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EthoEkei
Guest
I am Orthodox but other than the leniency involved, I do not know many differences among the two. Would someone please discuss the fundamental differences between the two religions religiously and historically?
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Lead_Me_Home
Guest
The bare bones differences that I know are that:
1)We Catholics see the Pope as infallible on doctrine because he is the successor of Peter. The Orthodox do not interpret the Bible this way
2) Catholics have more defined doctrines on Purgatory
3) Catholics believe in the Immaculate Conception of the Blessed Virgen Mary
The Catholic Church and the Orthodox Churches split with the great schism over the Filioque. This is the part of the Creed that says the Holy Spirit process form the Father and the Son. Many Rites within the Catholic Church celebrate the same Liturgies as Orthodox Churches. Most Catholics are Latin Rite which follows a different Liturgy.
- We are the same religion, but different Churches
- We are both the oldest Church(es)
- We both were founded by the apostles
- We both believe in the Eucharist as the Body and Blood of the Lord
1)We Catholics see the Pope as infallible on doctrine because he is the successor of Peter. The Orthodox do not interpret the Bible this way
2) Catholics have more defined doctrines on Purgatory
3) Catholics believe in the Immaculate Conception of the Blessed Virgen Mary
The Catholic Church and the Orthodox Churches split with the great schism over the Filioque. This is the part of the Creed that says the Holy Spirit process form the Father and the Son. Many Rites within the Catholic Church celebrate the same Liturgies as Orthodox Churches. Most Catholics are Latin Rite which follows a different Liturgy.
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Lead_Me_Home
Guest
Catholics also acknowledge the apostolic priesthood of the Orthodox and also the Real Presence of the Orthodox Eucharist, while many Orthodox do not acknowledge the Catholic Eucharist.
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Vico
Guest
The Roman Catholic Church is composed of 23 particular Churches, united by same faith, sacraments, and government, but with a distinct expression of ritual and theology based upon different traditions. The Latin Church and Roman Curia (governing bodies) are what most people think of as Roman Catholic, the other 22 are Eastern Catholic particular Churches. The Roman Curia is common to all. All the particular churches accept the authority of the Patriarch of Rome (The Pope) as the Vicar of Christ. This may be the greatest difference between Orthodox and Catholic, but there are also important differences in faith.
Converts from the Orthodox Churches, Oriental Orthodox Churches, and Assyrian Church of the East form most of the particular Churches, which mostly occurred after 1550. If you compare the Eastern Catholic particular Churches to Orthodox, they will sometimes be very similar, and other times not, due to various changes to the original customs.
In the early years the Church held seven ecumenical councils which determined the basic Catholic faith.
Nestorian:
1 Nicaea I (325)
2 Constantinople I (381)
Pre-Chalcedonian:
3 Ephesus (431)
Byzantine:
4 Chalcedon (451)
5 Constantinople II (553)
6 Constantinople III (680–681)
7 Nicaea II (787)
After this, the Greek Catholic Church (Constantinople) and the Roman Catholic Church were unable to agree and eventually an official split occurred (Roman Catholic and Orthodox). Then various attempts were made to unite after that until the Council of Florence (1431-1439) when a union was established, only to be rejected by the Orthodox Churches.
Converts from the Orthodox Churches, Oriental Orthodox Churches, and Assyrian Church of the East form most of the particular Churches, which mostly occurred after 1550. If you compare the Eastern Catholic particular Churches to Orthodox, they will sometimes be very similar, and other times not, due to various changes to the original customs.
In the early years the Church held seven ecumenical councils which determined the basic Catholic faith.
Nestorian:
1 Nicaea I (325)
2 Constantinople I (381)
Pre-Chalcedonian:
3 Ephesus (431)
Byzantine:
4 Chalcedon (451)
5 Constantinople II (553)
6 Constantinople III (680–681)
7 Nicaea II (787)
After this, the Greek Catholic Church (Constantinople) and the Roman Catholic Church were unable to agree and eventually an official split occurred (Roman Catholic and Orthodox). Then various attempts were made to unite after that until the Council of Florence (1431-1439) when a union was established, only to be rejected by the Orthodox Churches.
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SyroMalankara
Guest
I agree with most of what you wrote except for the first sentence.
The Catholic Church is composed of 23 particular Churches, united by same faith, sacraments, but with a distinct expression of ritual and theology based upon different traditions. The various Churches, while equal in dignity and honor, have differing forms of government, hierarchies, and structures, while in full Communion with each other and the Pope of Rome.
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Vico
Guest
Yes, I agree with that for each particular church. Yet, upper government is shared:
The Roman Pontiff, Synod of Bishops, College of Cardinals, College of Bishops, Secretariat of State, and Roman Curia with Congretations, Tribunals, Pontifical Councils, Offices, and Agencies.
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Volodymyr
Guest
So the difference is that the Orthodox church is very sure about holiness from Christ of Mysteries of her own priests and bishops - and does not condemn or extol rites of other religions. Catholic Church feels obliged always to comment on other religions and their rites - which to condemn and which to praise according to Catholic own view.
