Obama vs Romney, who are you voting for and why?

[ishii]

lol, Romney is not winning this election.

Romney might win, or Obama/NYTimes/Washington Post/CNN/ABC/NBC/CBS/MSNBC might win. Either way, your comment doesn’t even consider the substance of my post.

Ishii

 

[Michael_Mayo]

Early in our nations history there was an extreme anti-Catholic sentiment.
The spoken fear was that the Church would be telling us how to vote.
Were they right?

 

[universityprof]

You’re going to get a lot more Romney supporters because the vast majority on this forum are political conservatives.

But I’m voting for Obama: Wow there are so many reasons it’s not even close for me. Here are several but not an exhaustive list.

If we don’t change the House of Representaives, I want a check and balance to the Tea Party and much of what today’s Republican Party stands for.

Obama finally got something done on healthcare. The sick with pre existing conditions before Obamacare could be denied health care coverage. And too many people in the richest nation on earth have gone without adequate healthcare because they do not have employer health care coverage or do not qualify for Medicaid or Medicare. This has always been a disgrace to me when other industrialized countries have been able to provide their citizens with universal healthcare and the richest on nation has failed miserably at doing so. Obamacare is not perfect. I’d have preferred single payer or a public option. But is better than the status quo.

I totally reject the Paul Ryan budget which was supported by nearly every Republican. I want Paul Ryan nowhere near the White House. Like Sister Simone of the Catholic faith and the other nuns on the bus, I will not sit back and do nothing to try to stop such severe cuts to programs affecting the poor. I completely reject a philosophy that it is moral to cut food stamps, to cut healthcare and programs like Headstart. While the Republicans increase defense spending and refuse to even come to the table if it means asking the wealthiest among us to pay a little more in the form of a tax rate increase. I will not stand aside while the Republicans try to balance the budget on the backs of the poor and the middle class without asking more sacrifice from the rich. I also oppose the Medicare plan Ryan had in his budget.

Obama inherited the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression. Look up how many jobs per month we were losing before he took office. We’ve been gaining jobs for many months under Obama. No one claims we are where we need to be but the economy is turning around compared to where it was and I’m willing to give it more time.

The auto industry is alive.

The Iraq war is over. And Obama has a plan in place to bring troops home from Afghanistan. While Romney did not even mention Afghanistan in his convention speech. The expense of these 2 wars has been tremendous. And I fear the same neo cons who advised George W Bush advise Romney.

I’m glad because of President Obama children of immigrants, young people who know our country as their home and who pledge alliegance to the same flag I do, today are not living in fear of deportation.

Osama Bin Laden was found under the direction of this Commander in Chief.

There’s more but that’s quite a number of my reasons.

This response is well crafted and logical. Great post CMatt25! Just to add, we are in big trouble if we vote on a single issue such as abortion as many have suggested we do on this forum. Look at the overall good of President Obama. For starters, he did something that has been needed for a long time, something that presidents before him have tried but failed to do - fundamental heath care reform.

 

[Richca]

Quote:
Originally Posted by CMatt25
Also to my dear practicing Catholic friends who have expressed support for Obama. You know I am totally with you on voting in this election. But how do you respond when the “non negotiables” are tossed at you by your fellow Catholics?

It’s very simple. Here is this document:

ewtn.com/library/CURIA/cdfworthycom.htm

This kind of logic sounds very similar to this scripture passage in Isaiah 5:20:

“Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil,
who change darkness to light, and light into darkness
who change bitter to sweet, and sweet into bitter!” (Isaiah 5:20)

So,in a nutshell,you feel better about voting for Obama,who has a record of being pro abortion,anytime under every circumstance,as opposed to Romney,who you are not certain will lessen abortionGo figure…

Jeanne S: I agree with you…Go figure. CMatt25 and Al Moritz, I’m praying for you.

 

[RACJ]

lol, Romney is not winning this election.

