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ProVobis
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Approved for probably not too much longer as the vernacular liturgical texts are being rewritten. That probably means chants and music in time as well, so I wouldn’t get too enamored with what’s out there now.
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brotherhrolf
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Boy, I wish I could get him to respond to some of the naysayers on this forum.
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Brendan
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I really doubt it. Father Paul was an Associate Pastor at our parish for awhile. And yes, in Latin, ad orientum, with chant, was how he offered Mass. We loved him and were sorry to see him go.
He did come back for awhile to teach our altar boys how to serve the EF Mass, when the Moto Proprio came out and our pastor was able to add as EF Mass to our parish schedule.
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Brendan
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Probably not actually. He is at a parish in Detroit where the EF is the most common Mass said. Most of the remaining ones are the OF Mass in Latin.
Detroit is rather interesting, we have four parishes where the EF Mass is said. In all the cases, the priests are diocesan priests. The pastor of each of the parishs opted to learn the EF Mass and celebrate it.
What was also really cool was that two of our auxilliary bishops ( +Boyea and +Quinn) did the same thing. Bishop Boyea even took the time to learn the rubrics for the Pontifical High Mass and said that on major feast days. Pope Benedict has seen fit to assign both these men to their own Sees, so we no longer have that.
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Brendan
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One thing that must also be kept in mind is that the bishop simply permits female altar servers.
No priest can be required to use them.
For altar girls to be legitimately used, three things have to happen
- The bishop gave his permission
- The parish pastor gave his permission
- The celebrating priest gave his permission.
adoremus.org/CDW-AltarServers.html
Father Paul’s parish, like ours, only uses males in service at the altar. And lots of them too. At most Sunday Masses at our respective parishes, 30-40 boys will serve Mass.
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pnewton
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Ah, but giving this blog extra credence because he is a priest is also ad hominem. His authority does not extend beyond his parish. Also, many of his biases and points are the same that have been already dealt with before. There is no a lot new.
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Ultima_Ratio
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It’s good to find Priests who have the courage to say what needs to be said. Let us remember this courageous Priest in our Rosaries. Speaking the truth today is not popular, as evidenced by some of the comments in this thread.
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Lamentabili
Guest
Fr. Paul’s Mass Schedule…
assumptiongrotto.com/
Christmas Midnight mass in the Extraordinary Form Solemn High Mass
Prelude Music begins December 24th at 11:45pm
HAYDN THERESIENMESSE
Weekday Masses:
6:30 a.m., 7:30 a.m. (Tridentine Mass), 7:00 p.m.
Weekend Masses:
Saturday, 7:30 a.m. (Tridentine Mass), 4:00 p.m.
Sunday, 6:30 a.m., 9:30 a.m. (Tridentine Mass), 12:00 Noon
Holy Days:
6:30 a.m., 9:30 a.m. (Tridentine Mass), 12:00 Noon, 7:00 p.m.
*The Rosary is said after all the Masses on the weekends and during the week.
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Brendan
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In addition, the pastor there, Fr. Perrone, is an accomplished muscian. He has been a guest conductor for the Detroit Symphony Orchestra.
Fr. Perrone wrote a musical about the life of Fr. McGiveny, the founder of the Knights of Columbus.
It was really excellent.
Here is a video clip
youtube.com/watch?v=9GmUZEA_q8g
The shots are from one of the first dress rehersals, so the sets were not yet complete.
It really was Broadway quality.
Fr. Perrone wrote a musical about the life of Fr. McGiveny, the founder of the Knights of Columbus.
It was really excellent.
Here is a video clip
youtube.com/watch?v=9GmUZEA_q8g
The shots are from one of the first dress rehersals, so the sets were not yet complete.
It really was Broadway quality.
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CradleCath
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Can the pastors of the Church not see what they have done? Can they fail to see the deep links between this sad situation and the so-called “reform” of the 1960’s and 1970’s? If some or all do not, I think it is through some diabolical influence. It is so flagrantly evident, that nothing can explain their lack of seeing, unless it were insanity or some supernatural influence of evil origin. But yes, they go on singing the praises of the new order of the Mass and all that came with it. How long, oh Lord, how long will the pastors abandon us sheep to the wolves? Have mercy, lord, have mercy.
