Obama and Romney Hit Final Stretch Part 3

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Ridgerunner said:
None specifically saying that. Nor is there ever likely to be.

But I think most would agree that we have an affirmative duty to vote. And we have an affirmative moral duty to oppose evil. When we deliberately choose ineffective means of opposing evil, we are failing in that duty, just as we would if we had a pea in one hand and a pistol in the other while witnessing an aggressor strangle another, and pocketed the pistol and threw the pea.
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… and if only Mr. Romney would be consistent on his platform, so we could know which hand is holding the pea, and which, the pistol. I fear that the bishops of the Catholic Church have been cleverly duped by this one.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
No, but it seems we should consider other ways to solve our problems as opposed to trying to legislate them all away.
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I don’t know anyone who suggests that we just pass a law and then do nothing else beyond that, so I think you’re arguing against a position that no one (at least no one I know) actually espouses. 🙂

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Luigi_Daniele said:
I certainly did not say that. 😉

We will be judged on our our…err…judgements, though;)
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So let’s be clear, would not voting or writing in a third party candidate be consistent with Church teaching so that one would not have committed a moral wrong by choosing one of those options?
 
Morwenna said:
I don’t know anyone who suggests that we just pass a law and then do nothing else beyond that, so I think you’re arguing against a position that no one (at least no one I know) actually espouses. 🙂

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Well, we have limited space and time to create a post and cannot argue a position fully. So, please feel free to read back through the chain of posts.
 
Polls: Obama ahead in swing states

usatoday.com/story/theoval/2012/11/02/obama-romney-swing-state-polls/1677809/
A slew of polls Friday give President Obama the edge in eight key swing states that will likely decide the Electoral College next week.
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Obama has small or middling leads in Ohio, Florida, Virginia, Iowa, Colorado, Michigan, Nevada and New Hampshire.
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A separate poll in Colorado gave Republican challenger Mitt Romney a 1-point lead over the president.
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Most of the polls are well within the margin of error, and Romney aides are claiming momentum across the country.
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The Republican candidate will need to win most of these swing states – particularly Ohio – if he is to rack up the 270 or more electoral votes needed to unseat the president.
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Prodigal_Son1 said:
So let’s be clear, would not voting or writing in a third party candidate be consistent with Church teaching so that one would not have committed a moral wrong by choosing one of those options?
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The one thing is clear is that there is no moral wrong in voting for a pro-life candidate, regardless of that candidate’s likeliness to win. The decision not to vote is a little more complicated. We have a duty to vote, but it is unclear whether it is a mortal sin not to vote and in what situations it might be a mortal sin.
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
Well, we have limited space and time to create a post and cannot argue a position fully. So, please feel free to read back through the chain of posts.
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Sorry, I don’t understand this comment. Are you saying that someone here says that just passing a law is all that should be done? :confused: I haven’t seen anyone saying anything like that, in this chain of posts, or any other on CAF.

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stinkcat_14 said:
The one thing is clear is that there is no moral wrong in voting for a pro-life candidate, regardless of that candidate’s likeliness to win. The decision not to vote is a little more complicated. We have a duty to vote, but it is unclear whether it is a mortal sin not to vote and in what situations it might be a mortal sin.
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We have a duty to vote, but the Church does not say for what contests we need vote. Though some think that one must vote in the presidential contest, the Church says nothing about that.
 
stinkcat_14 said:
Of course, the real debate is whether voting for Romney is an effective means of opposing evil.
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For pro-life issues, particularly abortion, voting for Romney is apparently an effective means due mainly to the high probability he will appoint justices to the Supreme Court who will overturn Roe v. Wade. I’m not sure what consequences this will have with regard to the states. It is far less likely, but not entirely impossible, that there may be a legislative push to outlaw abortion in a Romney-Ryan presidency. However, with respect to other issues such as war and poverty, it’s hard to say whether Romney’s policies will be more or less effective than Obama’s since, for one thing, it’s not so clear exactly what his policies may be if he is elected. Nonetheless he has given strong indications he plans to cut entitlement programs and increase military spending. If one believes entitlements are evil, then voting for Romney may very well be more effective.
 
stinkcat_14 said:
The one thing is clear is that there is no moral wrong in voting for a pro-life candidate, regardless of that candidate’s likeliness to win. The decision not to vote is a little more complicated. We have a duty to vote, but it is unclear whether it is a mortal sin not to vote and in what situations it might be a mortal sin.
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Yes, but then we see the ‘we will be judged…for our judgements’ in the response. Seems there’s something not being said.

But the one thing for sure stinkcat_14, you and I agree, with maybe an exception of not voting. My conscience leads me to think that voting for a man to solve our problems is placing one before Him, and that’s an easy thing for us to agree is wrong. I assume…:confused:
 
Presidential Polls Update, Rasmussen Poll Shows Romney And Obama Tied
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enstarz.com/articles/8813/20121102/presidential-polls-update-rasmussen-romney-obama-tied.htm
The latest presidential polls show Governor Mitt Romney and President Barack Obama evenly matched.
As of Friday, Mitt Romney tied Barack Obama in voter support, according to Rasmussen Report’s daily presidential poll. Each candidate received support from 48 percent of voters, with 1 percent supporting a third-party candidate and 3 percent still undecided.
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538 gives the President an 81% chance of winning…he correctly called 49 of 50 states in 2008.
 