I’m glad that YOU see the humor, with my children’s futures at stake in this election. The thought of the continuation of this corrupt, Constitution-despising man in office should cause you to shudder. Rob

 

[Al_Moritz]

II. THE FORMATION OF CONSCIENCE

1783 Conscience must be informed and moral judgment enlightened. A well-formed conscience is upright and truthful. It formulates its judgments according to reason, in conformity with the true good willed by the wisdom of the Creator. The education of conscience is indispensable for human beings who are subjected to negative influences and tempted by sin to prefer their own judgment and to reject authoritative teachings.

1784 The education of the conscience is a lifelong task. From the earliest years, it awakens the child to the knowledge and practice of the interior law recognized by conscience. Prudent education teaches virtue; it prevents or cures fear, selfishness and pride, resentment arising from guilt, and feelings of complacency, born of human weakness and faults. The education of the conscience guarantees freedom and engenders peace of heart.

1785 In the formation of conscience the Word of God is the light for our path,54 we must assimilate it in faith and prayer and put it into practice. We must also examine our conscience before the Lord’s Cross. We are assisted by the gifts of the Holy Spirit, aided by the witness or advice of others and guided by the authoritative teaching of the Church.55

Etc. as quoted.

Thank you for the well-meant but sligtly misplaced lesson. My conscience is formed that way. I already have mentioned the criteria regarding voting that I follow – the criteria laid out by Cardinal Ratzinger, the currrent Pope, in his function of Prefect of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.

 

[Al_Moritz]

This kind of logic sounds very similar to this scripture passage in Isaiah 5:20:

“Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil,
who change darkness to light, and light into darkness
who change bitter to sweet, and sweet into bitter!” (Isaiah 5:20)

See my previous post.

CMatt25 and Al Moritz, I’m praying for you.

Thank you, that is always a good thing.

 

[RACJ]

This kind of logic sounds very similar to this scripture passage in Isaiah 5:20:
“Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil,
who change darkness to light, and light into darkness
who change bitter to sweet, and sweet into bitter!” (Isaiah 5:20)
Jeanne S: I agree with you…Go figure. CMatt25 and Al Moritz, I’m praying for you.

The problem with some of the leftists on this site is that they regard elections as sports contests. They fail to look at the actual man (or woman). Democrat, good; Republican, bad. They are looking for ways to win an argument, based upon who is on which team. Sadly, it is THEIR posterity which will suffer as well if radical socialism prevails in this election. How many times must socialism lead to catastrophe on this earth before the fans of this ghastly team get the message? Before the next election, if Obama wins, America WILL become Greece. Rob

 

[CMatt25]

:thumbsup:GREAT POST MATT!

Peace, Carlan

Thank you Carlan. Peace be with you too.

 

[Al_Moritz]

The problem with some of the leftists on this site is that they regard elections as sports contests. They fail to look at the actual man (or woman). Democrat, good; Republican, bad. They are looking for ways to win an argument, based upon who is on which team. Sadly, it is THEIR posterity which will suffer as well if radical socialism prevails in this election. How many times must socialism lead to catastrophe on this earth before the fans of this ghastly team get the message? Before the next election, if Obama wins, America WILL become Greece. Rob

Well, first I am no leftist as I have explained several times already (I might have voted for Huntsman had he been the candidate, which he could not have been in today’s crazy GOP), and second you are mistaken. But you are entitled to your opinion of course.

 

[CMatt25]

This response is well crafted and logical. Great post CMatt25! Just to add, we are in big trouble if we vote on a single issue such as abortion as many have suggested we do on this forum. Look at the overall good of President Obama. For starters, he did something that has been needed for a long time, something that presidents before him have tried but failed to do - fundamental heath care reform.

Thank you so much.

 

[Jeffrey]

We can’t post political cartoons, and this link won’t work after today, but check out the “He said there’d be bumps” cartoon on RealClearPolitics today (right hand side…item 1): realclearpolitics.com/

 

[RACJ]

Well, first I am no leftist as I have explained several times already (I might have voted for Huntsman had he been the candidate, which he could not have been in today’s crazy GOP), and second you are mistaken. But you are entitled to your opinion of course.

