only one correct religion with the truth?

[tonyfish58]

Sorry for the confusion; allow me to try again.

So WE DO believe in only One True God?

Would you also agree that on any carefully defined issue that truth is and absolutely MUST BE singular

So then even God can have ONLY one set of faith beliefs based on the above reality.

How can God “Good and Perfect”] hold to differing positions on identically defined issues; often even contradictory ones at that:shrug:

God Bless you,
Patrick

Patrick - I have been away for a few days - Thank you for the question. The Truth is One and the aim of all truth is to Know and Love God. Thus it is how we think about it which is also important.

What does differ is how it is revealed in each age and the Laws for that age. The Way God sends His Word and His Laws in the age they were revealed, has always been the greatest Veil or Clouds that obscure mans vision. This is what the Holy Books warn us to guard against.

Doctrine is our biggest hurdle, Why do you think God changes some parts of His Religion? From what I have read it is to Test our Purity of Heart!

This is some of what Baha’u’llah says on this subject; reference.bahai.org/en/t/b/KI/ki-1.html

“That He might prove you, which of you excel in deeds.”

"In like manner, strive thou to comprehend from these lucid, these powerful, conclusive, and unequivocal statements the meaning of the “cleaving of the heaven”—one of the signs that must needs herald the coming of the last Hour, the Day of Resurrection. As He hath said: “When the heaven shall be cloven asunder.” By “heaven” is meant the heaven of divine Revelation, which is elevated with every Manifestation, and rent asunder with every subsequent one. By “cloven asunder” is meant that the former Dispensation is superseded and annulled. I swear by God! That this heaven being cloven asunder is, to the discerning, an act mightier than the cleaving of the skies! Ponder a while. That a divine Revelation which for years hath been securely established; beneath whose shadow all who have embraced it have been reared and nurtured; by the light of whose law generations of men have been disciplined; the excellency of whose word men have heard recounted by their fathers; in such wise that human eye hath beheld naught but the pervading influence of its grace, and mortal ear hath heard naught but the resounding majesty of its command—what act is mightier than that such a Revelation should, by the power of God, be “cloven asunder” and be abolished at the appearance of one soul? Reflect, is this a mightier act than that which these abject and foolish men have imagined the “cleaving of the heaven” to mean? "

God Bless and Regards Tony

 

[PJM]

=tonyfish58;11685746]Patrick - I have been away for a few days - Thank you for the question. The Truth is One and the aim of all truth is to Know and Love God. Thus it is how we think about it which is also important.

What does differ is how it is revealed in each age and the Laws for that age. The Way God sends His Word and His Laws in the age they were revealed, has always been the greatest Veil or Clouds that obscure mans vision. This is what the Holy Books warn us to guard against.

Doctrine is our biggest hurdle, Why do you think God changes some parts of His Religion? From what I have read it is to Test our Purity of Heart!

This is some of what Baha’u’llah says on this subject; reference.bahai.org/en/t/b/KI/ki-1.html

“That He might prove you, which of you excel in deeds.”

"In like manner, strive thou to comprehend from these lucid, these powerful, conclusive, and unequivocal statements the meaning of the “cleaving of the heaven”—one of the signs that must needs herald the coming of the last Hour, the Day of Resurrection. As He hath said: “When the heaven shall be cloven asunder.” By “heaven” is meant the heaven of divine Revelation, which is elevated with every Manifestation, and rent asunder with every subsequent one. By “cloven asunder” is meant that the former Dispensation is superseded and annulled. I swear by God! That this heaven being cloven asunder is, to the discerning, an act mightier than the cleaving of the skies! Ponder a while. That a divine Revelation which for years hath been securely established; beneath whose shadow all who have embraced it have been reared and nurtured; by the light of whose law generations of men have been disciplined; the excellency of whose word men have heard recounted by their fathers; in such wise that human eye hath beheld naught but the pervading influence of its grace, and mortal ear hath heard naught but the resounding majesty of its command—what act is mightier than that such a Revelation should, by the power of God, be “cloven asunder” and be abolished at the appearance of one soul? Reflect, is this a mightier act than that which these abject and foolish men have imagined the “cleaving of the heaven” to mean? "

God Bless and Regards Tony

Thanks Tony, but you still have not answered my final question: HOW can One True God Good and Perfect} hold differing, even contradictory positions on LONF defined issues?

