Opinions of the New Mass Translation [edited]

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BernadetteM

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On the web under The Continuum and also under Bishop Trautman and the USCCB meeting it appears that the Bishop is against the New Mass. It says that Bishop Trautman is a leading public critic of the Holy See’s actions in liturgical matters and is a consistant advocate of a so-called “inclusive language in English translation”.

Apparently he seems to feel the new prayers will be above the heads of the average Catholic.

From what I have seen of the New Mass, it is quite an improvement in many ways and is much closer to the latin.

I think the average Catholic is much brighter than some of our Bishop’s opinions of us.

Of course change is always difficult, but everything was completely changed in the 60’s and the Bishops didn’t seem to think we would have any problems with those changes.

I rather like what I would call a higher form of the English language. Has anyone looked at the new version of the Mass and what do you think?

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette
 
The new prayers are beautiful. They restore authenticity to the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass as they are as close to an accurate translation of the prayers as they can get.

For my part, I wrote an email to my bishop and implored him to vote with Bishop Seratelli, reminding him that his primary episcopal responsibility involves serving as the Chief Liturgical Steward of our diocese and that he needed to safeguard the integrity of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass. I urge all of us to write to our bishops and archbishops, storming the chanceries with letters of support for these new translations.

The USCCB will be selling mail-in ballots very soon. If we can convince our bishops that this is the right thing to do, perhaps we can get this reform of the reform train moving again.
 
I love the re-transaltion
It is so literal, yet readable, and very, very prayerful.

The parts of the people for the most part are basically the same.

Some of the younger folk may find it hard (???), but they will grow in their understanding of the faith and of the Mass.

I think/hope most people will love the translation, they will not find it over their heads, and it may even make them stop and think… 🙂
 
benedictgal said:
The USCCB will be selling mail-in ballots very soon. If we can convince our bishops that this is the right thing to do, perhaps we can get this reform of the reform train moving again.
Click to expand...
Did you happen to notice this part of the press release?

“Bishop Arthur J. Serratelli of Paterson, N.J., chairman of the Committee on Divine Worship, warned that delaying approval or failing to send the Vatican guidance by the end of November will risk shutting the U.S. bishops out of the English-language translation approval process.”

catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0902803.htm

On a related note, the USCCB also approved the adoption (and translation) for a new “Mass in Thanksgiving for the Gift of Human Life”.
catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0902799.htm
 
Rolltide said:
Did you happen to notice this part of the press release?

“Bishop Arthur J. Serratelli of Paterson, N.J., chairman of the Committee on Divine Worship, warned that delaying approval or failing to send the Vatican guidance by the end of November will risk shutting the U.S. bishops out of the English-language translation approval process.”

catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0902803.htm

On a related note, the USCCB also approved the adoption (and translation) for a new “Mass in Thanksgiving for the Gift of Human Life”.
catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0902799.htm
Click to expand...
I meant to say “sending”, not “selling” the ballots. Yes, I read the release. I spoke to two journalists covering the conference. Tweets don’t give you the whole picture so I figured I may as well get first-hand accounts.

Inasmuch as it is good to have a Mass for the Gift of Life, this should have been a secondary matter, since their top priority should have been to get the grey books approved. Then once they have handled that, the other matters should fall into place.
 
Deo gratias!

Yes, I’ve heard only good things about the new translation. As I’ve discovered the Traditional Latin Mass more I really appreciate it, and the linguistic richness is something that has been sorely lacking. I know a lot of younger folk seem to feel the same way. At least the Catholic pulse that I feel in this area points strongly toward renewal and revival of the Church. ‘Modernism’ has become so passé.

Deo gratias!
 
I agree with all the replies my post has received. Yes it appears that the younger generation has a longing for the reverence that the New Mass will have.

Also I think that the more traditional Catholics will welcome it greatly. There will always be people who are unhappy with any change, but in time the Mass will grow on them.

Let us all pray pray pray for a great outcome. We as Catholics should follow the Head, who is our Holy Father as the Holy Spirit has inspired him to do God’s will.

I find it sad to see so many clergy rebel against him on so many issues. Of course we all have minds of our own but as Catholics we should understand that Christ gave Peter the keys and the authority to bind on earth and in Heaven. I don’t think you can go wrong when you follow his lead.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette
 
Was there any mention of improving the music to be more Catholic/Gregorian?

Richardb
 
Banished,

Not that I am aware of. Hopefully there will be. I have the previlege of going to a lovely parish where they sing all the older hymns. There are no contemporary hymns sung. During communion they also sing Latin hymns at times.

