Obama, Catholic hierarchy at impasse over contraception policy

[catharina]

foxnews.com/politics/2012/02/13/obama-catholic-hierarchy-at-impasse/

"WASHINGTON – The standoff between the Obama administration and the Catholic Church intensified Monday, as a leading clergyman freshly urged Catholics and worshippers in other religions to protest a federal policy that the White House indicated it is not inclined to revise further.

“People need to speak up,” Cardinal Donald Wuerl, Archbishop of Washington, said during an appearance Monday on the Fox News program “America’s Newsroom.”

“There’s one thing in the heart of this nation that we’re counting on, and that’s the basic fairness of the American people.”

At issue is a ruling last month by the Department of Health and Human Services mandating that all employers provide free access to contraception for female workers. Devout Catholics oppose the use of contraception and objected to the rule as an attack on religious liberty, arguing the federal government was forcing Catholic-affiliated charities, hospitals and schools to violate deeply held doctrine. …"

Read more: foxnews.com/politics/2012/02/13/obama-catholic-hierarchy-at-impasse/#ixzz1mKL0J6NQ

 

[JimG]

“We never set out with the assumption that everyone would be satisfied with this balanced approach,” White House Press Secretary Jay Carney told reporters at Monday’s daily press briefing. “And I would simply note with regard to the bishops that they never supported health care reform to begin with.”

foxnews.com/politics/2012/02/13/obama-catholic-hierarchy-at-impasse/#ixzz1mKQ64JB3

Really? The bishops never supported health care reform??
It seems to me that there was a lot of (name removed by moderator)ut favorable to health care reform that was coming from the bishops and from the USCCB. The problem was that they wanted abortion excluded. Obama wouldn’t hear of excluding abortion.

And a “balanced approach?”

Just how does one balance a governmental attack on one’s ability to practice one’s religion?

Is it balanced that we can still practice our religion if we pay a fine?

Really??

I guess that if Henry VIII agreed to chop off your head rather than have you hanged, drawn, and quartered, that would be a balanced approach too.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

Today, the White House suggested that political motivations could be driving those still opposed to the revised HHS rule.

“We never set out with the assumption that everyone would be satisfied with this balanced approach,” White House Press Secretary Jay Carney told reporters at Monday’s daily press briefing. “And I would simply note with regard to the bishops that they never supported health care reform to begin with.”

1. That’s not exactly true. The USCCB supported the health care reform minus abortion coverage.
2. If there’s no new negotiations on the matter because the USCCB, in their view, didn’t support Obamacare then just who exactly is the one playing politics?

 

[SVP]

The “contraception policy” is a smoke screen obscuring a looming larger issue of religious freedom and everyone’s First Amendment rights.

 

[The_Rock]

[
](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rules_for_Radicals)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rules_for_Radicals
Saul David Alinsky
According to Alinsky, the organizer — especially a paid organizer from outside — must first overcome suspicion and establish credibility. Next the organizer must begin the task of agitating: rubbing resentments, fanning hostilities, and searching out controversy. This is necessary to get people to participate. An organizer has to attack apathy and disturb the prevailing patterns of complacent community life where people have simply come to accept a situation. Alinsky would say, “The first step in community organization is community disorganization.”
Through a process combining hope and resentment, the organizer tries to create a “mass army” that brings in as many recruits as possible from local organizations, churches, services groups, labor unions, corner gangs, and individuals.
According to Alinsky, the main job of the organizer is to bait an opponent into reacting. “The enemy properly goaded and guided in his reaction will be your major strength.”

Was the “accommodation” planned out ahead of time?

Propose a mandate that is sure to infuriate your enemy, then split the opposition by proposing a compromise that really only gives an excuse for those who want to break camp anyway. Note that the dissenters from Church authority on this forum were largely quiet until the “compromise” was proposed. You then have split the enemy and created resentment for the legitimate authority. Classic Alinsky

 

[po18guy]

%between%
Was the “accommodation” planned out ahead of time?

Propose a mandate that is sure to infuriate your enemy, then split the opposition by proposing a compromise that really only gives an excuse for those who want to break camp anyway. Note that the dissenters from Church authority on this forum were largely quiet until the “compromise” was proposed. You then have split the enemy and created resentment for the legitimate authority. Classic Alinsky

In the late 1960s, I learned about the “two steps forward, one back” strategy of the far left. They seriously need a new dance. It also wouldn’t hurt if some advisors of the USCCB studied economics, either. Government anything - health care or potatoes, is guaranteed to be in short supply.

No one has shown where this trillion dollar Obamess will build one clinic, produce one doctor, or introduce one new drug. It does grant government vast new control, as we are seeing.

