One Nation Under God

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While I’ve got no problem with the “Pledge”, I think it should be 100% voluntary. Forcing anyone to say it smacks of facism to me.
 
No one is forced to recite the pledge. See West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette (1943).

Just curious, why does forcing someone to recite the pledge remind you of fascism? Hasn’t been a serious fascist threat in the west for 60 years. The other form of socialism–communism–intruded on the lives of individuals far more than fascism ever did and it still exists as a world wide threat.
 
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Snicker:
While I’ve got no problem with the “Pledge”, I think it should be 100% voluntary. Forcing anyone to say it smacks of facism to me.
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As far as I know it is 100% voluntary.
 
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David_Paul:
No one is forced to recite the pledge. See West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette (1943).

Just curious, why does forcing someone to recite the pledge remind you of fascism? Hasn’t been a serious fascist threat in the west for 60 years. The other form of socialism–communism–intruded on the lives of individuals far more than fascism ever did and it still exists as a world wide threat.
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As I have stated before: al-Qaeda, the Taliban and the Baathists are all fascists.
 
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gilliam:
As far as I know it is 100% voluntary.
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You may be right…been out of school for a while. All I know is when I was in school, I wasn’t left with the impression that reciting the pledge was voluntary.
 
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gilliam:
As I have stated before: al-Qaeda, the Taliban and the Baathists are all fascists.
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The comment was about American schools. Those groups are not involved with what is required in our government schools.

The pledge and other issues (such as a minute of silence) are minor concerns anyways. Same groups which worry about “God” being mentioned in the pledge see nothing authoritarian about mandatory attendence laws. In fact, they fight those who want school choice expanded.
 
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Snicker:
You may be right…been out of school for a while. All I know is when I was in school, I wasn’t left with the impression that reciting the pledge was voluntary.
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No saying the pledge is voluntary, I did not ever recite it during my 12 years in the public schools. I think the teachers dont like it when you dont recite it but I always showed respect when it was being said.
 
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Karin:
No saying the pledge is voluntary, I did not ever recite it during my 12 years in the public schools. I think the teachers dont like it when you dont recite it but I always showed respect when it was being said.
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Non-citizens would not be expected to recite the pledge (some might desire to.)

I wish there was an OATH of Allegiance for the laws of the country you choose to live in. Might make laws easier to enforce.
 
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KathleenElsie:
Non-citizens would not be expected to recite the pledge (some might desire to.) Yes, some do desire to…but if you are a citizen or not the at of reciting the pledge is not mandatory. Also if you choose not to recite it …show respect for what is going on.
I wish there was an OATH of Allegiance for the laws of the country you choose to live in. Might make laws easier to enforce.I have never had issues following the laws of this country…ok perhaps an occasional speeding or parking ticket:D
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Snicker:
You may be right…been out of school for a while. All I know is when I was in school, I wasn’t left with the impression that reciting the pledge was voluntary.
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If you are a teacher and citizen of this great country you should at least show respect for the Pledge.

Many of the persons that want to terrorize the conservatives of the world show no allegiance to this country in which they are privileged to live and work.

GOD BLESS YOU AND KEEP THIS COUNTRY STRONG
 
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KathleenElsie:
If you are a teacher and citizen of this great country you should at least show respect for the Pledge. Anybody and everybody should show respect for the Pleadge…but that IMO does not require reciting it.
Many of the persons that want to terrorize the conservatives of the world show no allegiance to this country in which they are privileged to live and work. So I am grouped with people that want to terrorize this country just because I have never said the Pledge.
GOD BLESS YOU AND KEEP THIS COUNTRY STRONG
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KathleenElsie:
If you are a teacher and citizen of this great country you should at least show respect for the Pledge.

Many of the persons that want to terrorize the conservatives of the world show no allegiance to this country in which they are privileged to live and work.

GOD BLESS YOU AND KEEP THIS COUNTRY STRONG
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I do respect the pledge…I just don’t recite it…seems too much like idolotry to me.
 
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Snicker:
I do respect the pledge…I just don’t recite it…seems too much like idolotry to me.
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?? pledging allegiance to the Republic of the United States is idolotry?
 
gilliam said:
?? pledging allegiance to the Republic of the United States is idolotry?
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Idolotry might be a tad strong, but I still don’t and won’t recite it.
 
gilliam said:
?? pledging allegiance to the Republic of the United States is idolotry?
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Please note that by me posting this link it does not mean that I agree or disagree with what the writer is saying (I am like Austria and Switzerland neutral) …it is just another view on the question that Gilliam asked.
*Quote: " in the New Testament idolatry came to mean, not only the giving to any creature or human creation the honor or devotion which belonged to God alone, but the giving to any human desire a precedence over God’s will (1 Corinthians 10:14; Galatians 5:20; Colossians 3:5; 1 Peter 4:3). *The flag is a foreign object that receives the (excessive) devotion of U.S. citizens. It has become so “idolized” (or fetishized, take your pick) that some patriotic Americans become outraged to see it touch the ground, let alone burned as a form of protest. Patriotism, as expressed through devotion to the flag, reaches such a fevered pitch in some circumstances that it becomes blurred with Americans’ theology. The flag almost becomes an extension of one’s spirituality. I’ve noticed that there tends to be a strong correlation between flag bumper stickers and Virgin Mary bumper stickers on cars here in Tucson. At what point does devotion to the flag, and by association the pledge, become a form of idol worship, as it displaces affection for God with devotion to a country and the flag that symbolizes it?"
braydenking.com/weblog/archives/000191.html
 
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Karin:
Please note that by me posting this link it does not mean that I agree or disagree with what the writer is saying (I am like Austria and Switzerland neutral) …it is just another view on the question that Gilliam asked.
*Quote: " in the New Testament idolatry came to mean, not only the giving to any creature or human creation the honor or devotion which belonged to God alone, but the giving to any human desire a precedence over God’s will (1 Corinthians 10:14; Galatians 5:20; Colossians 3:5; 1 Peter 4:3). *The flag is a foreign object that receives the (excessive) devotion of U.S. citizens. It has become so “idolized” (or fetishized, take your pick) that some patriotic Americans become outraged to see it touch the ground, let alone burned as a form of protest. Patriotism, as expressed through devotion to the flag, reaches such a fevered pitch in some circumstances that it becomes blurred with Americans’ theology. The flag almost becomes an extension of one’s spirituality. I’ve noticed that there tends to be a strong correlation between flag bumper stickers and Virgin Mary bumper stickers on cars here in Tucson. At what point does devotion to the flag, and by association the pledge, become a form of idol worship, as it displaces affection for God with devotion to a country and the flag that symbolizes it?"
braydenking.com/weblog/archives/000191.html
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Thanks for the quote Karen…It makes some excellent points.
 
Karin said:
* I’ve noticed that there tends to be a strong correlation between flag bumper stickers and Virgin Mary bumper stickers on cars here in Tucson. At what point does devotion to the flag, and by association the pledge, become a form of idol worship, as it displaces affection for God with devotion to a country and the flag that symbolizes it?"*
braydenking.com/weblog/archives/000191.html
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Looks like he thinks Virgin Mary veneration is idol worship as well.

By the way, Catholics are normally very patriotic.
 
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