I feel so blessed. I really don’t enjoy hearing what I consider the newer protestant songs, they all sound the same to me. Although some of the more traditional protestant hymns whether Baptist or other denominations are not bad. When I say protestant hymns sung in a Catholic Church, to me they don’t reflect Catholic belief. Of course many will disagree. Since I came from an Episcopal background I was used to wonderful hymns. some that could bring tears to your eyes.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette
 
bbbbb
BernadetteM said:
Banished,

Not that I am aware of. Hopefully there will be. I have the previlege of going to a lovely parish where they sing all the older hymns. There are no contemporary hymns sung. During communion they also sing Latin hymns at times.

I feel so blessed. I really don’t enjoy hearing what I consider the newer protestant songs, they all sound the same to me. Although some of the more traditional protestant hymns whether Baptist or other denominations are not bad. When I say protestant hymns sung in a Catholic Church, to me they don’t reflect Catholic belief. Of course many will disagree. Since I came from an Episcopal background I was used to wonderful hymns. some that could bring tears to your eyes.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette
Click to expand...
Dear Bernadette,

It’s late, so you must be out here on the West Coast. We have St Margaret Mary in Oakland with a Tradidional Latin Mass 7 days a week. Tomorrow night (Friday Night) there will be a High Mass for “Most Sacred Heart of Jesus”

Below are the Chants from St Benedicts in Brazil. They are free MP3 downloads, wish I could attach them to my post.

Feria VI post dom. II post Pentecosten

Sacratissimi Cordis Iesu

Introitus: Ps. 32, 11.19 et 1 Cogitationes Cordis eius
Graduale: Ps. 24, 8. V. 9 Dulcis et rectus Dominus
Alleluia: Mt. 11, 29 Tollite iugum meum
Offertorium: Ps. 68, 21 Improperium exspectavit
Communio: Io. 19, 34 Unus militum

Lets do a test to see if when you click this link the Alleluia for tomorrow nights High Mass will auto play:

christusrex.org/www2/cantgreg/cantus/al_tollite_iugum_meum.mp3

Richard
 
BernadetteM said:
On the web under The Continuum and also under Bishop Trautman and the USCCB meeting it appears that the Bishop is against the New Mass. It says that Bishop Trautman is a leading public critic of the Holy See’s actions in liturgical matters and is a consistant advocate of a so-called “inclusive language in English translation”.

Apparently he seems to feel the new prayers will be above the heads of the average Catholic.

From what I have seen of the New Mass, it is quite an improvement in many ways and is much closer to the latin.

I think the average Catholic is much brighter than some of our Bishop’s opinions of us.

Of course change is always difficult, but everything was completely changed in the 60’s and the Bishops didn’t seem to think we would have any problems with those changes.

I rather like what I would call a higher form of the English language. Has anyone looked at the new version of the Mass and what do you think?

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette
Click to expand...
I think the changes are great. That said I fear:
  • How poorly the Church is likely to implement the changes.
  • How it will mean even more confusion for those who already have no idea what the Mass is.
 
BernadetteM said:
I agree with all the replies my post has received. Yes it appears that the younger generation has a longing for the reverence that the New Mass will have.

Also I think that the more traditional Catholics will welcome it greatly. There will always be people who are unhappy with any change, but in time the Mass will grow on them.

Let us all pray pray pray for a great outcome. We as Catholics should follow the Head, who is our Holy Father as the Holy Spirit has inspired him to do God’s will.

I find it sad to see so many clergy rebel against him on so many issues. Of course we all have minds of our own but as Catholics we should understand that Christ gave Peter the keys and the authority to bind on earth and in Heaven. I don’t think you can go wrong when you follow his lead.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette
Click to expand...
Please don’t call it the “New Mass” – it’s still the same Mass – the Ordinary Form of the Mass. Calling it the “New Mass” is sure to lead to confusion.
 
banished said:
bbbbb

Dear Bernadette,

It’s late, so you must be out here on the West Coast. We have St Margaret Mary in Oakland with a Tradidional Latin Mass 7 days a week. Tomorrow night (Friday Night) there will be a High Mass for “Most Sacred Heart of Jesus”

Below are the Chants from St Benedicts in Brazil. They are free MP3 downloads, wish I could attach them to my post.

