo! they devise schemes (makrun) against Our communication. Say: Allah is quicker to scheme (makran); surely Our apostles write down what you plan. S. 10:21

And those before them did indeed scheme (makara), but all scheming (al-makru) is Allah’s; He knows what every soul earns, and the unbelievers shall come to know for whom is the (better) issue of the abode. S. 13:42

So they schemed a scheme: and We schemed a scheme, while they perceived not. S. 27:50

The term for scheme in Arabic is makara which denotes one who is a deceiver, one who is conniving, a schemer. It is always used in a negative sense. Allah is thus seen as the best of deceivers, the premiere schemer and conniving one.

This is not simply a Christian perspective but one thoroughly endorsed by Muslim theologians as well.

According to the Quran Allah reveals a verse only to have it canceled out a short time later:

None of Our revelations do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten but We substitute something better or similar- Knowest thou not that Allah has power over all things? S. 2:106
When We substitute one revelation for another- and Allah knowest best what He reveals (in stages)- They say, “Thou art but a forger”; But most of them understand not. S. 16:101

This leaves us with the difficulty of having a God who does not remain consistent and often changes his revealed purpose. This being the case, how is one to know that the promises of such a Being in regards to eternal security can be trusted? Just as he changes his mind in relation to the revelation, he can also decide to change his mind in regards to the believer’s ultimate destiny without anything stopping him from doing so.

This is different from Yahweh of the Holy Bible who does not change and as such can be totally trusted in fulfilling all his promises:

God is not a man that he should lie, nor a son of man that he should repent. Has he said, and will he not do? Or has he spoken, and will he not make it good? Numbers 23:19
For I, Yahweh, do not change. Malachi 3:6

If we are faithless, he remains faithful; he cannot deny himself. 2 Timothy 2:13

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Hebrews 13:8

Because the God of the Bible is immutable he can promise, “Heaven and earth will pass away but my words will never pass away” (Matthew 24:35).

Two responses can possibly be presented and often are by Muslims. The first is the fact that abrogation is not referring to the Quran but to previous scriptures such as the Bible.

Unfortunately for the Muslims making this argument, this interpretation cannot be defended in light of S. 87:6-8:

By degrees shall We teach thee (Muhammad) to declare (the Message) so thou shalt not forget, except as Allah Wills: For He knoweth what is manifest and what is hidden. And We will make it easy for thee (to follow) the simple (Path).
It becomes obvious that certain parts of the revelation given to Muhammad will eventually be caused to be forgotten, since Allah later willed it.

The second response often presented is that the Bible clearly speaks of God regretting to create man or having repented of bringing on a certain disaster which he had planned to do. (c.f. Genesis 6:6; Exodus 32:14)

There are basically two responses for this assumed Muslim allegation. First, both the Holy Bible and the Quran use anthropomorphic language in describing both the nature and acts of God. For instance, both books speak of God’s eyes, hands and feet without implying that these things are to be taken literally. The purpose of using such language is to communicate certain incomprehensible truths of God in human language in order for man to grasp certain realities of the divine nature. Hence, statements such as God having regrets is used to communicate certain realities to man in relational terms, i.e. that God identifies with our human condition and grieves for man’s fallen state, having compassion for him.

"
 
2John 1:9
Whosoever revolteth, and continueth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God.
Catholics give a hearty :amen: to this.

Our Jewish brethren, even though they deny the Trinity, too, are called our elder brothers in the faith.

What does this say about Muslims, who also together with us adore the one God who is merciful and judges all?
 
Are you making the claim that the CCC teaches that the same God Islam teaches is the same God of the Catholic Church, from the revelations each one recieved?
What Catholics must affirm is that the God that Muslims adore together with us, is the One merciful God who is Creator and Judge.

When they proclaim that God is transcendent and not part of creation, we can give them a high five.

When they give Allah the 99 names, we can high five them on lots of them!


  1. *]Ar-Rahman 1 The All-Merciful
    *]Ar-Rahim 2 The All-Beneficient
    *]Al-Malik 3 The Absolute Ruler
    *]Al-Quddus 4 The Pure One
    *]As-Salam 5 The Source of Peace
    *]Al-Mu’min 6 The Inspirer of Faith
    *]Al-Muhaymin 7 The Guardian
    *]Al-’Aziz 8 The Victorious
    *]Al-Jabbar 9 The Compeller
    *]Al-Mutakabbir 10 The Greatest
    *]Al-Khaliq 11 The Creator
    *]Al-Bari’ 12 The Maker of Order
    *]Al-Musawwir 13 The Shaper of Beauty
    *]Al-Ghaffar 14 The Forgiving
    *]Al-Qahhar 15 The Subduer
    *]Al-Wahhab 16 The Giver of All
    *]Ar-Razzaq 17 The Sustainer
    *]Al-Fattah 18 The Opener
    *]Al-’Alim 19 The Knower of All
    *]Al-Qabid 20 The Constrictor
 
It’s all a spectrum of truth, Gabriel. Some have the fullness of Truth, some have partial truth, and some have shadows and images of the God who remains unknown but is near.

