Orans position

  • Thread starter Thread starter Brain
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
40.png
mosher:
Action is never a matter of feeling it is a matter of direction my the competant authority. No matter what the USCCB does it is required to receive permission from the Holy See for any modifications in the GIRM or other pertinant rubrics. The Holy See has not given said permission thus no permission exists thus it is a liturgical abuse. If I went about doing what I felt was right all the time I would be 300 lbs and in jail. Rules are there to be followed.
Click to expand...
I sincerely doubt that going with the interpretation of my Bishop or Pastor will leave me 300 lbs or in jail. I am so sorry that this is where your gut interpretations would lead you, I will remember you in prayer.
 
40.png
Searching13:
I sincerely doubt that going with the interpretation of my Bishop or Pastor will leave me 300 lbs or in jail. I am so sorry that this is where your gut interpretations would lead you, I will remember you in prayer.
Click to expand...
I think that you are missing the point that your position is not correct.
 
netmil(name removed by moderator):
I wouldn’t sign up for the debate team if I were you.

I guess it is a good time to remember never to “Lay Pearls before Swine…” Matthew 7,6
Click to expand...
My Pastor once addressed this quote—it is not as it would appear. It is addressing the Faith of the “swine” I sincerely doubt the orans position is a matter of Faith, but again you go with your interpretation.

I will follow instruction and go with the interpretation of a competant authentic Catholic teacher.
 
netmil(name removed by moderator):
Nope, not missing the point, ducking the issue.
Click to expand...
I am not ducking any issue. I am answering any statement at face value, and sincerely hope you will do the same.
 
40.png
Searching13:
I am not ducking any issue. I am answering any statement at face value, and sincerely hope you will do the same.
Click to expand...
But not a single question.
I have given references to numerous documents while you have quoted one.
I’m not sure how you are not ducking questions.

Now as for the “Pearls before Swine” quote…From Answers.com
Pearls before swine, Cast not

An adaptation of a saying of Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount. The entire passage reads, “Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.”

The meaning of the passage seems generally to be that the followers of Jesus should pass his message on to those most likely to accept it.
Generally, to “cast pearls before swine” is to share something of value with those who will not appreciate it.

I can see that you have a certain idea in your head and no amount of fact will dispute it.
Therefore the Pearls before Swine reference.
 
Obviously, Searching13 doesn’t get wit. This line of thought is not sarcastic, it is wit.

To wit, the Hyperdictionary defines wit as:

a message whose ingenuity or verbal skill or incongruity has the power to evoke laughter

And it CAN be a laughing matter!!! Many saints used humor to make their point. Even Our Lord was recorded as being witty at times, esp. when the Gospels are analyzed in their original languages. God made us to find joy, and see the humor in things. It’s how most of us get through this life, longing to be in the next one, through humor.

Searching, have you really taken a good look at the message boards here? Have you seen the Clown Mass? Have you read about the priest and his dog who goes to Mass, even the funerals? Have you read about the red, white and blue liturgical dancers at the Fourth of July Mass? Then you might understand. So take a look, if your mind is not so made up.

The second thing is this: You do know the difference between venial and mortal sins. Well, there are venial and mortal liturgical abuses, too. Just as a child taking a poke in anger at a sibling’s upper arm is not the same as premeditated murder for the insurance money, so lifting one’s hands in orans during the Our Father is not the same as allowing a lay person to drone on about the need for female priests when the priest should be giving the homily- or worse, allowing a woman to perform the consecration.

Finally, in private prayer, there is no reason not to use the gestures that, as you say, are doing what you feel is right. That’s between a person and God. In corporate worship, the emphasis is not on what is right to us, but right to God. For that interpretation, we need the guidance of the Church. Why? Christ instituted the Church. He’s the One who said that what the Church, through the Apostles, bound on earth was bound in Heaven.

If you’re profile is accurate, you are not that much older than I- or Netil(name removed by moderator). :yup: Maybe you should take a cybertrip to that article of Joe B.'s.
 
netmil(name removed by moderator):
But not a single question.
I have given references to numerous documents while you have quoted one.
I’m not sure how you are not ducking questions.

Now as for the “Pearls before Swine” quote…From Answers.com
Pearls before swine, Cast not

An adaptation of a saying of Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount. The entire passage reads, “Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.”

The meaning of the passage seems generally to be that the followers of Jesus should pass his message on to those most likely to accept it.
Generally, to “cast pearls before swine” is to share something of value with those who will not appreciate it.

I can see that you have a certain idea in your head and no amount of fact will dispute it.
Therefore the Pearls before Swine reference.
Click to expand...
How about the footnotes from NAB?

“The teaching of the gospel will be rejected by some precisely because it is holy…”

I hardly think this would apply to this discussion. Certainly posture is not to be equated with Scripture. Please let’s not do rediculous comparisons again.
 
40.png
Searching13:
How about the footnotes from NAB?

“The teaching of the gospel will be rejected by some precisely because it is holy…”

I hardly think this would apply to this discussion. Certainly posture is not to be equated with Scripture. Please let’s not do rediculous comparisons again.
Click to expand...
I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
 
40.png
OutinChgoburbs:
You do know the difference between venial and mortal sins. Well, there are venial and mortal liturgical abuses, too. .
Click to expand...
That is very profound!

As for the age thing, 15 years can make tons of difference. Searching is from the era of Kumbaya Catholics and Flower children.

They’re the people that pushed the envelope from the beginning. Some of them still have that attitude.
 
40.png
Adonis33:
That was uncalled for!
Click to expand...
It was simply in response to
I know you’re new so I’ll explain it.
Click to expand...
That’s correct–I am new here, and what a welcome I’ve received. Because you do not agree with what I’ve posted (which means you also disagree with the Priests and Bishops who taught me) incorrect interpretation of scripture is used to try to insult me.

