Not to be prickly, but how many of you are even qualified to talk about moral theology?

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Really, I do not mean to be prickly at all, I am just interested in seeing how many of you have taken a class, studied from books, etc.?
 
Windfish said:
Really, I do not mean to be prickly at all, I am just interested in seeing how many of you have taken a class, studied from books, etc.?
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Personally, I have an IGMT* degree.

*Inter Galactic Moral Theology degree
 
probably as much qualifies as anyone… Ethics and moral theology were only a part of my B.Th. I guess I could have done more but other subjects are just as valuable and interesting:cool:
 
I hold no qualifications. I have gone through a class taught by a very competent priest, one who conducts intense formation for members of Opus Dei.

But I think we’re all qualified to struggle about the moral life. I think we’re called to struggle to know the truth and to help others know the truth.

Credentialism worries me, seems like it could lead to stovepiping discussions. And I suspect some highly “qualified” professors in moral matters could easily be way off when it comes to coaching and struggling with how to think about real world moral issues.

I’d rather talk about moral issues with strugglers and those who know that a real truth exists and that God wants us to seek it sincerely and perseveringly.
 
Windfish said:
Really, I do not mean to be prickly at all, I am just interested in seeing how many of you have taken a class, studied from books, etc.?
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Are you suggesting we can’t debate, for example, why masturbation is a sin of grave matter unless we have a degree??
 
What were St Paul’s qualifications?

Where did he get the competence and strength to write some of his exhortations in his Letters?

From humility, persistence, ardent desire, and from the Holy Spirit, I think.
 
Your question made me laugh out loud. Probably not too many people are qualified. I have a “professional certificate” in religious education from my diocese…but certainly do not feel qualified to answer many of the questions here.
 
thistle said:
Are you suggesting we can’t debate, for example, why masturbation is a sin of grave matter unless we have a degree??
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Not a degree, but you should be adequately competent with the subject matter. Perhaps “qualification” was the wrong word to use.

I think people can do more harm than good if they offer opinions that are not backed up by some scholarship, and I get the impression that some of the well-meaning opinions here on CAF are like that.
 
Windfish said:
Really, I do not mean to be prickly at all, I am just interested in seeing how many of you have taken a class, studied from books, etc.?
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Well, I have a certification from the diocese that says I am. Is that good enough for you? 😉
 
As a black man I have little to no formal education. That is partially because I was home schooled from age 15 on, but that’s besides the point.

I am unqualified to deal with moral theology in a formal sense. But I have lots of street smarts, so I think I do a pretty good job when weighing in.
 
One does techically need a theology degree per se, in order to be well informed about moral theology, but the problem is that a minority of baptized Catholics have indeed informed themselves well. Many of them:

(1) have not read the catechism

(2) do not understand the catechism, because of the philosophy informing the moral theology in it; they may think or assume they understand it, but when push comes to shove (in debate), they clearly do not.

(3) rely on their parish priest and/or their local bishop; the problems about this are two: (a) parish priests generally have not the time to provide a true “course” in Catholic thought to those lay people whose training is minimal or in any way deficient; (b) some parish priests are errant in their own theological understanding, depending on the training they received in seminary and the priest’s faithfulness to magisterial teaching;

(4) rely on the catechism only when it suits them; treating official teaching as something malleable and changeable, depending on current social politics.

(5) assume that the entire moral teaching of the church is both contained in and explained in the catechism, when that is most certainly not true. Moral theology is an accumulation of sacred tradition (patristics, writings of the saints, etc.), authentic scriptural interpretation, pontifical documents (encylicals, apostolic letters), episcopal documents, etc.

The Catechism is a basic and essential outline, but is by no means exhaustive. Often it is fruitful to examine other Catholic texts to inform and shed light on what is barely stated in the Catechism.

In general, those with an excellent background in philosophy tend to understand Catholic moral theology better, as it is philosophically-based. Second, those with an excellent general education in reading critically have an advantage (regardless of the level of that education). Third, those who were fortunate enough to attend any Catholic schools with an excellent philosophical-theological foundation (requiring literacy in that) have an advantage. Beyond that, a theology degree per se (with a moral theology component to it) is somewhat helpful, but again, not essential as long as the depth and breadth of moral theology is understood. Many people on CAF without any specific theology degree have made it their business to become thoroughly informed, some merely reading on their own, some actually taking free or purchased classes.
 
