Open Thread for the Synod on the Family

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larsont7 said:
Some troubling news for the Synod -

rr.sapo.pt/informacao_detalhe.aspx?fid=29&did=164929
(link in Portuguese, translated below - bolded emphasis mine)

Here is the Vatican’s confirmation of the individuals who were chosen by Pope Francis to write the final report:
press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/en/bollettino/pubblico/2014/10/10/0746/03035.html

I find it interesting that the secret ballot voting by the bishops and Cardinals chose conservative-leaning prelates to head the Synod, and then Pope Francis inserts 6 liberal-leaning prelates to write the final report midway through the proceedings. 🤷
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Yeah, this is definitely troubling, though at least none of these appointees have explicitly supported Card Kasper.

And Card Erdo is still the “head” of writing the document and he is very solid. Also, the writing of the document may end up not being all that important, since the synod members are apparently conservative leaning and will eventually vote on it anyway (ie. they can vote down what is first presented to them).

At least I hope so :o
 
larsont7 said:
Some troubling news for the Synod -

rr.sapo.pt/informacao_detalhe.aspx?fid=29&did=164929
(link in Portuguese, translated below - bolded emphasis mine)

Here is the Vatican’s confirmation of the individuals who were chosen by Pope Francis to write the final report:
press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/en/bollettino/pubblico/2014/10/10/0746/03035.html

I find it interesting that the secret ballot voting by the bishops and Cardinals chose conservative-leaning prelates to head the Synod, and then Pope Francis inserts 6 liberal-leaning prelates to write the final report midway through the proceedings. 🤷
Click to expand...
🤷 :o I agree with you Larson :highprayer: :signofcross: :gopray2:
 
McCall1981 said:
Yeah, this is definitely troubling, though at least none of these appointees have explicitly supported Card Kasper.

And Card Erdo is still the “head” of writing the document and he is very solid. Also, the writing of the document may end up not being all that important, since the synod members are apparently conservative leaning and will eventually vote on it anyway (ie. they can vote down what is first presented to them).

At least I hope so :o
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Well, I hope Cardinal Erdo will make good use of his no doubt strong proofing and editing skills. And there is the final vote. The link is an interesting piece about whether the Synod is really as “open” as it claims to be. It makes you wonder how evenly matched the sides actually are - or if perhaps one (weaker?) side is getting a little manipulative help along the way…of course with the best intentions in the world…:rolleyes:

catholicculture.org/commentary/otn.cfm?id=1054
 
FollowChrist34 said:
Well, I hope Cardinal Erdo will make good use of his no doubt strong proofing and editing skills. And there is the final vote. The link is an interesting piece about whether the Synod is really as “open” as it claims to be. It makes you wonder how evenly matched the sides actually are - or if perhaps one (weaker?) side is getting a little manipulative help along the way…of course with the best intentions in the world…:rolleyes:

catholicculture.org/commentary/otn.cfm?id=1054
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Yeah, it really doesn’t seem right that the African Bishops don’t have a representative 😦

Card Erdo is pretty great (I was rooting for him at the last conclave ;)).
 
I hope that the results of this Synod don’t disappoint both sides. I am afraid a compromise could well just alienate everyone and not really do much more. They will relax references to “sin”, up the “tolerance” references to the point of (almost) altering the intent of the Gospel, then turn around and affirm Church teaching on things like marriage and homosexuality (I am not getting into the annulment thing here). EVERYONE will be mad, mark my words. :o For the orthodox, the intent of the Gospel will be weakened and those wishing for change will feel too much is left untouched or sufficiently softened/modified.
 