Morwenna said:
Sorry, I don’t understand this comment. Are you saying that someone here says that just passing a law is all that should be done? :confused: I haven’t seen anyone saying anything like that, in this chain of posts, or any other on CAF.

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I was responding to a post that stated something to the affect of ‘murder is murder, is it not.’

Maybe the confusion is mine. It happens when I participate on multiple threads where several discussions are very similar. I’ll apologize for any confusion, as I’m not seeing your point, or a point that needs be argued. 🤷
 
meltzerboy said:
If one believes entitlements are evil, then voting for Romney may very well be more effective.
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Actually, it is not clear that Romney really has an courage to do anything about entitlements. I think that even if you like entitlements it is not too hard to figure out that something needs to be done about them, even Alice Rivlin, a pro Obama economist has argued that. If you are looking for a solution to entitlements then I definitely think we need a third party candidate.
 
nbc15.com/election/headlines/In-West-Allis-Romney-Warns-Against-Re-Electing-Obama-176969981.html

President Obama was in Wisconsin campaigning yesterday and was praised by former Green Bay Packer Cornerback Charles Woodson for his “bipartisanship approach in providing storm relief on the East Coast.” according to NBC’s Madison, Wisconsin’s TV affiliate.

If Packer endorsements tip the balance in Wisconsin four days from now, Mitt Romney saw the President’s cornerback, and raised him a Hall of Fame two time Super Bowl winning Quarterback today with an endorsement from Vince Lombardi-era MVP and former Packer coach Bart Starr.

After stops in Eau Claire, Racine and his hometown of Janesville earlier in the week, GOP vice presidential candidate** Paul Ryan** ventured across the state line into Cedar Falls, Iowa
firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/11/02/14887629-ryan-optimistic-in-iowa-campaign-stop?lite
Ryan, a seven-term Wisconsin congressman, told the nearly 1,000-person crowd it could come down to two states.
“Our two states right here – Wisconsin and Iowa – we can tip it over. We can make the difference right here in Iowa,” he said. “Look, in 2008 President Obama won our states. A lot of our fellow Iowans and Wisconsinites looked at the message. They looked at hope and change and it sounded great and so a lot of people voted for that. The president made a lot of grand promises. He said he would heal the partisan wounds and bring people together. This is the most partisan time I have seen in Washington.”
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Meanwhile Vice President Joe Biden delighted the gaffe-watchers by coming close enough to saying " … there wasn’t a day in the last four years when I (DISPUTED) been proud to be his vice president." to stir water cooler conversation. The disputed bracket above stands for an unfortunate place to slur or mumble something that could easily be interpreted as ***“I’ve” ***due to its brevity. In a possible defense the slur was possibly "I ain’t" reduced to a syllable - which in any rate is what the embattled VP undoubtedly meant.

theblaze.com/stories/another-biden-gaffe-theres-never-been-a-day-in-the-last-four-years-ive-been-proud-to-be-his-vice-president/

Gaffes are funny though, and people like to laugh whatever their politics.

If Biden just committed a gaffe it’d be more about timing and place than substance. Or maybe it’d be the further damage to his reputation - which even he has joked about.

This might be funnier than Dan Quayle’s ruling with an answer card’s false spelling of “potato” as “potatoe” during a spelling bee … but IMO not as funny as this social reference that some speechwriter handed off to (apparently baseball fuzzy) Senator Ted Kennedy - back when Mark Mc Gwire and Sammy Sosa’s Home Run Chase was the hottest thing on the daily news.

youtube.com/watch?v=AggeSjZwx6s

AH sports and politics! I must say, Bart Starr for Wisconsin is a coup.

I can’t think of a similar one for Ohio. Maybe Jack Niclaus. But he’s not in the same class as Starr. Jim Brown? They loved him in Cleveland. Pete Rose? They loved him in Cincinnati. But each had baggage and weren’t popular everywhere in the state like Bart Starr is in Wisconsin.

I wonder what other swing state celebrities are gettting phone calls from campaign offices about now.

Iowa: Gold medal wrestler Dan Gable, a legend as an Iowa Hawkeye and in High School?

Nevada: Jerry Tarkanian who brought Nevada a bit of major league status with his national champion UNLV Running Rebels in 1990?

Colorado: So who is John Elway voting for?

Your nominees for swing state celebrity endorsements?
 
Prodigal_Son1 said:
I was responding to a post that stated something to the affect of ‘murder is murder, is it not.’

Maybe the confusion is mine. It happens when I participate on multiple threads where several discussions are very similar. I’ll apologize for any confusion, as I’m not seeing your point, or a point that needs be argued. 🤷
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I was just trying to understand your point in posting that laws against murder haven’t stopped murder … pretty sure that everyone here is well aware of that fact. :o So, it sounded to me as though you weren’t in favor of laws against murder (abortion in this case), using the argument that since laws against other forms of murder haven’t ended murder, it would be therefore be pointless to pass a law against abortion.

If I misunderstood and this isn’t what you meant, then I apologize for the miscommunication. 🙂

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