Opponents Protest in Face of NRA Silence on Sandy Hook Shooting

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So how did this country survive and avoid being invaded and overtaken when it didn’t have a standing army? How did anyone ever get tried for a crime without police forces? What is your basis for calling it unworkable? I would call it workable because the US government was able to maintain its authority, was not defeated by outsiders and law and order was generally maintained.

There were riots after the Rodney King ruling. There are riots after sports victories. So I’m not sure your point.

By the way the benefits I speak of are not having a standing army which in our case has led to being overseas all the time fighting other nations. And it is funny you bring up an event where half of the nation turned on the other half to invade it and subjugate it in while arguing for less power of common defense. That war is a prime example of why we need weapons since the very government we live under did in fact turn on its own people and cause the death of over half a million.
This is your description of the Civil War? …Wow, just wow. My best friend is an African American, he’s a really good guy. Since my conversion to Catholicism I’ve often thought about how to best evangelize or refer him to the Church for spiritual direction in his life. Its comments like these that make me very certain, sadly, that this forum is one I must never recommend…I cannot even imagine the feelings this kind of sentiment would engender in him to read on a Catholic website…how very regrettable.
 
This is your description of the Civil War? …Wow, just wow. My best friend is an African American, he’s a really good guy. Since my conversion to Catholicism I’ve often thought about how to best evangelize or refer him to the Church for spiritual direction in his life. Its comments like these that make me very certain, sadly, that this forum is one I must never recommend…I cannot even imagine the feelings this kind of sentiment would engender in him to read on a Catholic website…how very regrettable.
Was my description inaccurate? Didn’t a lot of people die? Didn’t the North invade the South, burn down whole cities, dissolve the states, replace them with military districts ruled oppressively? Does your friend have an aversion to historical facts?
Just curious - are churches gun - free zones? If not, how many on this forum carry a gun to mass? And if not, why not?
This is not mass of course since I’m Protestant, but I do know of guns being carried to church services. So I’m sure they are there and obviously not a problem. No churches are not gun free zones.
 
Just curious - are churches gun - free zones? If not, how many on this forum carry a gun to mass? And if not, why not?
There is not a sign at our parish.

Yes, I do carry at Mass. Why? The same reason I carry when I go to the store or anywhere else I carry.
 
Clearly the police and migrate as I’ve said elsewhere. But the rest of your post is a myth…places with largely vigilante law were horrible…unless you think the Old West was a great model for a civilized society!:D.
The “Old West” was actually much more peaceful and law abiding than modern day Chicago where people pull their guns on a regular basis to settle their differences.
 
On older models. Newer models have been redesigned. Accuracy goes down considerably with full auto and even rapidly firing a semi automatic. Rate of fire is really irrelevant when no one can stop the shooter because they themselves are unarmed. The guy could have used a pump shotgun and been just as deadly taking minimal time to reload.
Really? Let’s think about this: he fires a pump action shotgun and cranks it open to reload and three or four adults are ducked down some 10 feet away in a classroom…I like my chances if I’m one of those adults, I bet I can run that 10 feet and have him beaten senseless long before he can reload level the gun and shoot. With a couple other adults in the room, he’s got no chance to shoot again.
 
Well it really depends on how those regulations are implemented. And it doesn’t improve the situation at gun-free zones at all. It does not address how to better protect people from the mentally ill or just plain evil. Again, all your proposals will be followed by the law-abiding, who aren’t the problem now.

Are some people going to be more equal than others?
Under CAs CCW process, it’s up to the local sheriff whether you get a CCW. It’s called discretionary issue. Some women after being almost killed, with restraining orders in place, and the offender threatening to kill them after getting out of prison – have been denied permits. Yet celebrities, the wealthy, and politicians seem to have no problem getting them. Some jurisdictions see self-defense as a legitimate reason, other interpert folks showing good judgment or justification as eliminating anyone other than someone who demonstrates their good judgement by donating to the sheriff’s re-election fund.

Yet, at my kids school the law abiding can’t even carry a knife. Not an adult, not a kid, no one. Someone reasonably proficient with a simple pump shotgun can wreak havoc. Nothing or no-one there to stop them. Help us all if they start googling how to create more destructive devices.