Feria VI post dom. II post Pentecosten

Sacratissimi Cordis Iesu

Introitus: Ps. 32, 11.19 et 1 Cogitationes Cordis eius
Graduale: Ps. 24, 8. V. 9 Dulcis et rectus Dominus
Alleluia: Mt. 11, 29 Tollite iugum meum
Offertorium: Ps. 68, 21 Improperium exspectavit
Communio: Io. 19, 34 Unus militum

Lets do a test to see if when you click this link the Alleluia for tomorrow nights High Mass will auto play:

christusrex.org/www2/cantgreg/cantus/al_tollite_iugum_meum.mp3

Richard
Click to expand...
Hi Richard,

I clicked it on, but no response. I am sure it was beautiful. Thank you for trying. At my old Anglo Catholic parish the priest celebrated the EF, he is now a Latin Rite Catholic priest.

What I like about the Catholic Church is there is much diversity in the liturgy. Also although I have never been to an Anglican Use Mass I have seen parts of it and from what everyone says it is wonderful. I am ordering a DVD of it. The priest at that parish had the EF at one time, but the people attending did not want to be part of the parish so he now celebrates a Latin Mass every Sunday.

I wish there was an AU parish close to me, but I love my parish. The priest celebrates the EF Mass on Sundays. I have not been to it yet. He is rather old and it is a small church so I am sure that it is not as lovely as some, but the OF is wonderful, I feel very much at home there. The name of the church is San Secondo D’Asti. It is a very old church.

There is something for everyone in the Church, we are so lucky to have choices.

Yes I live in Southern California and have I am afraid becoming addicted to this forum.

Well it is best if I retire for the night.

God Bless

Bernadette
 
OhMalley said:
Please don’t call it the “New Mass” – it’s still the same Mass – the Ordinary Form of the Mass. Calling it the “New Mass” is sure to lead to confusion.
Click to expand...
So far everyone who responded understood that I was referring to the OF. I used that title as I thought maybe it would be clearer to the posters what I meant. Apparently there was no confusion.

Bernadette
 
BernadetteM said:
So far everyone who responded understood that I was referring to the OF. I used that title as I thought maybe it would be clearer to the posters what I meant. Apparently there was no confusion.

Bernadette
Click to expand...
I understood what you meant but perhaps calling it the ‘new translation’ would be less likely to lead to confusion.
 
BernadetteM said:
From what I have seen of the New Mass, it is quite an improvement in many ways and is much closer to the latin. I think the average Catholic is much brighter than some of our Bishop’s opinions of us. … I rather like what I would call a higher form of the English language. Has anyone looked at the new version of the Mass and what do you think?
Click to expand...
I am very much a fan of it! 🙂
 
I have studied the new translation, and while it is very faithful to the Latin, its syntax is a bit different than we are used to. Now this won’t be too noticable in the parts of the laity, but in the priest’s prayers there might be some difficulty in getting used to the cadence and the arrangement of clauses and such. They will need to practice a bit. I know that there will be practice CDs or online sources for priests to practice with. I know my pastor was reading though one of the EPs at our last liturgy meeting and was struggling with it. It’s not how we normally speak in English.
 
BernadetteM said:
I really don’t enjoy hearing what I consider the newer protestant songs, they all sound the same to me. Although some of the more traditional protestant hymns whether Baptist or other denominations are not bad. When I say protestant hymns sung in a Catholic Church, to me they don’t reflect Catholic belief. Of course many will disagree.
Click to expand...
Since you bring up hymns, I had to say that even some of the newer Catholic “hymns” are such a farce as well. They are not hymns. The music is a travesty of unrhythmical notes with no gracefulness. At least let the music be ok, and then we could excuse a little of the theology lite that comes with it. News flash: not everything put to notes is a song!!
 
When the Church changed from Latin to the vernacular I am sure that it was much more difficult for priests to learn what was entailed in the OF than celebrating the Mass in Latin.

Also remember that protestants with no liturgical background come into the Church and must learn many responses besides the Creed, Gloria etc. If they can learn all the parts of the liturgy then these changes should not be too difficult for Catholics in the pew.

I came from an Anglo Catholic background to the OF and although there were many similarities there were also many changes in wording. We used “with thy Spirit”. The Creed was different also and several other prayers. It took a little time, but after awhile it does comes naturally. In my opinion it was probably more difficult for me than a person from a non liturgical background as the changes were just a few words or sometimes a word and it can be hard not to revert back to what you have said for years. But it can be done, as I am living proof and I know many others from my background who also had to make the same changes.

People need to accept change with an open heart and not be hostile towards change, as that is what makes it more difficult to learn. It is human nature to want things to always be the way they were.

The truth of the Catholic Church is really the important issue, not the way we express that truth in the Mass.

Yours in the Hearts of Jesus and Mary

Bernadette
 
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