 

[baylee]

“We never set out with the assumption that everyone would be satisfied with this balanced approach,” White House Press Secretary Jay Carney told reporters at Monday’s daily press briefing. "And I would simply note with regard to the bishops that they never supported health care reform to begin with."

And I thought I couldn’t get any angrier over this.

 

[Graubo3]

The “contraception policy” is a smoke screen obscuring a looming larger issue of religious freedom and everyone’s First Amendment rights.

One way to conquer is to divide your foe.

 

[manualman]

It’s amazing how dishonest Obama’s guys are. They keep presenting this as if it were the only way people could ever get contraception. Do they not know there is a Walgreens already on every third street corner??

This isn’t about access, it is about control. The HHS mandate is about making those who don’t want contraceptives pay for the contraceptives of those who do want them.

Tell the politicians: Let them buy their own!

Wouldn’t that be the true “pro-choice” solution here??

 

[Erich]

The “contraception policy” is a smoke screen obscuring a looming larger issue of religious freedom and everyone’s First Amendment rights.

Amen!

From this link:
At the prospect that institutions associated with the Catholic Church would be required to offer to their employees health insurance covering contraception and abortifacients, the bishops, priests, and nuns scream bloody murder. But they raise no objection at all to the fact that Catholic employers and corporations, large and small, owned wholly or partially by Roman Catholics will be required to do the same. The freedom of the church as an institution to distance itself from that which its doctrines decry as morally wrong is considered sacrosanct. The liberty of its members – not to mention the liberty belonging to the adherents of other Christian sects, to Jews, Muslims, and non-believers – to do the same they are perfectly willing to sacrifice.

 

[iloveangels]

Amen!

From this link:
At the prospect that institutions associated with the Catholic Church would be required to offer to their employees health insurance covering contraception and abortifacients, the bishops, priests, and nuns scream bloody murder. But they raise no objection at all to the fact that Catholic employers and corporations, large and small, owned wholly or partially by Roman Catholics will be required to do the same. The freedom of the church as an institution to distance itself from that which its doctrines decry as morally wrong is considered sacrosanct. The liberty of its members – not to mention the liberty belonging to the adherents of other Christian sects, to Jews, Muslims, and non-believers – to do the same they are perfectly willing to sacrifice.

There is a difference between a well-known and formally stated precept of a religion, such as the opposition to abortion, and the statistics of people doing it.

Precept. Statistics.

This is not about statistics. This is about whether we have the right to have the precept. The government is trying to dictate to us what our religion should be.

 

[Erich]

There is a difference between a well-known and formally stated precept of a religion, such as the opposition to abortion, and the statistics of people doing it.

I was referring not to the fact that there are Catholics who use ABC, have abortions, etc., but to the fact that Joe and Mary Catholic, who happen to own their own small business that is not in any way affiliated with the Church, are also being required to offer to their employees health insurance covering contraception and abortifacients.

This is about whether we have the right to have the precept. The government is trying to dictate to us what our religion should be.

And what kind of milk we can drink!

 

[iloveangels]

I was referring not to the fact that there are Catholics who use ABC, have abortions, etc., but to the fact that Joe and Mary Catholic, who happen to own their own small business that is not in any way affiliated with the Church, are also being required to offer to their employees health insurance covering contraception and abortifacients.

Yes, well they’re participating in something they shouldn’t. Maybe they didn’t know that up til now.

 

[Erich]

Yes, well they’re participating in something they shouldn’t. Maybe they didn’t know that up til now.

What, individual Catholics are not allowed to own their own small businesses?

Whether they were or were not offering to their employees health insurance covering contraception and abortifacients before, under the HHS mandate they are being required to do so – whether or not they agree or disagree!

 

[iloveangels]

What, individual Catholics are not allowed to own their own small businesses?

Whether they were or were not offering to their employees health insurance covering contraception and abortifacients before, under the HHS mandate they are being required to do so – whether or not they agree or disagree!

Individual Catholics can, of course, own their own businesses. However, it is a mortal sin to participate in procuring abortions, even if they’re not your abortions. This has been church teaching for centuries.

Now, it is a fact that many people don’t know what’s in their insurance policies, and what they’re paying for when they pay their premiums. They should find out.

 

[Erich]

Individual Catholics can, of course, own their own businesses. However, it is a mortal sin to participate in procuring abortions, even if they’re not your abortions. This has been church teaching for centuries.

Now, it is a fact that many people don’t know what’s in their insurance policies, and what they’re paying for when they pay their premiums. They should find out.

We’re somehow not seeing eye to eye. My point all along has been that, as a result of the new HHS mandate, individual Catholics who who don’t want contraceptives and abortifacients are now being required to pay for those who do want them. They are finding out – and they don’t like it, and so far there’s not a whole lot they can do about it.