You say you want a solution but you avoid the core issue. Why would someone do this? How do you stop folks from wanting to do this? That is far more important than the weapon. If you have the desire, you will find the tool and opportunity.

You realize the Aurora shooter decided to bypass theaters closer to him than the one he chose. The one he chose was the only one with signs posted stating they prohibited legal CCW holders from carrying firearms onto the premises.
We have laws against murder, robbery, rape, etc. Have they stopped any of it? Because they fail to prevent crimes 100%, what do we do?

Criminals are going to circumvent laws. That doesn’t mean we stop placing laws, or controls in this case, into affect to separate the law abiding from the criminal.

How would the controls I suggest affect the law abiding citizen? Without proper registrations, confiscation and fines. Insurance for ‘accidents’. Training and licensing to assure proper handling. Required security, with a responsibility if it wasn’t provided and your gun was used in a crime. These seem like being responsible for the sake of society to me and not giving up something.
 
We have laws against murder, robbery, rape, etc. Have they stopped any of it? Because they fail to prevent crimes 100%, what do we do?

Criminals are going to circumvent laws. That doesn’t mean we stop placing laws, or controls in this case, into affect to separate the law abiding from the criminal.
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Agreed. That’s why the public should be able to defend themselves.
 
It is not because the very people you would still allow to have weapons, government personnel, kill far more people with those weapons than do private citizens. In fact the federal government killed more children at Waco than this incident using their tanks and the simple element fire.
Yep. At WACO! A compound full of crazies who were themselves armed to the teeth, a nutty doomsday cult. Can you confirm for me? Are you saying that the Waco incident makes you really fear that the government is going to come kill you? I just want to be sure that’s the inference you’re making.
 
As pointed out by Prodigal Son1, criminals don’t obey the law.
And as pointed out by me, these perpetrators in such senseless massacres are not criminals, they are deranged mentally ill people who typically had no criminal histories, lol!
 
Really? Let’s think about this: he fires a pump action shotgun and cranks it open to reload and three or four adults are ducked down some 10 feet away in a classroom…I like my chances if I’m one of those adults, I bet I can run that 10 feet and have him beaten senseless long before he can reload level the gun and shoot. With a couple other adults in the room, he’s got no chance to shoot again.
You can jump cover and move 10 feet before a person can work a slide action about 8". Does the NFL know about you? :rolleyes:

As a warning - please don’t try this - you’ll be the first one shot.
 
And as pointed out by me, these perpetrators in such senseless massacres are not criminals, they are deranged mentally ill people who typically had no criminal histories, lol!
So now its funny?

Good to know the type of people that post here.
 
So why are they going after the law abiding citizens?
I would think law abiding citizens would have nothing to hide and ready to provide support anyway necessary.

Have you missed some of the suggestions I’ve posted? What is objectionable, to a law abiding citizen?
 
Agreed. That’s why the public should be able to defend themselves.
Again, where I have advocated against a defense? I have made suggestions for more control, but no bans. The more unique weapon you desire, the more unique controls should be in place; especially if that unique weapon is proven to be a choice among these mass shooters.
 
Yes and no. They are different environments but both allow the public in. This is the whole problem with the prohibition of guns in certain places. There are not safe places and unsafe places. Well actually places where guns are prohibited are actually unsafe since you can not protect yourself and they have proven to be the type of places where violence does occur so people supported misguided laws to strip the good actors of their weapons.
Really? Let’s think about this: he fires a pump action shotgun and cranks it open to reload and three or four adults are ducked down some 10 feet away in a classroom…I like my chances if I’m one of those adults, I bet I can run that 10 feet and have him beaten senseless long before he can reload level the gun and shoot. With a couple other adults in the room, he’s got no chance to shoot again.
Since it is a pump action he probably wouldn’t crank it open but rather insert new shells into the magazine. This can be done fairly quickly. If you are ten feet away from a shotgun you very likely would be dead or injured by the time he reloads. He could also have a sidearm to protect himself while reloading. Its not fun speculating but rest assured a pump action shotgun is a very deadly weapon.
 
What kind of deer hunter needs a 30 round clip to kill a deer? Does the deer stand still for a second shot, much less 29 more shots?
Actually with a semiauto you can follow up with a second or third round before they even move.

What does the topic have to do with deer hunting? 🤷
 
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