Al, gas prices HAVE doubled, oil rigs and coal mines have been shut down, Christians of conscience have been kicked in the teeth, solar industry campaign bundlers have been paid off, $800B failed stimulus, hundreds killed in a heinous gun giveaway to drug cartels, including Border Agent Brian Terry, failure to protect embassies on 9/11 after warnings, etc, etc. The list is endless. Obama is on your team, I understand, and you too are entitled to your opinion. Err…what is so bad about Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan again?

 

[RACJ]

Thank you so much.

And you two can justify the killing of more innocents how? BTW, pro-life is not the only issue, of course, but it is a disqualifying issue to those of us who care about the sanctity of human life. But there needs to be competence. Mitt has succeeded at virtually everything he has touched. Obama has been an arrogant, tragic failure as President, and the only thing that he ever has succeeded at in his life running for office, with the tireless assistance of the obfuscating mass media freight train! :bigyikes: Rob

 

[HansTrappist]

So you do not believe Romney is being honest when he says he will pass pro life restrictions?

You do not believe Ryan when he said he guarantees the HHS mandate will be rescinded?

Nope.

Why should anyone believe them. Their records belie their rhetoric.

 

[ringil]

And you two can justify the killing of more innocents how? BTW, pro-life is not the only issue, of course, but it is a disqualifying issue to those of us who care about the sanctity of human life. But there needs to be competence. Mitt has succeeded at virtually everything he has touched. Obama has been an arrogant, tragic failure as President, and the only thing that he ever has succeeded at in his life running for office, with the tireless assistance of the obfuscating mass media freight train! :bigyikes: Rob

Leave it to Rob, for the “subtle” posts. . .

BTW, what kind of “Christian” are you? Evangelical?

 

[CMatt25]

Answers to what are not and what are proportionate reasons

Thanks for this Abyssinia. It helped me a lot. I didn’t exactly see a total consensus. But because Burke is so often quoted on CAF by Romney supporters, I was especially intrigued by his words: “What is a proportionate reason to justify favoring the taking of an innocent, defenseless human life? That’s the question that has to be answered in your conscience.”

Sure he went on to say it is difficult for him to imagine what the proportionate reason would be. But that sounds a lot like when I read about Cardinal Dolan, President of the USCCB saying despite not agreeing with Paul Ryan on everything, that he only speaks personally when he says his long time friend is a great public servant.

It’s beginning to me to look rather all personal opinion or politics to me. Catholics who vote Republican or are conservative politically, come up with their reasons. And Catholics who are less conservative politically, have theirs.

 

[rlg94086]

Thanks for this Abyssinia. It helped me a lot. I didn’t exactly see a total consensus. But because Burke is so often quoted on CAF by Romney supporters, I was especially intrigued by his words:** “What is a proportionate reason to justify favoring the taking of an innocent, defenseless human life? That’s the question that has to be answered in your conscience.”**

Sure he went on to say it is difficult for him to imagine what the proportionate reason would be. But that sounds a lot like when I read about Cardinal Dolan, President of the USCCB saying despite not agreeing with Paul Ryan on everything, that he only speaks personally when he says his long time friend is a great public servant.

It’s beginning to me to look rather all personal opinion or politics to me. Catholics who vote Republican or are conservative politically, come up with their reasons. And Catholics who are less conservative politically, have theirs.

Here’s the thing, CMatt25…see if you can answer this honestly.

If the innocent, defenseless human lives were adults…let’s say, just for argument’s sake, Jewish Americans…would you allow people to choose to kill millions of them and consider the complete ending of poverty in America (that’s right…not even a poorly performing social program…complete end to poverty!) a proportionate reason?

 

[HansTrappist]

Reagan inherited a recession from Carter and in 2 years turned the economy around to become prosperous. Bush inherited a recession too. If other presidents turned around a recession they inherited there is no excuse for Obama. It is his policies that are inhibiting a recovery. You can not blame the congress, Obama had 2 years of a majority demcorat house and senate and got everything he wanted passed

Did not call Obama a food stamp president but the fact is that under his presidency 15 million more people have gone on food stamps

Obama has been president for nearly 4 years - when will you allow him to take responsibility?