I am not insulted, I will pray for peace and continue searching—elsewhere
Mt 10:13If the house is worthy, let your peace come upon it; if not, let your peace return to you. 6
14 7 Whoever will not receive you or listen to your words–go outside that house or town and shake the dust from your feet.
Click to expand...
I certainly understand you, but I do not agree with your interpretation, and more importantly with the nasty and condescending way in which you present yourselves.
1Cor 13:13
 
40.png
Searching13:
It was simply in response to
" I know you’re new so I’ll explain it."
Click to expand...
WAS it REALLY???

OMG, I have to go shopping for my hubby’s lunch this morning, but I have to say that I’ll be going with a smile!

You have 33 posts. . That means new.
 
netmil(name removed by moderator):
WAS it REALLY???

OMG, I have to go shopping for my hubby’s lunch this morning, but I have to say that I’ll be going with a smile!

You have 33 posts. . That means new.
Click to expand...
Really, I did understand.

Therefore if you have 1199, you’re old 😉
 
Obviously, Searching13 doesn’t get wit. This line of thought is not sarcastic, it is wit.

Well according to your definition of wit…I thought his/her response to “I know you’re new so I’ll explain” was pretty darned funny.

I was kind of thinking of “I know you’re dense, so I’ll use small words.”

I would have responded to that remark with the same wit. I would have meant it too. “REALLY I WOULD.” And it may have been wit but it was definitely SARCASTIC wit. Keep looking it up in the dictionary.

It seems some responses are sarcastic and some are dripping with maple syrup.

That aside, I think this whole argument is retarded. And BTW, as to the priest who takes the dog to church. He is the pastor at the major trad church here in my diocese. He would never have anyone with hands out of proper position in his parish. But he has a dog licking it’s butt on the altar. SO maybe it does need to be specified in the GIRM.

Don’t know how to use all those little smilie things so pretend there’s one attached that drips of wit.
 
40.png
PJR:
I would have responded to that remark with the same wit. I would have meant it too. “REALLY I WOULD.” And it may have been wit but it was definitely SARCASTIC wit. Keep looking it up in the dictionary.

.
Click to expand...
Come on Lady! You’re wittier than that!

Just like with Mysty, this has carried from another thread.
Check out the Pharisees and Rubics thread. We were bantering there.
See…
Searching13
“I am very nice, especially to a senior who loves to hold my hand. So what’s with the seniors who can’t hold hands? (I doubt this would be an issue at a Tridentine or Latin Mass) and what is a tolken???;)” (that was a typo on my part)

This was in answer to the story of the seniors in my old parish who had problems holding hands. She asked me if they were sitting next to Charistmatic Wrestlers. Actually I thought it was pretty funny, but if one opens to sarcasm, one must expect to take what one dishes out.

Earier in this thread, she commented on a post by Dr. Bombay and slammed me because I thought it was funny. Rather than commenting at the time to the poster, she chose to comment to me here. It sounds like a Mysty clone.

Christian charity goes both ways. You can’t dabble in sarcasm and then scream Foul when it doesn’ t go your way.
Or you can, I guess! This is just an internet discussion board.
God Bless
 
netmil(name removed by moderator):
I wouldn’t sign up for the debate team if I were you.

I guess it is a good time to remember never to “Lay Pearls before Swine…” Matthew 7,6
Click to expand...
I am the captain. I’ll play.

First of all, I don’t know how this insolent comment goes unnoticed and someone else gets called on the carpet for snapping back in self defense.

Also claiming that your wisdom is in any way some kind of “pearl” is IMO an unbelievable, presumptuous, and arrogant use of a scripture passage. Do you realize that in the context you use this quote you are in effect calling this person an unworthy swine? A swine not worthy of faith?

And where did this person ever identify him/herself as a Kumbaya hippy? Maybe I missed that post. I’m sure you can correct me. I have seen so many people get run off of this forum if they have a different opinion than a few.

I still think the argument is retarded. I’m poking my sister in the arm now on my smilie.
 
I was approached by a senior yesterday, at the parish, and after some conversation she stated that the “new” (probably less than 33 Masses at this parish) members of the parish “won’t even hold our hands”. Further, she moaned “…this is our community and they should do as we do if they wish to join our community.”

I told her I felt this was not a “community” but rather The Church. Now we have Benedict XVI to lead us out of the 40 years of wandering in the desert of ambiguities after VAT II. Much of this confusion will be straighten out - perhaps at the October Synod.

In the meantime, Mrs Nice Lady, make the Eucharist the center of the Mass, not the fellowship with your neighbor. Save community for the coffee and donuts afterwords. Get to know your neighbor then. Get to know Christ in the Mass.

As for the Orans… If the Our Father is now a prayer said **with **the people, then the Priest should not use the Orans position. It is used when he prays **for **the people. There is a great explanation of this at Catholic Exchange. I will try to post it soon, but I have posted it on other similar threads.

Keep up the good fight netmil(name removed by moderator)
 
Yes I remember that thread. If I recall it went in endless circles about dementia. Talk about not being on the debate team. I felt the insults were flying there as well. No one is allowed to point out a different experience than yours without “well, maybe they did like it, but they were nuts.” The elder you know has arthritis, therefore everyone over the age of 65 no longer holds hands. Her experience was shaded by the poor souls dementia and she was too stupid to figure that out.

You presented yourself as an expert on dementia and diagnosed someone elses experience over the internet. You’re good.

And if you actually meant the response you gave to me about my mother…good grief. I have to admit, it shut me up.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top