Is it just me or do the election of Bagnasco and Burke to the preparatory committee seem like an unprecedented act of rebellion? These are men who have been stripped of all or nearly all of their Cardinalatial honors by Pope Francis in advance of the Synod. One would expect that the Synod’s voting membership would, if it were anything less than icy to the Pontiff’s agenda, cast its votes in a way at least not hostile to it. To me, this speaks to a certain level of distrust in the hierarchy.
 
sw85 said:
Is it just me or do the election of Bagnasco and Burke to the preparatory committee seem like an unprecedented act of rebellion? These are men who have been stripped of all or nearly all of their Cardinalatial honors by Pope Francis in advance of the Synod. One would expect that the Synod’s voting membership would, if it were anything less than icy to the Pontiff’s agenda, cast its votes in a way at least not hostile to it. To me, this speaks to a certain level of distrust in the hierarchy.
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I had forgotten that about Card Bagnasco, but you’re right, wow.
 
Great YouTube interview with Cardinal Burke and Raymond Arroyo if you haven’t seen it - an absolute must.

catholicworldreport.com/Blog/3421/card_burke_to_raymond_arroyo_card_kaspers_proposal_demanded_a_strong_response.aspx

Here are some comments from Carl Olson, some good stuff on Kasper:

catholicworldreport.com/Blog/3418/some_scattered_thoughts_on_the_synod_so_far.aspx

And, finally, here is my take on what is REALLY happening. The Pope is supporting Cardinal Kasper. Kasper’s presentation at the Synod was not well-received, meeting some major push back from the bishops. With the Pope’s support, Kasper actually got an unusual second chance the next day to try to persuade them again. Still not clear they are going for it, and from the sound of it here in the interview from Burke they won’t. The Pope had already began the process of implementing changes to the annulment process some months ago, before the Synod, without consulting the bishops, so it is imperative that the bishops “get on board” with that. The media is behind Kasper, Marx is perhaps behind him, but any further support appears to be scant and there could well be fierce resistance. We are not getting a clear picture from the media. I bet that is why Mueller wanted the public transcripts. Now, this summary of mine could be a little pro Burke, but I think in main the truth. Remember we are hearing about the presentations from pro Kasper media, as well as speculative ideas, not what the response or discussion actually is. That could be significant, much more than we realize. It’s largely a manufactured “renewal” on a pretty rocky path at that - far from a real one.
 
FollowChrist34 said:
And, finally, here is my take on what is REALLY happening. Now, this summary of mine could be a little pro Burke, but I think in main the truth.
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😃 You have left no stone unturned to represent your “pro Burke” views in these many threads.

What is disturbing to me is that Raymond Arroyo** is**, and has been a very biased reporter, going back to covering the election of Pope Benedict. Seems they displaced him for Pope Francis’ election with Colleen Carroll Campbell, who did a wonderful job!

The job of a reporter is NOT to influence the audience with his condescending tone of voice, facial expressions of disdain, or any other body language. His attitude is repulsive to me, and it is unworthy of him as a Catholic reporter. You never see Marcus Grodi in anything but a neutral stance when he interviews.
 
Sirach2 said:
😃 You have left no stone unturned to represent your “pro Burke” views in these many threads.

What is disturbing to me is that Raymond Arroyo** is**, and has been a very biased reporter, going back to covering the election of Pope Benedict. Seems they displaced him for Pope Francis’ election with Colleen Carroll Campbell, who did a wonderful job!

The job of a reporter is NOT to influence the audience with his condescending tone of voice, facial expressions of disdain, or any other body language. His attitude is repulsive to me, and it is unworthy of him as a Catholic reporter. You never see Marcus Grodi in anything but a neutral stance when he interviews.
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I see Arroyo as Michael Voris-Lite.
 
I once used the term "lightweight"when speaking of Pope Francis on this form in another thread. I was soundly put in my place.

All of this makes me really,really concerned. It is of deep concern when the Pope seems to be advocating a dilution of church teaching and practice.

More discussion is needed as to why there are so many divorced and remarried people clamouring for communion. That’s what needs to be addressed and remedied.

I am one of those people who cannot and do not present myself for communion. They are talking about me. And I would rather be on the fringe of a church that teaches the truth, than on the inside of one that teaches a lie.
 
