Nursing home residents stage heartbreaking protest outside facility: 'Rather die from COVID than loneliness'

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LeafByNiggle commenting on what he does not know about because those discussions were private.
If Trump wanted HCQ his physician would have given him HCQ (unless he knew it was useless).
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(There is that here-unfounded word “useless” again.)

You have no idea about those doctor-patient discussions.

You also have no idea about the “usefulness” or “uselessness” of an unstudied drug (“unstudied” with regards to proper cohorts) where the anecdotal feedback was excellent in many cases.
 
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This is why I tried to keep seniors out of our local nursing home when I was a CNA, and took care of them in their own homes where family could visit them, etc. There wasn’t the pandemic back then, but loneliness is loneliness, regardless of outside circumstances. People can and do die from loneliness. It’s a form of grief.
 
Thank you JanR for taking care of them.
(What a fine person you are!)

And I agree. The elderly’s lonliness should be taken into serious consideration in the risk-benefit ratio of all of this.
 
Annie said:
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LeafByNiggle:
Either way, that does not look very good for Trump and/or HCQ.
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And when Trump was praising HCQ, Remdesivir did not yet exist.
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Yup. It sure did. And it too was being tried for covid-19. Look back in the postings in this forum and you will see lots of arguments about HCQ vs Remdesivir.
 
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The University of Chicago (I think) discovered that remdesivir an existing drug prevented the duplicity of virus cells. At least they had a basis for its use.
 
sloancaprice said:
Seems likely to me it’s up the nursing homes. If the people living in the nursing homes don’t like the rules there, they can move elsewhere.
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Maybe that will happen, but the most likely to move are the “self-pays” who are greatly more profitable to the nursing home than the Medicaid majority. I believe the nursing homes would quickly find a way to oblige the self-pays and their families.
 
Well, I’m not going to blame Trump for what any of his supporters did or said, and I didn’t get involved in those discussions because I didn’t understand the either/or attitude assumed by some.

And I don’t think we should derail this thread any further.
 
You forgot to mention to @Annie that at that time Remdesivir had no approval status in COVID.

So at least for some (as you yourself have claimed about HCQ), it was not an option.
 
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LeafByNiggle . . .
And Trump supporters in this forum were even more vocal about HCQ being better than Remdesivir. . . .
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Who? Where?

Better at what?

Why not unpack the physiology of BOTH of them and we can see if at least hypothetically one is better than the other in certain dimensions of cell function?
 
Cathoholic said:
You forgot to mention to @Annie that at that time Remdesivir had no approval status in COVID.

So at least for some (as you yourself have claimed about HCQ), it was not an option.
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I agree with Annie that we should not derail this thread any further, but rewind to the point where you objected to the comparison between the effect of putting infected covid patients in nursing homes and letting letting nursing home patients get infected from their visiting family. In both cases it exposes the entire facility to a deadly risk. At least that’s how you perceived it when Cuomo did it. But now you say it’s not so bad because there is HCQ and Remdesivir and monoclonal antibodies. (However I still think Trump has essense of Gelfling too.)
 
LeafByNiggle (changing my premise) . . .
and letting letting nursing home patients get infected from their visiting family.
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Except I never advocated “letting nursing home patients get infected from their visiting family.”

I have advocated doing everything reasonable to prevent that AND still have visiting rights.

Just like we have in medical clinics right now without undo risk.
 
LeafByNiggle (again changing my premise) . . .
But now you say it’s not so bad because there is HCQ and Remdesivir and monoclonal antibodies. (However I still think Trump has essense of Gelfling too.)
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Except I never said or implied being infected was “not so bad”.

I have said there is treatment if one gets infected.

Not that it is “not so bad”.

There is treatment with the flu too, but I am not saying that “is not so bad” either.

Either the flu or corona virus can still kill people (despite treatment). Either the flu or corona virus can still be VERY BAD (despite treatment).

But we don’t have to be reigned to getting infected and letting a deviant nature (i.e. a virus) take its course. We can fight back if and when we have to.

We do NOT need to be RESIGNED to our elderly dying of heartbreak and lonliness.
 
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RidgeSprinter . . .
60% of those in nursing homes have no visitors.
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Are you suggesting that makes it OK to force the other 40% of those elderly to a life without hugs and visitors

Or are you suggesting a new ministry (of nursing home visitors)?

Or something else?

By the way, where did you get this number from?
 
Cathoholic said:
Are you suggesting that makes it OK to force the other 40% of those elderly to a life without hugs and visitors
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No, just pointing out the facts. And it will probably only get worse as the “ME” attitudes keeps moving forward.

Cathoholic, where will you be when you are very old and feeble?

For me, depends on whom dies first. Our daughter has already declared that the survivor will move in with her and her husband PERIOD, end of discussion. If my wife dies before I do, I have the assurance of continued family Comradery. No nursing home for me barring medical issues.

Who else has that assurance?
Cathoholic said:
Or are you suggesting a new ministry (of nursing home visitors)?
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There should be. For all intentional purposes, those in the Nursing Homes are prisoners without the strict visitor requirement you find in actual prisons, but prisoners nonetheless.

Some nursing home inhabitants are actually strapped in to their chairs during the day staring out a window or watching a TV. It is quite a depressing sight. It takes a special individual to visit the inhabitants on a weekly basis. And all Nursing Homes have that peculiar smell.
Cathoholic said:
By the way, where did you get this number from?
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From the article.
● Georgia has the ninth fastest growing 60-plus population and the 18th fastest growing 85-plus population in the United States.

● According to the National Center for Health Statistics, more than 50 percent of nursing home residents have no close relatives, and 46 percent have no living children.

● An estimated 60 percent of nursing home residents never have visitors.
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One just has to know how to capture everthing before the “Subscribe” prompt hides everything.
 
Cathoholic said:
LeafByNiggle (changing my premise) . . .
and letting letting nursing home patients get infected from their visiting family.
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The nursing home where the protests occurred were already providing for family visitation, and doing everything reasonable to prevent infection, which includes keeping a distance between visitors and residence. But that makes it impossible to hug, and that’s what the residents were complaining about was the inability to hug their family. I have seen it done safely once. There was a huge sheet of plastic and the two parties could stand on opposite sides and embrace with the continuous sheet of plastic between them. But that was a one-off home-made solution. I doubt if it would be practical to implement on a facility-wide basis. It would take disinfection of the sheet between every use and it still would not feel the same.
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