Nuns get involved in the battle for the White House

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CMatt25 said:
No. I’m aware of the Catholic Church’s teachings, Lapey, and how Catholics are supposed to force their consciences to conform to them. I run to another when I’m told I can’t be a Catholic as I am. I run to another Christian community where I am welcomed to be me then.
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A Christian community where you can be whatever you want to be is called a group of friends.

The entire point of a religion is to establish a system of beliefs, among other things. What you are looking for is blind acceptance of whatever you bring to the table. That is not what religion is for.

Members of a religion are there to love one another, support one another, help one another get to Heaven, and most importantly, defend and protect the teachings of the religion. It doesn’t exist to coddle me, but help me and guide me, fraternally so.

You can get what you are looking for in any club or non-religious entity. Not to dissuade you from seeking Truth or religious identity bud, but it seems you are looking for something in the wrong place.
 
He_Man said:
A Christian community where you can be whatever you want to be is called a group of friends.

The entire point of a religion is to establish a system of beliefs, among other things. What you are looking for is blind acceptance of whatever you bring to the table. That is not what religion is for.

Members of a religion are there to love one another, support one another, help one another get to Heaven, and most importantly, defend and protect the teachings of the religion. It doesn’t exist to coddle me, but help me and guide me, fraternally so.

You can get what you are looking for in any club or non-religious entity. Not to dissuade you from seeking Truth or religious identity bud, but it seems you are looking for something in the wrong place.
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:clapping::clapping:
 
He_Man said:
I was on my feet too, but that’s because my wife warned be about throwing up on the couch.
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Thats pretty funny right there sir! I must admit though, it didn’t affect me at all…I din’t watch any of the democrat convention except the closing prayer. 😉
 
Lapey said:
You are kidding right??? For an entire year, the first year of formation, I studied the social justice encyclicals written by our popes starting with Rerum Nevarum and Pope Leo XIII and ending with the writings of Pope John Paul II and Benedict XVI.

Social justice is the foundation of the diaconate. Deacons are called to serve just as Jesus served; this is precisely why these writings are the foundation of formation.

The social justice these nuns push for is not the same social justice the popes have worked for all the way through to now. This is precisely why their numbers are shrinking and the current Pope is starting to reign them in. Is Pope benedict XVI also working to promote republican ideas which differ from these nuns?

PS. You referred to them as clergy earlier; they are not clerics as women cannot receive ordination, Holy Orders. They are consecrated religious, but not clergy.
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Yes Lapey, I’m aware they are religious. I thought I said something along the lines of they were among the relatively few clergy (by which I meant men) or religious (by which I was speakng of the social justice nuns) who inspire me today. And when I spoke of young clergy and religious, I meant men in the clergy and women religious. But maybe it was unclear to you what I meant and that I knew this.
 
He_Man said:
A Christian community where you can be whatever you want to be is called a group of friends.

The entire point of a religion is to establish a system of beliefs, among other things. What you are looking for is blind acceptance of whatever you bring to the table. That is not what religion is for.

Members of a religion are there to love one another, support one another, help one another get to Heaven, and most importantly, defend and protect the teachings of the religion. It doesn’t exist to coddle me, but help me and guide me, fraternally so.

You can get what you are looking for in any club or non-religious entity. Not to dissuade you from seeking Truth or religious identity bud, but it seems you are looking for something in the wrong place.
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This is where the whistle comes in Carlan was talking about…:whistle::whistle::whistle:
 
CMatt25 said:
Yes Lapey, I’m aware they are religious. I thought I said something along the lines of they were among the relatively few clergy (by which I meant men) or religious (by which I was speakng of the social justice nuns) who inspire me today. And when I spoke of young clergy and religious, I meant men in the clergy and women religious. But maybe it was unclear to you what I meant and that I knew this.
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Cool, I take back my PS.