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Vico
Guest
We are considering the following autocephalous churches (no higher ranking bishop):
Catholic Patriarch: Rome
Orthodox Patriarchs: Constantinople, Alexandria, Antioch, Jerusalem, Russia, Serbia, Romania, Bulgaria, Georgia, Cyprus, Greece, Poland, Albania, Czech & Slovakia.
So, do you mean the statements of these Patriarchs?
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Volodymyr
Guest
You do not understand difference between Patriarchate and autocephalous church. There is no patriarch of Greece, Cyprus, Poland, Albania, Czech Lands and Slovakia. but such are autocephalous churches. Also there is a patriarch of Moskow and all Rus’ but not Patriarch of Rossia. Also Orthodox of America is autocephalous church,
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Volodymyr
Guest
This statement is hard to understand - a union is not established if it is rejected by one side. Perhaps this attempt at union might have been effective if the Latin church members had come to help of Constantinople when Byzantia attacked finally by Turks in 1454. Pope was willing to send 200 soldiers with so-called Cardinal Isador to “defend city.” Isador himself had to escape from Rus’ after being arrested for attempting union by abandoning Orthodoxy. Union will come when Latin church returns to Orthodoxy - not when Orthodox are forced to kiss the foot of Bishop of Rome.
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Vico
Guest
Yes, that is true, the union did not happen. It was opposed by only one, Mark of Ephesus, and later by the people.
I think it is the hand not foot.
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Vico
Guest
Alright, then considering the following autocephalous churches.
Catholic: Rome
Orthodox: Constantinople, Alexandria, Antioch, Jerusalem, Russia, Serbia, Romania, Bulgaria, Georgia, Cyprus, Greece, Poland, Albania, Czech & Slovakia, OCA.
So, do you mean the statements of the highest Bishop or Hierarch of these Churches?
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Volodymyr
Guest
No - Bishop of Rome is making a Melkite (so-called Greko Catolic patriarch) kiss is foot: ** Patriarch Gregory Joseph was taken to see Pius IX, and was thrown on his knees in order to kiss the Pope’s foot.**
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Dan-Man916
Guest
Statements like this demonstrate the primary reason why unity is a long long way off.
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Vico
Guest
I think that unity on the basis of common faith with Rome in position of honor only, which is what Orthodoxy demands, will not be possible. Even if it was an issue of faith only, there are about 250 Catholic de fide dogmas. There have been many objections by Orthodox, including papal primacy, purgatory, indulgences, divine attributes identical to divine essence, papal infallability ex cathedra, immaculate conception, assumption, hypostatic procession with two internal processions and one spiration, whole Christ present in each species (bread, wine).
Interestingly, there are only two theological issues, that I could identify, mentioned in the 33 Articles concerning the Union of Brest (1595) which resulted in the creation of some Eastern Catholic churches from Orthodox living in Poland (today Belorussia and Ukraine).
“1. Since there is a quarrel between the Romans and Greeks about the procession of the Holy Spirit, which greatly impede unity really for no other reason than that we do not wish to understand one another - we ask that we should not be compelled to any other creed but that we should remain with that which was handed down to us in the Holy Scriptures, in the Gospel, and in the writings of the holy Greek Doctors, that is, that the Holy Spirit proceeds, not from two sources and not by a double procession, but from one origin, from the Father through the Son.”
“5. We shall not debate about purgatory, but we entrust ourselves to the teaching of the Holy Church.”
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aspirant
Guest
I’d like to read more about this. Can you provide a good source?
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Vico
Guest
Володимир, не хочете відповідати моє питання 12?
So, do you mean the statements of the highest Bishop or Hierarch of these Churches?
If you do I will comment on your statement:
“So the difference is that the Orthodox church is very sure about holiness from Christ of Mysteries of her own priests and bishops - and does not condemn or extol rites of other religions. Catholic Church feels obliged always to comment on other religions and their rites - which to condemn and which to praise according to Catholic own view.”
So, do you mean the statements of the highest Bishop or Hierarch of these Churches?
If you do I will comment on your statement:
“So the difference is that the Orthodox church is very sure about holiness from Christ of Mysteries of her own priests and bishops - and does not condemn or extol rites of other religions. Catholic Church feels obliged always to comment on other religions and their rites - which to condemn and which to praise according to Catholic own view.”
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marlo
Guest
the difference of Orthodox vs Catholic is that the catholics are energetic and hopeful of the reunion, and willing to preserve the liturgical traditions of the Orthodox, while the Orthodox want the catholic church to abandon its latin tradition and became byzantine in order to be united.
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Hesychios
Guest
codswallop
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Hesychios
Guest
I don’t think there will be an account of it specifically uploaded at %between%the Sancta Sedes website, or at EWTN
There are a few Melkites around here who can probably give the details if this is in fact true and not a myth or malicious lie.I don’t have a link for you, and I do not recall the part about being thrown to the floor, but it is said he was in a position suitable for kissing the foot when the other foot (supposedly) found it’s way around (somehow) to the back of the patriarch’s head.
True or not, intentionally or not, it’s hard to say.
It is commonly known that the Melkites had always opposed the beatification or canonization of Pio Nono. Of course, Pope John Paul II basically discounted or ignored these objections and beatified him anyway.
If the story is true, it may be recorded in some formal documents filed by the Melkite Catholic church relating to the cause of Pius IX.
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