Picture a numberline. Catholicism is on the far right. Satan is on the far left. (Heh. Don’t read any political statements into that. :D). Non-Catholic religions are on the right. Atheism is on the left. Muslims are a bit closer to the right, followed by Judaism.

It’s all a spectrum.
I understand what your grabbing at here; The measuring of ones religion in the revelations of God becomes a topic of debate. What we are talking about whether or not if Islam worships the same God as Christians. The CCC does not deal with this topic. Only the faith of Muslims professing the faith of Abraham in one God.

Scripture possesses the canon for which the Catholic Church is to measure all religions of the world, whether they be of God or not;

2 John 7 Many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh; such is the deceitful one and the antichrist. 9 **Anyone who is so “progressive” as not to remain in the teaching of the Christ does not have God; whoever remains in the teaching has the Father and the Son. **10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him in your house or even greet him;
11 for whoever greets him shares in his evil works.

1 Timothy 6; 3 Whoever teaches something different and does not agree with the sound words of our Lord Jesus Christ and the religious teaching
4 is conceited, understanding nothing, and has a morbid disposition for arguments and verbal disputes. From these come envy, rivalry, insults, evil suspicions,
5 and mutual friction among people with corrupted minds, who are deprived of the truth, supposing religion to be a means of gain.
6 Indeed, religion with contentment is a great gain.

2 Peter 2: 1 There were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will introduce destructive heresies and even deny the Master who ransomed them, bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2 Many will follow their licentious ways, and because of them the way of truth will be reviled.
3 In their greed they will exploit you with fabrications, but from of old their condemnation has not been idle and their destruction does not sleep.

1John 2: 18 Children, it is the last hour; 9 and just as you heard that the antichrist was coming, so now many antichrists have appeared. Thus we know this is the last hour.
20 But you have the anointing that comes from the holy one, 11 and you all have knowledge.
22 **Who is the liar? Whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Whoever denies the Father and the Son, this is the antichrist. **23 **No one who denies the Son has the Father, but whoever confesses the Son has the Father as well. 24 Let what you heard from the beginning remain in you. If what you heard from the beginning remains in you, then you will remain in the Son and in the Father.25 And this is the promise that he made us: eternal life. **26 I write you these things about those who would deceive you.

1 John 4: 1 **Beloved, do not trust every spirit but test the spirits to see whether they belong to God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
2 This is how you can know the Spirit of God: every spirit that acknowledges Jesus Christ come in the flesh be longs to God, **3 **and every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus 2 does not belong to God. This is the spirit of the antichrist that, as you heard, is to come, but in fact is already in the world. **

4 You belong to God, children, and you have conquered them, for the one who is in you is greater than the one who is in the world.
5 They belong to the world; accordingly, their teaching belongs to the world, and the world listens to them.
6We belong to God, and anyone who knows God listens to us, while anyone who does not belong to God refuses to hear us. This is how we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of deceit.


Galatians 1: 6** I am amazed that you are so quickly forsaking the one who called you by (the) grace (of Christ) for a different gospel
7 (not that there is another). But there are some who are disturbing you and wish to pervert the gospel of Christ.
8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach (to you) a gospel other than the one that we preached to you, let that one be accursed! 9 As we have said before, and now I say again, if anyone preaches to you a gospel other than the one that you received, let that one be accursed! 11 Now I want you to know, brothers, that the gospel preached by me is not of human origin.
12 For I did not receive it from a human being, nor was I taught it, but it came through a revelation of Jesus Christ. **
 
Everything in between Islam reveals of their God is not mentioned in the CCC only the profession of Muslims faith of Abraham in one God.
Here are some characteristics of God that Islam has revealed:


  1. *]Wal-Ikram 85 The Lord of Majesty and Bounty
    *]Al-Muqsit 86 The Equitable One
    *]Al-Jami 87 The Gatherer
    *]Al-Ghani 88 The Rich One
    *]Al-Mughni 89 The Enricher
    *]Al-Mani’ 90 The Preventer of Harm
    *]Ad-Darr 91 The Creator of The Harmful
    *]An-Nafi 92 The Creator of Good
    *]An-Nur 93 The Light
    *]Al-Hadi 94 The Guide
    *]Al-Badi 95 The Originator
    *]Al-Baqi 96 The Everlasting One
    *]Al-Warith 97 The Inheritor of All
    *]Ar-Rashid 98 The Righteous Teacher
    *]As-Sabur 99 The Patient One

    With the exception of , perhaps #7, would you say that Catholics can give a 👍 to this revelation from the Koran?
 
:mad:
PRmerger;8918723]What Catholics must affirm is that the God that Muslims adore together with us, is the One merciful God who is Creator and Judge
.

The CCC addresses the Muslim’s faith professed in Abraham not Islam here.