I checked up on Father Paul Ward & found:
Fr. Paul Ward, M.A. Theology
Fr. Paul Ward is Associate Pastor of Assumption Grotto Parish, Detroit. He is well-known for his fiery and passionate sermons as well as **his devotion to Jesus and His Blessed Mother. **In addition to being blessed with a true brilliance for pastoral work, Fr. Ward is highly educated, holding a total of six degrees;
Bachelor of Classical Humanities from the Centro de Humanidades y Ciencias in Salamanca, Spain,
Bachelor of Arts in Philosophy (Pontifical Degree from the Pontifical Univeristy Regina Apostolorum, Rome, Italy),
Licentiate in Philosophy (Pontifical Degree from the Pontifical University Regina Apostolorum, Rome),
Masters of Divinity (Sacred Heart Major Seminary, Detroit, MI),
Bachelors of Arts in Theology (Pontifical Degree by the Pontifical University Angelicum, Rome) and
Master of Arts in Theology (Sacred Heart Major Seminary). He runs his own website at FatherPaul.org
What does he know!!! My great aunt’s sister-in-law told me that everyone hated the TLM.back “in the day”. !! After all, the people could not have understood Latin, they didn’t visit in Church & they tend to worry about sin. Now, those who love the Novus Ordo are understanding. They condemn nothing…that’s being judgmental…don’t ya know??
(Just thought I’d answer before the liberals on board do.)
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thomas_jd
Guest
I just read Fr. Pauls article and a terrible sadness overcame me. The different posts blasting the Novus Ordus mass! BLAMING THE HOLY SACRIFICE OF THE MASS for all our church problems.
I served at mass in the fifty’s. I served at mass last month. I attend the Traditional as well as the Novus Ordus.The problem isn’t with the new mass. One is not better than the other.
BOTH CAN BE BEAUTIFUL IF THE RUBRICS ARE FOLLOWED!! The Novus Ordus Mass is much, much, harder to celebrate. Why? Lack of Focus on God! There is the problem and the answer.
We are aware of the many problems the past forty years of change that has ensued since Vatician 2. The current group of new priests will have to examine the past liturgical practices and learn from the older examples.
ATTEND WEEKLY ADORATION. Both laity and priests.Find a church that has some form of Adoration or help orginize Adoration. Remember the focus is on God, and all things are possible.
I served at mass in the fifty’s. I served at mass last month. I attend the Traditional as well as the Novus Ordus.The problem isn’t with the new mass. One is not better than the other.
BOTH CAN BE BEAUTIFUL IF THE RUBRICS ARE FOLLOWED!! The Novus Ordus Mass is much, much, harder to celebrate. Why? Lack of Focus on God! There is the problem and the answer.
We are aware of the many problems the past forty years of change that has ensued since Vatician 2. The current group of new priests will have to examine the past liturgical practices and learn from the older examples.
ATTEND WEEKLY ADORATION. Both laity and priests.Find a church that has some form of Adoration or help orginize Adoration. Remember the focus is on God, and all things are possible.
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CradleCath
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I don’t understand your usage of the phrase ad hominem, here. Ad hominem is, in current usage anyway, is an attempt to undermine a person’s argument by attacking the person, instead of his argument.
And YES, the fact is…when a priest speaks of a Church issue, he DOES have extra credence. This is sometimes a good thing, other times not so good. It depends upon the priests faithfulness to the Church. For instance, when Cardinal O’Malley called the three- ring-circus that sent Ted Kennedy to the afterlife…a Catholic funeral, it was NOT a good thing, yet his title lent weight to his statements & led the public to believe that we allowed anyone who’d like to to deliver a eulogy to do so & an abortion advocate to receive a very public dispalay of “over-the-top” Catholicism.
This priest, however tells the truth, and that means that he used his title in a good way. Got it?
BTW., What has this priest’s authority to do with anything. He gave us his thoughts, he made no rules or laws??. Could it be that you just don’t agree with his views??
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pnewton
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The phrase ad hominem literally means “to the person”. A good example is the use of celebrities to make political points. Person A is good at such and such. Therefore, his opinion is matters more. Surely, as a priest, the man brings a level of education that is of value, when an a point is enhanced by education. However, anecdotal remains anecdotal and poor logic can still remain poor logic.