God Bless you,
Patrick

 

[Servant19]

Thanks Tony, but you still have not answered my final question: HOW can One True God [Good and Perfect} hold differing, even contradictory positions on LONF defined issues?

God Bless you,
Patrick

Dear Patrick, if I may intercede

The One True God does not hold differing or contradictory positions with His own Revelations.

It is man-made interpretations that have caused the contradictions.

It is the assumption that by being animated by the Holy Spirit equates to teaching the infallible Word of God.

That’s where religions throughout history have fallen

.
[/quote]

 

[PJM]

=Servant19;11686210]Dear Patrick, if I may intercede

The One True God does not hold differing or contradictory positions with His own Revelations.

It is man-made interpretations that have caused the contradictions.

It is the assumption that by being animated by the Holy Spirit equates to teaching the infallible Word of God.

That’s where religions throughout history have fallen

.

Thank you

We agree, its our friend Tony seems to be struggling with this reality.

God Bless you,
Patrick

 

[tonyfish58]

Thank you

We agree, its our friend Tony seems to be struggling with this reality.

God Bless you,
Patrick

What servant said is what I was saying?

God Bless and Regards Tony

 

[tonyfish58]

To me the concept of One Truth is only hindered by our limitations. In all the revelations of God to whoever they were given, the Truth Given Contained all that could be known.

That We are veiled from seeing the wholeness of the word, is only our incapacity, not the incompleteness of the Word.

History has shown us time and again that we take Gods Word and make of it what we want. When God brings His new Messenger, to rend the Veils asunder…it is us that rejects it.

How can we limit Gods Word by our understanding of One Faith? Lets face it there are many meanings of one. We can Take a Hold of One Apple, or we can Take Hold of One Bag of Apples or we can have an Orchard of Apples!

Also what is the One apple made up of ? We can take it right back to the elements it came from.

God Bless all and Regards Tony

 

[eddie_too]

after God became Incarnate in Jesus of Nazareth, there is nothing further that God can reveal about Himself. Jesus is the FULLNESS of God’s revelation to mankind.

this is a fundamental difference between RC and the bahai.

for a bahai to even begin to understand the RC faith, they must first understand that it is nonsense to ask a faithful RC to reject the belief in the fullness of our Creator’s revelation to us and replace our believe in how great is God’s love for us with a belief that mankind does not now and will never possess the fullness of God’s revelation.

it should not take that much knowledge, understanding and effort to compare this aspect of the RC and bahai faiths.

 

[eddie_too]

for a little more clarification of my just previous post, individual human beings grow in wisdom and understanding of the fullness of God’s revelation in the Person of Jesus Christ.

spiritual growth for every human being is a desire of God and of the RCC.

consequently, when i speak of the fullness of God’s revelation i am NOT implying that everyone who believes in Jesus and is baptized has the same depth and understanding of God’s revelations to mankind.

individuals grow in wisdom and understanding. even the Church has grown in wisdom and understanding as doctrinal development demonstrates. however, the growth in wisdom and understanding culminates in the spiritual perfection of individual human beings. the RCC’s growth in wisdom and understanding helps it to provide the assistance in individuals that Jesus created it to provide.

one final note, spiritual perfection in this world is not necessary for a human being to become perfected. the process continues after death, if that is the individual’s desire at the moment of death and judgment, and culminates with entry in to heaven which is by definition the perfect union of the human being with Perfect Being.

the RC knows this perfect union is achievable because Jesus demonstrated it and promised it to the rest of us.

 

[Missian_Alyssa]

I really don’t think it’s morally right for any one religion to say they are the only true religion and that everyone else is wrong. If any one religion claims to be the only truth, then they must surely be a lie? What do you think?

If any one person claims that their position of pluralism is the truth, then they must by lying? What do you think? Your moral relativism contradicts your assumption.