I can appreciate your sincere ecumenical dialogue here; but Catholics are not the problem. Try convincing Muslims “who must affirm” that the one God they profess in the one God of Abraham is the same God who became flesh in Jesus Christ.
When they proclaim that God is transcendent and not part of creation, we can give them a high five.
Amen, as long as the Muslims faith remains to that of Abraham and not Muhammed’s faith of Islam. We have no conflict with the CCC.
When they give Allah the 99 names, we can high five them on lots of them!
I love your approach on this and opens the doors to dialogue with our Muslim brothers who profess the faith of Abraham. When the Muslim leaves the faith of Abraham for the faith of Muhammed’s Islam, the names take on a different meaning of revelation of the Trinitarian revelation of God to all of humanity.

In other words through the Muslims faith of Abraham not Muhammed’s faith a high five may be in order.

Muhammed’s faith of Islam takes on a whole different meaning to the titles you listed above which conflict with Abrahams faith in the one True God of Israel.

Again we are addressing Muslims professing the faith of Abraham in one God, not Muhammed’s faith of Islam.
 
Here are some characteristics of God that Islam has revealed:


  1. *]Wal-Ikram 85 The Lord of Majesty and Bounty
    *]Al-Muqsit 86 The Equitable One
    *]Al-Jami 87 The Gatherer
    *]Al-Ghani 88 The Rich One
    *]Al-Mughni 89 The Enricher
    *]Al-Mani’ 90 The Preventer of Harm
    *]Ad-Darr 91 The Creator of The Harmful
    *]An-Nafi 92 The Creator of Good
    *]An-Nur 93 The Light
    *]Al-Hadi 94 The Guide
    *]Al-Badi 95 The Originator
    *]Al-Baqi 96 The Everlasting One
    *]Al-Warith 97 The Inheritor of All
    *]Ar-Rashid 98 The Righteous Teacher
    *]As-Sabur 99 The Patient One

    With the exception of , perhaps #7, would you say that Catholics can give a 👍 to this revelation from the Koran?

  1. I could when a Muslim can agree in faith that all these names are equally applied to the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit in one God, revealed in the only begotten Son of God Jesus Christ who is the Alpha and the Omega.

    But the Koran does not profess this trinitarian faith in the titles it gives to its god.
 
.The CCC addresses the Muslim’s faith professed in Abraham not Islam here.
Yes. I intentionally did not use the word “Islam”.
I can appreciate your sincere ecumenical dialogue here; but Catholics are not the problem.
But some Catholics who refuse to accept the Church’s teaching on Muslims are though.
Try convincing Muslims “who must affirm” that the one God they profess in the one God of Abraham is the same God who became flesh in Jesus Christ.
Yes, there is much work to be done!
Amen, as long as the Muslims faith remains to that of Abraham and not Muhammed’s faith of Islam. We have no conflict with the CCC.
Where Muhammed proclaimed things consonant with the Deposit of Faith, we can affirm that.
When the Muslim leaves the faith of Abraham for the faith of Muhammed’s Islam, the names take on a different meaning of revelation of the Trinitarian revelation of God to all of humanity.
IOW, as I’ve been saying ad nauseum, where they get it right we say, “Yay!” and when they depart from the Truth we say, “Sadly, you are wrong.”
 
IOW, as I’ve been saying ad nauseum, where they get it right we say, “Yay!” and when they depart from the Truth we say, “Sadly, you are wrong.”
The CCC addresses the Muslims faith when they get it right when “professing the faith of Abraham in one God.”

The CCC does not address Muhammed’s faith of Islam when he gets it wrong.

I agree with you, there is much work needed in this area. Islam makes it difficult being in it’s infant stage, when it defends itself by inventing laws of punishment for Muslims who convert to Christianity, or hearing the gospel of Jesus preached to it’s people.

I believe if Islam was true and serving the True God, Islam would not have no fear of Jesus Christ proclaimed crucified, and be able to allow all Arabs to bravely measure the faiths for themselves and compare Muhammed’s teachings to Jesus Christ. Yet Islam reveals fear of the gospel of Jesus Christ, and refuses to hear the true Word of God taught or preached to them freely from those God entrusted His Gospel with, be it, Roman, Eastern or Ortrhodox Catholic Church. Islam fears these apostles of Christ.
 
The CCC addresses the Muslims faith when they get it right when “professing the faith of Abraham in one God.”

The CCC does not address Muhammed’s faith of Islam when he gets it wrong.
Ok. 🤷

But just like any *other *non-Christian who says, “I believe that God is the Giver of Life and the Taker of Life” when Muhammed says it, we say, “You’re right!”
I believe if Islam was true…
Islam is NOT true. So this is a red herring.

I think what all this hoopla is all about is people cannot separate certain concepts.

Some here think that when Catholics (in affirming the Church’s teaching) say that Muslims adore the same God as Christians

that equates to

Catholics profess Islam is true.

NOT the case.

It ought to easy, it would seem to me, to be able to separate the 2 paradigms.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top