You mention Cardinal Mahoney. You should not have it both ways. To the extent that a priest speaks with authority, a bishop does more so. Therefore, we should listen more to what the Cardinal says than the priest. Obviously, this I think it better that we actually look at what was said and not just who says it.
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ibkc
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Just as an aside, I think the logical fallacy you’re thinking of is called appeal to authority rather than ad hominem. Ad hominem is necessarily a negative; meaning, an argument is rejected on the basis of the claimant’s character or position.
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PapalRat
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This is great in theory, but in practice, the vast majority of bishops will crucify priests who do not use female altar boys. How do I know? Because I’ve seen it too many times.
Your parish is truly rare, and your bishop must either be apathetic or actually one of the few decent ones. Try having all-male altar boys in a diocese like Syracuse, NY and your priest would find himself without a parish. Even in a diocese with a reputation for being conservative, like NYC, a priest who tries to stop the practice of altar girls will find himself chin-deep in doo-doo. Maybe forehead deep.
Same goes for the Tridentine Mass. Sure every priest is de jure allowed to say it, but traditionally-minded (not even “traditionalist”) priests are de facto* getting raked over the coals by their bishops and the chanceries.
It’s ugly out there. There’s a real disconnect between what the Holy Father and the parish priests want, and what the USCCB wants. Unfortunately, that layer of “middle managers” is ruthless in demanding obedience from parish priests, but seem to forget that they owe obedience to the Holy Father. They remind me of the son who tells his father, “yes, yes” and then does no work.
I’m happy for you, truly, that your parish is OK. But for the rest of us…well, the vast majority of us are out here suffering in mainstream parishes with no escape route in sight. We can’t abandon the parish or The Church, and all we seem to get is the crosier whacked over our heads as a reward for our loyalty.*
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cothrige
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There’s a tricky mental image for you. Things really have gotten bad when our bishops are forcing this on us.
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jam070406
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I’ve spoken to Fr. Paul many times. I’ve seen him celebrate reverant OF, Latin OF and EF Masses. I’ve gone to confession to him. I’ve heard his homilies (where he actually talks about sin and hell.) I’ve seen his love of Jesus, neighbor, the parish, the parishoners, the Church, the Blessed Mother, the Pope. I’ve seen his love to teach the youth and even accompany them on World Youth Day. He is Holy, kind, wise and completely devoted to HMC. A great defender of the Faith. I would love to see the poster that claimed his “poor logic” speak to him face to face.
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pnewton
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That is why we post here. If you will read my post and what I said, I said poor logic is poor logic. I did not say “his poor logic” at any point.
However, begging the question is still begging the question, regardless of who does it.
This seems to say that if one disagrees with him and his post hoc ergo prompter hoc conclusions, that he must be insane or under diablolical influence. If I am mistaken, please tell me how, because I truly might not see it. Since many priest do not agree with him, it would appear obvious that a false appeal to authority might also apply. Again, that is not this priest’s poor logic, but those that give this extra credence than other priest and bishops.
One more thing about this that strikes me strange. What is a “Novus Ordo Priest?” I have never seen that in any Vatican document. In fact, I would think that since the MP, that such a thing would be logically impossible, since all priest may offer the TLM. This priest freely admits to offering the TLM. Therefore, this characterization of this priest as a Novus Ordo Priest seems to me to be disingenuine.
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PapalRat
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Ha! I’m glad you liked that little touch of whimsy.There’s a tricky mental image for you. Things really have gotten bad when our bishops are forcing this on us.
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jam070406
Guest
This is your direct quote:
“Surely, as a priest, the man brings a level of education that is of value, when an a point is enhanced by education. However, anecdotal remains anecdotal and poor logic can still remain poor logic.”
You refer directly to him in the first sentence, which can lead readers to believe that the second is also your opinion about him. Not attacking you, but this is what it looked like to me and why I said what I did.
If you are having trouble understanding his writings then I believe the Christian thing to do would be to contact him directly and discuss it further with him personally. This would avoid causing any speculation of his intentions or backbiting.
This is the last I will write on this.
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