But how did they get the name social justice nuns? Are these special nuns? are they different then other nuns where social justice is concerned? How do they compare to the social justice of Blessed Mother Teresa? Are they different in obedience to the Magisterium way? (I can answer that one…)

Now what about the rest of my post? and the other posts?🤷
 
estesbob said:
There are two characteristics that i see constantly from those trying to reconcile church teachings with their left-wing political views.
  1. Their politics form their faith
  2. They believe we can fulfill our obligation to help the poor and needy merely by voting for someone who promises to take other people’s money and do it for us.
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I can’t speak for anyone trying to reconcile your church teachings with their politics, left or right. But I know #2 is a drum you like beating and it is sheer nonsense. I’ve no doubt there are many people who believe in and vote for a government role and favor progressive tax policy who do not believe that alone fulfills their need for Christian personal charity. You have no idea what any of them individually do within their personal means and it really is not your business to speculate and judge this with some sweeping broad brush statement.

Yes I know you can site polling about the amount of “right” and “left” charitable giving. Which proves nothing of your premise that Christians on the left believe voting “fulfills” their obligation.
 
fastenatingguy said:
I want to keep this dialogue with you charitable, Matt, but you are making it tough:shrug:

As far as healthcare services, PP may be doing some good. I have no knowledge to the contrary. IF IF IF (BIG IF) they didn’t provide abortions, I could possibly consider offering support to them. Maybe.

As for abortion, I can no longer take you seriously on this. You just sidestep the issue constantly, as if the Church does not matter. You have developed your own doctrine. I said a prayer for you.
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Thank you fastenatingguy. And please know I truly try as well to be charitable. I’m human like you and the rest of us and I know it can be tough sometimes. I sincerely pray for the most part I am though. I’m just striving to humbly walk in the Christian faith I have. And the Apostle James spoke about praying for one another. So I very much appreciate and thank you for praying for me. A prayer life and praying for others is important to my faith as well. I’m going to reciprocate if that’s alright with you and I pray God continues to bless you along your faith journey and His peace be with you always.
 
Lapey said:
Look at what you wrote here, this does not bother you that you leave because the Church doesn’t change for your beliefs? Hopefully Catholics and all will follow Peter’s example and not be like the rest. That same opportunity is open to you, to come back home where you belong.👍
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Lapey, no it doesn’t bother me but that’s not the reason.
 
He_Man said:
A Christian community where you can be whatever you want to be is called a group of friends.

The entire point of a religion is to establish a system of beliefs, among other things. What you are looking for is blind acceptance of whatever you bring to the table. That is not what religion is for.

Members of a religion are there to love one another, support one another, help one another get to Heaven, and most importantly, defend and protect the teachings of the religion. It doesn’t exist to coddle me, but help me and guide me, fraternally so.

You can get what you are looking for in any club or non-religious entity. Not to dissuade you from seeking Truth or religious identity bud, but it seems you are looking for something in the wrong place.
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Thanks He Man but I’m fine right now with my faith beliefs and my personal relationship with our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. And no I can’t get what I am looking for through any club. I’ll keep looking for love and support among a Christian community though for even greater peace.
 
Ender said:
You keep saying you are not an economist but at the same time you keep asserting that taxes ought to be raised. Are you unaware that almost no economist advocates raising taxes during a recession? You make the unwarranted assumption that raising taxes will automatically generate more revenue yet this is demonstrably untrue.
More to the point of the thread, neither are the nuns. This is an economic issue, not a moral one, and the sisters bring no valuable insight to the debate. They are presenting their political opinions as if they were moral teachings when in fact there is no connection between the two.
The fact that we are talking about nuns here and not a handful of otherwise uninformed women automatically made this debate about good and evil. That was their whole purpose for getting involved, to morally browbeat people into supporting their personal political preferences.

Ender
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Thanks for my first laugh of the day: browbeating by a group of nuns! I get more browbeating on the internet everyday. Still, given that I owe much to the religious and to the nuns in particular, I will defend with my last breath their right to “browbeat” as much as the next person with a keyboard and an internet connection. :D:D:D

I do admit that I’m not an economist, but I know enough to realize that most agree that we are not presently ‘in a recession’ but in a rather wobbly recovery from one. I also listen to the experts enough to hear repeatedly:
  1. that NEITHER Obama’s nor Ryan’s plans would do more than chip a bit off the deficit
  2. that both must be done to tackle the deficit: raising taxes AND cutting spending
Since none of us knows everything, I do believe in listening to a range of experts in making decisions in areas where I lack expertise. Applying a little commonsense and shelving ideological absolutism also helps balance the pros and cons in such situations.