 

[tonyfish58]

after God became Incarnate in Jesus of Nazareth, there is nothing further that God can reveal about Himself. Jesus is the FULLNESS of God’s revelation to mankind.

this is a fundamental difference between RC and the bahai.

for a bahai to even begin to understand the RC faith, they must first understand that it is nonsense to ask a faithful RC to reject the belief in the fullness of our Creator’s revelation to us and replace our believe in how great is God’s love for us with a belief that mankind does not now and will never possess the fullness of God’s revelation.

it should not take that much knowledge, understanding and effort to compare this aspect of the RC and bahai faiths.

Eddie - We ask you to reject not a thing, you are free to believe as you wish.

We would with all Love point out there are other ways to think about it. These ways do not take away from Christ or God!

In Fact it could be that our Love grows for Christ and God if we change a mindset, but that is for each to decide.

God Bless and Regards Tony

 

[eddie_too]

tony,

your comment does not make sense to me.

you say, out of one side of your mouth, that the bahai are not asking RCs to reject their faith.

then you say, out of the other side of your mouth, that what the RCC teaches is wrong.

so, if i may summarize the bahai position pronounced by you, we bahai believe it is perfectly ok for you RCs to believe falsehoods and we do not think you should reject those falsehoods.

what kind of teaching is that? seriously?

 

[Servant19]

tony,

your comment does not make sense to me.

you say, out of one side of your mouth, that the bahai are not asking RCs to reject their faith.

then you say, out of the other side of your mouth, that what the RCC teaches is wrong.

so, if i may summarize the bahai position pronounced by you, we bahai believe it is perfectly ok for you RCs to believe falsehoods and we do not think you should reject those falsehoods.

what kind of teaching is that? seriously?

The Apostle Paul taught that it is more important to have unity within the community than to argue and debate on what is truth, and who possesses it…

.

 

[eddie_too]

servant19,

your comment makes it sound like unity is more important than truth.

is that a bahai teaching?

 

[Servant19]

servant19,

your comment makes it sound like unity is more important than truth.

is that a bahai teaching?

Certain truths yes.

Obviously uniting the world to be sado-masochistic cannibals is probably not a good idea

.

 

[Servant19]

I think a compromise on the exact nature of an Unknowable God, if it brings unity, is more important than holding on to what you think is a truth about Gods nature.

Unity is God. We should live it and He will live in us…

.

 

[eddie_too]

the God we RCs worship is knowable because He has revealed Himself to us.

but perhaps for a bahai the question of whether or not God is knowable is one of the unimportant truths?

 

[Lokadottir]

the God we RCs worship is knowable because He has revealed Himself to us.

but perhaps for a bahai the question of whether or not God is knowable is one of the unimportant truths?

My Gods revealed themselves to me.

 

[Servant19]

the God we RCs worship is knowable because He has revealed Himself to us.

but perhaps for a bahai the question of whether or not God is knowable is one of the unimportant truths?

Dear Eddie,

I think as finite human beings we may or may not know even a drop of what God’s creation is and its nature. If we are so limited in our knowledge of His creation, how much more limited are we know about our Creator?

I understand where you are coming from. We can indeed know “of” Him through His attributes and His love which He has implanted in our hearts, but again we are indeed very limited in terms of our absolute certainty about the “essence” of His nature.

I think the attributes that the vast majority of human beings agree are the attributes of God (such as love) are indeed truth and rarely do we need to venture into arguments and disunity to assert anything beyond that.

I think if we all agreed that God is love, and stuck to just that, we would live in a much better and united world…



God bless you dear friend!

.

 

[eddie_too]

every human being can know Jesus Christ.

in knowing Jesus Christ, we know God in all HIs glory.

this is an essential truth of the RC faith.

the bahai insistence that RCs cannot know God creates a great division between bahai and RCs.

the bahai are definitive that RCs doctrine in this area is wrong.

then the bahai claim that RCs should unite under bahaullah.

why shoud the RCs accept the bahai rejection of the RC faith as true and unitive?

 

[eddie_too]

it does make sense that people who do not know Jesus Christ would conclude that God is unknowable.

but the best solution to that problem (of believing a person cannot know God) is to know Jesus Christ.