Obama and Ben Carson react to shooting

[Birdpreacher]

** Obama uses N-word, says we are ‘not cured’ of racism **

“Racism, we are not cured of it. And it’s not just a matter of it not being polite to say ****** in public,” Obama said in an interview for the podcast “WTF with Marc Maron.”

“That’s not the measure of whether racism still exists or not. It’s not just a matter of overt discrimination. Societies don’t, overnight, completely erase everything that happened 200 to 300 years prior.”

cnn.com/2015/06/22/politics/barack-obama-n-word-race-relations-marc-maron-interview/index.html

** Ben Carson slams GOP 2016 rivals ‘who dare not call this tragedy an act of racism’**

Ben Carson called out his fellow Republican presidential candidates for their reluctance to call the South Carolina church shootings an “act of racism,” chastising them for letting politics get in way of confronting “a sickness that is crippling our nation.”

washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2015/06/22/ben-carson-slams-gop-presidential-rivals-who-dare-not-call-this-tragedy-an-act-of-racism/

 

[Darryl1958]

It is pretty obvious that it was an act of racism. The guy shoots women on the pretext that ‘you guys are raping our women’.

 

[ishii]

** Obama uses N-word, says we are ‘not cured’ of racism **

cnn.com/2015/06/22/politics/barack-obama-n-word-race-relations-marc-maron-interview/index.html

** Ben Carson slams GOP 2016 rivals ‘who dare not call this tragedy an act of racism’**

washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2015/06/22/ben-carson-slams-gop-presidential-rivals-who-dare-not-call-this-tragedy-an-act-of-racism/

GOP candidates are reluctant to call the shooting racist? Is Dr. Carson playing the race card out of desperation?

Ishii

 

[Blue_Goose]

In my opinion the murders were racially motivated by a human being with a sick mind. It does matter what national figures think or say on the matter, including Ben Carson, for whom I have a lot of respect. The perpetrator is solely responsible for his actions and will be judged.

I admire the families that have forgiven Roof for the murder(s) of their kin. These truly Christian people are a light unto the world and will make a positive difference to someone somewhere based on their testimony of forgiveness and love.

The courts of South Carolina will decide Roof’s fate in this life and the ultimate Judge will decide Roof’s fate in the afterlife.

Peace be with you all.

 

[Darryl1958]

Does the state have the DP?

 

[Darryl1958]

The article was very vague about the candidates that Carson might have been talking about.
As the facts come in and settle, I doubt that there will be a single candidate for president in any party that will not see this as racist.

 

[ishii]

The article was very vague about the candidates that Carson might have been talking about.
As the facts come in and settle, I doubt that there will be a single candidate for president in any party that will not see this as racist.

I agree, Darryl1958. Which candidate “struggled” with calling the attack racist? The article does not name them. Is this Dr. Carson’s attempt to stay relevant?

Ishii

 

[Path_Finder]

I agree, Darryl1958. Which candidate “struggled” with calling the attack racist? The article does not name them. Is this Dr. Carson’s attempt to stay relevant?

Ishii

Now that you ask “which candidate struggled”, a number did actually. Romney, not a candidate, I believe did come out saying something like the flag should be taken down.

Rubio, declined to say whether he would vote to take the flag down, Walker seems to say something like now is not the right time to discuss this tragedy right after these people have been killed.

washingtonpost.com/politics/while-gop-candidates-stammer-clinton-directly-confronts-race/2015/06/22/6414dd66-18f8-11e5-ab92-c75ae6ab94b5_story.html

Perry, in what a number are calling a stumble, said something like it was a “drug induced accident”.

nationaljournal.com/2016-elections/confederate-flag-carly-fiorina-republican-presidential-20150620

“I think it’s clearly a symbol that is very offensive to many, but my personal opinion is not what’s relevant here,” she told reporters at the Faith and Freedom Coalition’s “Road to Majority” conference in D.C. “What’s relevant here is what the people of South Carolina choose to do next.”