As for the moral teachings. It’s understandable why a lay person might have difficulty differentiating politics from moral principles, considering that for many people they are wed in an irreversible bond for all time…But on the matter of what constitutes a moral principle and what constitutes a political opinion, I’ll take the nuns’ direction any day over that of an anonymous poster.

Thanks again for the hearty laugh 😉
 
seekerz said:
Thanks for my first laugh of the day: browbeating by a group of nuns! I get more browbeating on the internet everyday. Still, given that I owe much to the religious and to the nuns in particular, I will defend with my last breath their right to “browbeat” as much as the next person with a keyboard and an internet connection. :D:D:D

I do admit that I’m not an economist, but I know enough to realize that most agree that we are not presently ‘in a recession’ but in a rather wobbly recovery from one. I also listen to the experts enough to hear repeatedly:
  1. that NEITHER Obama’s nor Ryan’s plans would do more than chip a bit off the deficit
  2. that both must be done to tackle the deficit: raising taxes AND cutting spending
Since none of us knows everything, I do believe in listening to a range of experts in making decisions in areas where I lack expertise. Applying a little commonsense and shelving ideological absolutism also helps balance the pros and cons in such situations.

As for the moral teachings. It’s understandable why a lay person might have difficulty differentiating politics from moral principles, considering that for many people they are wed in an irreversible bond for all time…But on the matter of what constitutes a moral principle and what constitutes a political opinion, I’ll take the nuns’ direction any day over that of an anonymous poster.

Thanks again for the hearty laugh 😉
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So you take six Nuns opinions over the clear teachings of the Church???
 
kimmielittle said:
Curious are you saying there are no “Death Panels” - “Rationing of Care Panels”?

Could we get your thoughts on this?

cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/independent-payment-advisory-board-ppacas-anticonstitutional-authoritarian-superlegislature

lifenews.com/2012/09/19/new-york-times-opinion-writer-we-need-death-panels/
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That is correct - there are no ‘death panels’…

…unless you consider death panels to be the personnel which EVERY insurer presently relies on to decide what to cover, and to determine what constitutes medical necessity.
 
Lapey said:
Cool, I take back my PS.

But how did they get the name social justice nuns? Are these special nuns? are they different then other nuns where social justice is concerned? How do they compare to the social justice of Blessed Mother Teresa? Are they different in obedience to the Magisterium way? (I can answer that one…)

Now what about the rest of my post? and the other posts?🤷
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Lapey, sorry. I misread your words. I thought you said “social justice nuns” but you said “the social justice these nuns…”. My eyes aren’t the best always and once in awhile I’ll miss something and I missed “these” in this case.

What else about your posts? I can’t even imagine what you’ve been up to on the other thread. 😃 But I was about to head off for a bit. But good for you to get back to the topic as I see others are because I’m tired of the talk about me on this one. Might catch you later my friend.
 
seekerz said:
That is correct - there are no ‘death panels’…

…unless you consider death panels to be the personnel which EVERY insurer presently relies on to decide what to cover, and to determine what constitutes medical necessity.
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Sooooo This doesn’t exist? Independent Payment Advisory Board,
 
kimmielittle said:
Ahhhhhh that is not what you claimed about Ms Campbell

YOUR CLAIM
my bold

Church Teaching:

IN HER WORDS

TWS: On the legal question, do you think there should be penalties against abortion doctors?** I mean, should it be illegal to perform abortions?** my bold

CAMPBELL: That’s beyond my pay grade.** I don’t know.**

Is Ms Campbell in line with Church Teachings on abortion?
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You are conflating immorality of abortion with support for legal penalties against it. I assert that the two are separable in a setting where abortion is not illegal by law. I see no violation of any Church teaching in her stance. And BTW, who is Ms Campbell? She’s Sr Campbell.
 
Aren’t these same nuns that are promoting the Democrats the same nuns that the Vatican is investigating?
 
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