Comparing Reagan and Bush is an insult to the memory of Ronald Reagan.

Reagan’s Assistant Secretary of the Treasury, Paul Roberts, explains it like this:

Reagan was not a member of the Republican Establishment. He defeated the Establishment’s candidate, George H. W. Bush for the Republican presidential nomination. By appealing to Democratic as well as Republican voters, Reagan had a great electoral victory. Reagan had two goals: one was to end stagflation, the other was to end the cold war. He was not much interested in anything else. The “arms race” and the “anti-ballistic missile defense–star wars” were never real. They were threats used to bring Gorbachev to negotiate the end of the cold war. Unlike the present Republican Party, Reagan wanted peace, not war.

I know this because when I succeeded in establishing the new economic policy that cured stagflation, President Reagan appointed me to a super-secret presidential committee that had subpoena power over the CIA.

The CIA opposed Reagan’s effort to end the cold war, as did the powerful military-security complex, about which President Dwight Eisenhower warned the American people in his last address to the American nation. The end of the cold war threatened the profits of the powerful military industries and the power of the CIA.

The CIA said that the Soviet Union would win an arms race, because the Soviet Union could control investment, unlike the US, and could allocate the entire Gross Domestic Product of the Soviet Empire to the military. Reagan’s secret committee over-ruled the CIA.

I had been a member of the US-USSR student exchange program to the Soviet Union in 1961 and had observed the situation. My first book (1971) said that the Soviet economy had failed. When decades later I addressed the Soviet Academy of Sciences in Moscow in 1989 and 1990, members of the Economic Institute brought me copies of my book to be autographed. And I had thought that censorship existed in the Soviet Union.

The Soviet Union collapsed three years after Reagan left office. It came as a surprise to those of us who had helped Reagan to end the cold war and dispose of the nuclear war threat.

Myself and many other Reagan supporters opposed the extension of NATO to Russia’s reduced borders. What the world seems to be unaware of is that the Soviet collapse unleashed a new, highly dangerous ideology in the US known as neoconservatism. The neoconservative ideology, unleashed by the Soviet collapse, is a form of Marxism in which American “democratic capitalism” instead of the proletariat has won history’s verdict - ”the end of history.” Americans are the “indispensable people,” and the US is the “indispensable nation” with the right and responsibility to establish its hegemony over the world. Adolf Hitler called the same thing “Aryan Superiority.” Now Washington asserts the superiority. The neoconservative ideology threatens the world with nuclear war.

The US is bankrupt. However, the US dollar remains the world reserve currency. This means that the US can print money to pay its bills. As long as the world accepts the dollar as world reserve currency, the US will be able to continue its wars.

I will never again be permitted to serve as an adviser to the president of the US. Since the Clinton presidency, the only permitted advisers are those who lie for the government. I will not do that.

I am unsure that America can be taken out of economic crisis. Much of the most productive part of the US economy has been moved offshore in order to increase corporate profits, the performance-based bonuses for executive compensation and capital gains to equity owners. The US has lost critical supply chains, industrial infrastructure, and the knowledge of skilled workers.

Theoretically, the US could bring its corporations back to America by taxing their profits according to the geographical location in which value is added to their product. If value is added abroad, in China or India, for example, the tax rate would be high. If value was added domestically in the US, the tax rate would be low.

The US could also resort to the protective tariffs that were responsible for its rise as an economic power.

These changes would be difficult to enact as the changes are contrary to the material interests of the one percent.

The US today is ruled by an oligarchy of private interests. The US government is not very independent of the powerful interest groups that fund political campaigns. The US ceased being a democracy during the Clinton administration.

Hopefully, Mr. Robert’s rumination helps make clear the big difference between a Bush and a Reagan.

 

[CMatt25]

CMatt25 and Al Moritz, I’m praying for you.

Thank you so much. James did teach us to pray for one another. A strong prayer life and prayers for others I try to maintain as well. God bless you and peace be with you.