I just quoted what she said, I’m not sure if the article is correct otherwise in portraying her comments.

But again, when one looks at the situation, the Republicans have nothing to do with the CSA flag, it’s not in their heritage or history really.

 

[Path_Finder]

ABC news:

“In the 21st century, that flag shouldn’t be on the Capitol ground in the state of South Carolina,” Pataki said on Fox News. "I think they’ll do the right thing. They’ll remove the flag.”

Jeb Bush, also a Republican, believes the Confederate flag should be taken down from the South Carolina State Capitol, as was done in Florida during his tenure as governor, a Bush spokesperson told ABC News.

NO FIRM POSITION ON THE FLAG
Many declared and potential 2016 candidates wouldn’t give a clear answer on whether the flag should be removed. Republican candidates including Ted Cruz, Carly Fiorina, Mike Huckabee, Bobby Jindal, Rick Perry, Marco Rubio, and Rick Santorum have argued the decision should be made by the people of South Carolina.

abcnews.go.com/Politics/2016-candidates-stand-confederate-flag-issue/story?id=31947516

The article seems to say Gov. Scott Walker backed up Nikki Haley’s comments and that is that the flag should be taken down.

 

[ishii]

Now that you ask “which candidate struggled”, a number did actually. Romney, not a candidate, I believe did come out saying something like the flag should be taken down.

Rubio, declined to say whether he would vote to take the flag down, Walker seems to say something like now is not the right time to discuss this tragedy right after these people have been killed.

washingtonpost.com/politics/while-gop-candidates-stammer-clinton-directly-confronts-race/2015/06/22/6414dd66-18f8-11e5-ab92-c75ae6ab94b5_story.html

Perry, in what a number are calling a stumble, said something like it was a “drug induced accident”.

nationaljournal.com/2016-elections/confederate-flag-carly-fiorina-republican-presidential-20150620

I just quoted what she said, I’m not sure if the article is correct otherwise in portraying her comments.

But again, when one looks at the situation, the Republicans have nothing to do with the CSA flag, it’s not in their heritage or history really.

So we are equating a candidate’s position on the confederate flag with whether or not they think the attack was a racist attack? (with the exception of Rick Perry’s lame stumble - nothing new there).

What does the position on the confederate flag have to do with whether or not the attack was racially motivated?

My own personal opinion on the Confederate flag is that the people of the state in question should decide if they want it flying or not. I have no affinity for it at all.

Ishii

 

[Path_Finder]

So we are equating a candidate’s position on the confederate flag with whether or not they think the attack was a racist attack? (with the exception of Rick Perry’s lame stumble - nothing new there).

What does the position on the confederate flag have to do with whether or not the attack was racially motivated?

Ishii

Maybe so. You were the one characterizing Dr. Carson’s words as possibly trying to stay relevant. Seeing how he has polled better than most of those running, I’d call that a mis-characterization.

 

[ishii]

Maybe so. You were the one characterizing Dr. Carson’s words as possibly trying to stay relevant. Seeing how he has polled better than most of those running, I’d call that a mis-characterization.

Most of those being the also rans. CNN poll has him running 8th among contenders. ABC news poll has him tied for 7th place. Not a mischaracterization. Trust me, Carson will not be the GOP nominee, nor should he be. Health and Human Services maybe, or Surgeon General, but not president or vice-president.

What does the position on whether the confederate flag flying have to do with whether the attack was racially motivated ?

Ishii

 

[Path_Finder]

Most of those being the also rans. CNN poll has him running 8th among contenders. ABC news poll has him tied for 7th place. Not a mischaracterization. Trust me, Carson will not be the GOP nominee, nor should he be. Health and Human Services maybe, or Surgeon General, but not president or vice-president.

What does the position on whether the confederate flag flying have to do with whether the attack was racially motivated ?