Elizabeth502 said:
One does techically need a theology degree per se, in order to be well informed about moral theology, but the problem is that a minority of baptized Catholics have indeed informed themselves well. Many of them:

(1) have not read the catechism

(2) do not understand the catechism, because of the philosophy informing the moral theology in it; they may think or assume they understand it, but when push comes to shove (in debate), they clearly do not.

(3) rely on their parish priest and/or their local bishop; the problems about this are two: (a) parish priests generally have not the time to provide a true “course” in Catholic thought to those lay people whose training is minimal or in any way deficient; (b) some parish priests are errant in their own theological understanding, depending on the training they received in seminary and the priest’s faithfulness to magisterial teaching;

(4) rely on the catechism only when it suits them; treating official teaching as something malleable and changeable, depending on current social politics.

(5) assume that the entire moral teaching of the church is both contained in and explained in the catechism, when that is most certainly not true. Moral theology is an accumulation of sacred tradition (patristics, writings of the saints, etc.), authentic scriptural interpretation, pontifical documents (encylicals, apostolic letters), episcopal documents, etc.

The Catechism is a basic and essential outline, but is by no means exhaustive. Often it is fruitful to examine other Catholic texts to inform and shed light on what is barely stated in the Catechism.

In general, those with an excellent background in philosophy tend to understand Catholic moral theology better, as it is philosophically-based. Second, those with an excellent general education in reading critically have an advantage (regardless of the level of that education). Third, those who were fortunate enough to attend any Catholic schools with an excellent philosophical-theological foundation (requiring literacy in that) have an advantage. Beyond that, a theology degree per se (with a moral theology component to it) is somewhat helpful, but again, not essential as long as the depth and breadth of moral theology is understood. Many people on CAF without any specific theology degree have made it their business to become thoroughly informed, some merely reading on their own, some actually taking free or purchased classes.
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Good post.

So do you have such a degree? Do you recommend books besides the Catechism that a lay person such as myself can read on Catholic moral theology? I respect the members of this forum, but some of the topics on moral issues like bad language, legal issues, etc. leave me unsatisfied.
 
I have no qualifications as far as religious qualifications go, but have plenty of experience reading various legal codes and having to interpret them. The place where I would get into trouble with moral theology with the Church is if the Canons/Catechism have terminology that is redefined to mean something else. As a simple example, “ordered to procreation” would normally mean having something to do with begetting children, yet the Church uses it in a manner that doesn’t necessarily have anything to do with procreating (e.g., infertile couples).
 
Windfish said:
What did you have to do to get that?
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It was a two year process that included 18 months studying various theological topics and an additional 20 hours of teaching methodology. And I had to be sponsored by my pastor.
 
Ummmmmm… I own an abridged copy of St. Thomas’ Summa Theologiae!

My only real qualification is that I have a brain. God gave it to me for some reason, and He wants me to use it. I proceed from that premise in everything, including moral theology.
 
BlackSkin said:
As a black man I have little to no formal education. That is partially because I was home schooled from age 15 on, but that’s besides the point.

I am unqualified to deal with moral theology in a formal sense. But I have lots of street smarts, so I think I do a pretty good job when weighing in.
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Welcome! Not only that, but you have the catechism, which is a resource even for the Cardinals.
 
GloriousOrder said:
Ummmmmm… I own an abridged copy of St. Thomas’ Summa Theologiae!

My only real qualification is that I have a brain. God gave it to me for some reason, and He wants me to use it. I proceed from that premise in everything, including moral theology.
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Those two together are perfect. 🙂 do you have the Summa of the Summa, or Peter Kreeft’s Essential Philosophical Passages of STA’s Summa? Because I’m going to recommend either to Windfish.
 
Elizabeth502 said:
Those two together are perfect. 🙂 do you have the Summa of the Summa, or Peter Kreeft’s Essential Philosophical Passages of STA’s Summa? Because I’m going to recommend either to Windfish.
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I will get them, but I really am suspicious when people punt to Aquinas all the time - he is not the end all be all, and a lot of the moral concerns he addresses are informed by a historically contingent point of view.

What interests me, in particular, are the smaller issues. There is a lot of coverage on bigger moral issues, but not so much sophistication on the day-to-day stuff such as, say, bad language.
 
po18guy said:
Welcome! Not only that, but you have the catechism, which is a resource even for the Cardinals.
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As a black man who has not been accepted on the site so far I thank you for your supportive comment. I must ask, what is the catechism? I feel like it should be the name for a dance move (a really cool word), but I’m sure I’m wrong. I think I’m about to learn a lot.
 
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