Deltadeliquent said:
I once used the term "lightweight"when speaking of Pope Francis on this form in another thread. I was soundly put in my place.

All of this makes me really,really concerned. It is of deep concern when the Pope seems to be advocating a dilution of church teaching and practice.

More discussion is needed as to why there are so many divorced and remarried people clamouring for communion. That’s what needs to be addressed and remedied.

I am one of those people who cannot and do not present myself for communion. They are talking about me. And I would rather be on the fringe of a church that teaches the truth, than on the inside of one that teaches a lie.
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Delta, I´m in a similar situation, took a similar approach to yours, and pretty much agree with everything you said.
The question for me is, who defines what the truth is? Certainly not CAF posters. To me it´s clear the Church is the only one with such authority, and so I will (as humbly as I can manage) follow whatever it decides.
 
I wonder if they have someone reading the comments on this forum…
I think that if they go with Kasper, I will still not present myself for communion.

I did the crime, I’ll do the time.
Unless I am able to be declared free to marry.
 
Deltadeliquent said:
I wonder if they have someone reading the comments on this forum…
I think that if they go with Kasper, I will still not present myself for communion.

I did the crime, I’ll do the time.
Unless I am able to be declared free to marry.
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I really don´t think they will go with him, as I can´t find sound arguments to change that teaching. But, hypothetically, in that scenario, how would going against the Church be something good?
I would never dare believe I know better, even as uncomfortable as it may seem.
 
Deltadeliquent said:
More discussion is needed as to why there are so many divorced and remarried people clamouring for communion. That’s what needs to be addressed and remedied.
Click to expand...
This seems to be more prevalent in English Masses and a cultural issue. Many have admitted they have received with mortal sins on their souls. It appears one would rather not face the embarrassment of sitting alone in the pews than defying the doctrine of the Church.
 
Sirach2 said:
😃 You have left no stone unturned to represent your “pro Burke” views in these many threads.
Click to expand...
🙂 Well thanks Sirach, to me, that is a very high compliment indeed. I am thrilled with it. But as my pre-Catholic days hero Nietzsche said, give me worthy opponents. 😃

And as you may suspect already, I LOVE Raymond Arroyo. He is well-informed, gracious, fair and balanced (isn’t he also Italian?).
 
Eternal_One said:
[BIBLEDRB][/BIBLEDRB]

Yea, except one has to actually be sorry and ask for forgiveness, in order to be forgiven. :rolleyes:
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Not true. I’d venture to guess most Catholics forgive people for offenses with or without the offenders’ permission or desire to be forgiven. Forgiveness is in our Christian nature. It’s what Christ did.
 
larsont7 said:
Some troubling news for the Synod -

rr.sapo.pt/informacao_detalhe.aspx?fid=29&did=164929
(link in Portuguese, translated below - bolded emphasis mine)

Here is the Vatican’s confirmation of the individuals who were chosen by Pope Francis to write the final report:
press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/en/bollettino/pubblico/2014/10/10/0746/03035.html

I find it interesting that the secret ballot voting by the bishops and Cardinals chose conservative-leaning prelates to head the Synod, and then Pope Francis inserts 6 liberal-leaning prelates to write the final report midway through the proceedings. 🤷
Click to expand...
If it were a conservative heavy group, many Catholics would poo-poo it as just another grumpy old man coffee clash. This way the group is well rounded and considers all facets of the faith. As we know, not every member of the Magisterium interprets and applies Catholic doctrine the exact same way. Also remember, our church’s history and its interpretation is long and windy. Only a revisionist can see its history as consistent. If our church officially calls on us to accept homosexuals and to give communion to divorced people, it would not be the end of the world. Choosing love and acceptance over discrimination and exclusion is a very Catholic thing to do. We, the non-leaders of our church, must let this play out. Our emotionally charged opinions don’t mean a thing so why stress over it. Either the Church softens or it doesn’t. Either way, our church will continue on.
 
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