Ishii

Dr. Carson is hardly only in front of also rans, not a very kind remark. Stating he is trying to stay relevant is clearly a disparaging remark. CNN is not the only poll out there.


The Weekly Standard informal poll

Dr. Carson is in fifth, ahead of 6 known runners and in fact, ahead of others not recorded in the poll such as Christie, Trump and so on. **Only Huckabee is an “also ran”.
**
Quinnipiac poll showed in an article May 30:

**
Ben Carson Among Top Five Republican Contenders Tied for Lead, New Poll Says**
Read more at christianpost.com/news/ben-carson-among-top-five-republican-contenders-tied-for-lead-new-poll-says-139773/#Oh42L6kodAqeCjbh.99

The top five contenders are former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush, former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee, Florida Sen. Marco Rubio and Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker, apart from Carson, according to the national survey conducted May 19-26 among 1,711 voters across the country.

Seeing how Carson’s figures are similar to Bush and Rubio, I doubt one would say of Marco, “well, Rubio is just leading the also rans”.

Nobody is discussing whether Dr. Carson will or not be the GOP nominee. Only correcting what seems to be a bit of a remark made on Dr. Carson that he was trying to stay relevant or however it was worded.

And the flag issue is only being discussed because of the shooting in Charleston, that is obvious. Many people including Fiorina said the flag seemed racist to her. If you want to think these situations are unrelated, that is fine. So in this vein, I think the two situations are very much related.

Again, maybe I erred there and mis-characterized that. Just as calling one of the front runners per the Quinnipiac poll “trying to stay relevant” seems over the top as well.

June 15th Breitbart:

A national political poll by Monmouth University ranks retired neurosurgeon Dr. Ben Carson in first place.

• Republican and Republican-leaning voters are divided among commentator Dr. Ben Carson (11%), Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker (10%), Bush (9%), Rubio (9%), and former Arkansas Governor Mike Huckabee (8%).

– Other preferences include Kentucky Senator Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY)

(6%), Texas Senator Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX)

(5%), New Jersey Governor Chris Christie (4%), former Texas Governor Rick Perry (4%), former Pennsylvania Senator Rick Santorum (3%), businesswoman Carly Fiorina (2%), South Carolina Senator Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC)  (2%), and businessman Donald Trump (2%).

– Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal (1%), Ohio Governor John Kasich (1%), and former New York Governor George Pataki (0%) round out the list.

breitbart.com/big-government/2015/06/15/shock-poll-dr-ben-carson-leading-the-pack-as-jeb-bush-anounces-campaign/

So Quinnipiac and Monmouth polls both show Carson ahead of Paul and Cruz, hardly “also rans”.

 

[president_weezy]

The article was very vague about the candidates that Carson might have been talking about.
As the facts come in and settle, I doubt that there will be a single candidate for president in any party that will not see this as racist.

Most Republican candidates, and Republicans in general, choose to ignore that this act of violence was motivated by racism. Frankly, I think they’re running out of other things to blame.

 

[Path_Finder]

Most Republican candidates, and Republicans in general, choose to ignore that this act of violence was motivated by racism. Frankly, I think they’re running out of other things to blame.

The Confederate Flag and that racism has its historic origins in part at least, in the Democratic party.

It’s not for the Republicans to apologize over when even in 1992, the Clinton-Gore ticket had a button with the Confederate Flag. washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2015/06/22/what-those-clinton-gore-confederate-flag-buttons-say-about-politics-in-2015/ Republicans have nothing to do with these things.

 

[Path_Finder]

IF Monmouth and Quinnipiac are obscure and the latter, Quinnipiac is not, **here is the latest NBC Wall Street Journal poll from an article on May 22nd. **

Bush, 22 percent
Walker, 17 percent
Rubio, 14 percent
Carson, 11 percent
Former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee, 9 percent
U.S. Sen. Rand Paul of Kentukcy, 7 percent
Former Texas Gov. Rick Perry, 5 percent
Christie, Cruz, 4 percent
Fiorina, 2 percent
Trump, Kasich, Graham, 1 percent

nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2015/06/christie_in_eighth_place_in_nbc_newswall_street_jo.html

Not bad and I’m not about to consider Former Texas Governor Perry an “also-ran”. Former Governor Huckabee has shown to be at the least “alive” in these polls since one of the others showed him doing good enough and so I would not consider him an “also-ran”, I have my own personal feelings on him but I don’t need to voice it one way or another.

 

[Havard]

** Obama uses N-word, says we are ‘not cured’ of racism **

cnn.com/2015/06/22/politics/barack-obama-n-word-race-relations-marc-maron-interview/index.html

** Ben Carson slams GOP 2016 rivals ‘who dare not call this tragedy an act of racism’**

washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2015/06/22/ben-carson-slams-gop-presidential-rivals-who-dare-not-call-this-tragedy-an-act-of-racism/

Full text of Dr. Carson’s op-ed here:

usatoday.com/story/opinion/2015/06/22/ben-carson-south-carolina-shooting-column/29074387/

Please read the whole thing, because WaPo is, unsurprisingly taking the bits out of context and exaggerating the “slamming” and “chastising”. The tone is positive, and he even expresses his understanding of some people’s reluctance:

I understand the sensitivities. To some, calling the events in Charleston, S.C., a hate crime reinforces a stigma, which they have fought hard to put behind them. But refusing to call it what it is — racism — is a far more dangerous proposition.

And shame on WaPo for using his words to do exactly what he asks people not to do in the piece itself:

When an event of this magnitude occurs in the middle of an election cycle, politicians are often quick to try to score political points, look for scapegoats and easy answers. That’s the lowest common denominator of politics at a time when we need true leadership. Now is the time to abandon political expediency and seize this opportunity to demonstrate what we are really made of as a people, as a great country.

It couldn’t be more clear that his piece is about coming together and healing as a nation.

IMO this thread should be closed, the article and premise its based on is not only false, it’s evil.

 

[ishii]

IF Monmouth and Quinnipiac are obscure and the latter, Quinnipiac is not, **here is the latest NBC Wall Street Journal poll from an article on May 22nd. **

nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2015/06/christie_in_eighth_place_in_nbc_newswall_street_jo.html

Not bad and I’m not about to consider Former Texas Governor Perry an “also-ran”. Former Governor Huckabee has shown to be at the least “alive” in these polls since one of the others showed him doing good enough and so I would not consider him an “also-ran”, I have my own personal feelings on him but I don’t need to voice it one way or another.

Perry and Huckabee, after 2016, will be considered also-rans, as will Carson. But my larger point was to ask what does the position on the confederate flag have to do with calling the shooting an act of racism.

Ishii

 

[ishii]

Full text of Dr. Carson’s op-ed here:

usatoday.com/story/opinion/2015/06/22/ben-carson-south-carolina-shooting-column/29074387/

Please read the whole thing, because WaPo is, unsurprisingly taking the bits out of context and exaggerating the “slamming” and “chastising”. The tone is positive, and he even expresses his understanding of some people’s reluctance:

And shame on WaPo for using his words to do exactly what he asks people not to do in the piece itself:

It couldn’t be more clear that his piece is about coming together and healing as a nation.

IMO this thread should be closed, the article and premise its based on is not only false, it’s evil.

Dr. Carson said:

" But there are people who are claiming that they can lead this country who dare not call this tragedy an act of racism, a hate crime, for fear of offending a particular segment of the electorate."

To whom is Dr. Carson referring? Which candidates have been reluctant to call it racism? And please, do not answer, “because they are vague on taking down the Confederate flag”

Ishii

 

[seekerz]

GOP candidates are reluctant to call the shooting racist? Is Dr. Carson playing the race card out of desperation?

Ishii

What do you mean by “playing the race card”? Is nobody ever allowed to call out racism even when it introduces itself by name?